My down-the-runway neighbors were frequent contributors to this platform: reports on various aircraft and had many 'cover' stories (HyperBipe and Nugget, to name a few!). Haven't talked to them since The Demise....
Huge loss to the E/AB community.
Van's Air Force
The definitive Van's Aircraft support community! Buying, building or flying an RV? Join our exclusive family of mentors and enthusiasts!
Kitplanes Magazine
- Thread starter AlphaCharlieBravo
- Start date
Huge loss to the E/AB community.
That makes my brain hurt. AI scanning for AI. So is there a new Editor or is that person AI generated?
I hate AI. Gives me Matrix heebee jeebees.
Since this conversation has focused on AI, I don't think my recent experience is too much of a thread drift. It was an interesting contrast in "bad" vs "good" AI.
Just as a lark, I typed "what is the correct cotter pin to use with an AN3 bolt?" into the google search line. As often happens with google searches, the first posting was an AI-generated summary paragraph. In it, it said that the correct cotter pin was a 3/32 diameter. Well, that is obviously wrong, since the drilled hole in an AN3 bolt is 0.070" diameter, so a 3/32 cotter pin would not fit. This test pretty much reinforced all my prejudices about AI.
I mentioned this story at our monthly poker game, and one of the other players mentioned Grok. He pulled out his phone, and we put it to the test. I asked Grok three questions, and it got all three right.
The first question was a repeat of the cotter pin question. Grok correctly said, "a 1/16 cotter pin such as a MS24665-132."
Wow! I was really impressed. Stunned, in fact.
Then I asked Grok what the correct mixing ratio was for Rhino 1307LV epoxy (the epoxy we most routinely use in our shop). Grok correctly replied, "use 4:1 by volume or 100:22" by weight." We use 100:23, but close enough. I'm even more impressed.
So lastly, I asked Grok, "What is the answer to life, the universe, and everything?" Grok wasted no time in coming right back with the correct answer, "42."
So, I don't know - clearly AI is getting better. I'm wondering when it will be good enough that auto-correct actually works on our phones.
Just as a lark, I typed "what is the correct cotter pin to use with an AN3 bolt?" into the google search line. As often happens with google searches, the first posting was an AI-generated summary paragraph. In it, it said that the correct cotter pin was a 3/32 diameter. Well, that is obviously wrong, since the drilled hole in an AN3 bolt is 0.070" diameter, so a 3/32 cotter pin would not fit. This test pretty much reinforced all my prejudices about AI.
I mentioned this story at our monthly poker game, and one of the other players mentioned Grok. He pulled out his phone, and we put it to the test. I asked Grok three questions, and it got all three right.
The first question was a repeat of the cotter pin question. Grok correctly said, "a 1/16 cotter pin such as a MS24665-132."
Wow! I was really impressed. Stunned, in fact.
Then I asked Grok what the correct mixing ratio was for Rhino 1307LV epoxy (the epoxy we most routinely use in our shop). Grok correctly replied, "use 4:1 by volume or 100:22" by weight." We use 100:23, but close enough. I'm even more impressed.
So lastly, I asked Grok, "What is the answer to life, the universe, and everything?" Grok wasted no time in coming right back with the correct answer, "42."
So, I don't know - clearly AI is getting better. I'm wondering when it will be good enough that auto-correct actually works on our phones.
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
I still get the KitPlanes weekly newsblurb in my inbox and I looked at a couple of the articles by the "new editor". It is hard to imagine the following article coming out of anything other than an AI generator:
www.kitplanes.com
What a waste of electrons........and this appears to be on the mindless level of the other articles I saw. It is sad to see this publication degenerate to this level.
Builder Demographics Evolve as Participation Patterns Shift - KITPLANES
Participation in homebuilding remains strong, but the way people engage with the process is evolving, and so is the character of the community.
www.kitplanes.com
What a waste of electrons........and this appears to be on the mindless level of the other articles I saw. It is sad to see this publication degenerate to this level.
I still get the KitPlanes weekly newsblurb in my inbox and I looked at a couple of the articles by the "new editor". It is hard to imagine the following article coming out of anything other than an AI generator:
Builder Demographics Evolve as Participation Patterns Shift - KITPLANES
Participation in homebuilding remains strong, but the way people engage with the process is evolving, and so is the character of the community.
What a waste of electrons........and this appears to be on the mindless level of the other articles I saw. It is sad to see this publication degenerate to this level.
I was really annoyed by the paragraph about “Turnkey kits” where the AI says (yes, I ran this through an AI detector,and it was 100% written by AI…..):
“ Turnkey kits, too, are gaining respect. Purists may grumble about the meaning of “amateur-built,” but the definition has always been flexible. If the FAA is satisfied that the builder is meaningfully involved, the methods are fair game.
Well this particular “FAA Representative” (DAR) has to be more than satisfied that the builder was “meaningfully involved” to issue an AWC….. I’m certainly not going to let the AI decide how the rules should be interpreted!
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
The entire excerpt is non-sensical mumbo jumbo..................
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Completely agree. The "enpoopification" of everything strikes again.
Sam,I still get the KitPlanes weekly newsblurb in my inbox and I looked at a couple of the articles by the "new editor". It is hard to imagine the following article coming out of anything other than an AI generator:
Builder Demographics Evolve as Participation Patterns Shift - KITPLANES
Participation in homebuilding remains strong, but the way people engage with the process is evolving, and so is the character of the community.
What a waste of electrons........and this appears to be on the mindless level of the other articles I saw. It is sad to see this publication degenerate to this level.
I totally agree. I've noticed that since "the purge", the weekly emails I get from Kitplanes contain only links to old articles & 2 short articles written by the new editor. They auto billed me for my renewal a few days ago. 225% price increase with no October issue released. I just canceled via email. I'll report on how long it takes to get reimbursed. My email below:
Sirs/Ladies,
Please cancel my subscription to Kitplanes magazine. I am cancelling because:
1 Massive price increase from $20 to $45
2 No option for PDF only subscription
3 No October 2025 issue
4 All your old staff have left
TIA
Charles Kuss
Steve,
I recently had my first conversation with "Eve" [Grok] in my flying buddy's Tesla while driving to the airport. Quite knowledgeable, but the thing I really noticed was that "she" would ask questions of me. I told my friend, "do you realize "she" is interviewing you during every conversation?" Grok wants to learn about the user, to tailor responses [and to mine you for personal data]. Now all we need is Cyberdyne Systems Inc.
Their latest article may give an indication of where they want to take the site - partnering with retail vendors and pushing gear. AI is pretty good at that. If you can't write articles, then just fill up the rest of pages with ads.
https://avweb.com/affiliate-content/aviation-headsets-sale-amazon-prime-days/
https://avweb.com/affiliate-content/aviation-headsets-sale-amazon-prime-days/
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
Look what you get when you truncate the above link to just:
Affiliate Content - AVweb
avweb.com
KitPlanes is now a shopping channel................
Well isn't that about the same route Flying went several years ago?Look what you get when you truncate the above link to just:
Affiliate Content - AVweb
KitPlanes is now a shopping channel................
Wait till you find out who owns Flying Magazine!
That explains a lot.
Good luck with that. I tried the same back in August, and just got auto-renewed a couple of days ago.
I placed another call to fireclown and they assure me it will be refunded and auto-renew cancelled.... We'll see, then CC dispute to follow.
Apparently the original plan was to use the media platforms to funnel rich people to “The Fields” to build a rich person utopiate community. From what I hear, initial lot deposits were great but the county wouldn't/couldn't provide the infrastructure to support the glossy brochures and wouldn't issue building permits. Nothing broke ground and the acreage is said to be abandoned and for sale.
The media platforms got diverted to alternates with bingo fuel.
Check old issues for the two page glossy ads for “The Fields” that we all had at the time before they just stopped.
The Fields was just one of the planned media-monopoly revenue streams. For example, Flying also supports Flying Finance, a loan brokerage. Astronomy feeds The Space Store, a bricks and mortar storefront next to the Firecrown office, as well as a web portal. And so on. Each is an independent business subject to expansion or closure.
The real money is probably in advertorial content...advertising disguised as an article. To double down on revenue, just insert links to other advertisers. For example, check out this useful "article". Or this purchase opportunity.
BTW, check out the new lead paragraph here: https://firecrown.com/
It's a new world folks. Fuller may be right. We'll see.
From the Chattanooga Times. "...banks lost their appetite for high end residential projects." The lenders got nervous.
When AI evolves to the point that VAF stops autocorrecting "Longeron" to "Longhorn" then we'll know we've truly been surpassed. Until then, humans still have the upper hand.
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
The same model is now prevalent in other forms of "journalism", for instance the "product reviews" on CNN and other media websites that are obviously paid redirects to advertisers. But we have always fiercely defended out free market system as the financial world in which we wish to live, and we shouldn't be surprised when innovative forces drive commerce in previously unknown ways. We just have to recognize the media landscape is rapidly changing, AI being the latest motivator.
The KitPlanes we knew all these years is gone and is not coming back due to current market forces. So we just move on to other avenues of knowledge sharing, VAF being one such option.
When there's an email from Kitplanes, and you open it and it's an ad for financing...
Well, when a new owner's first action is to change the font and color of the logo, you know your in trouble. This always indicates the new owner has no knowledge of the business. The goal is to polish up the image, "right size" by layoffs and try to sell the business to someone else for a profit while adding nothing to the the business. Have been missing Kit planes, the best mag out there. Its like a monthly meeting with old friends who understand what you are doing. Hope it can be saved somehow.
Not sure which side I should be on.
I'm a builder and a UT grad?
Longeron vs Longhorn
Actually despise AI. Just tell it "I'm a liar." "That last statement was a lie".
So, the October/November issue of Kitplanes arrived in my mailbox a few days ago. The masthead lists a new editor in chief and art director, and about half of the contributing editors as the September issue. Vic Syracuse is no longer listed as a contributing editor.
briand
Well Known Member
He can be found here:
avbrief.com
AvBrief Media Expands With The Experimental Aviator - AvBrief.com
New weekly newsletter features articles written by the top experts in the Experimental/Amateur-Built world.
avbrief.com
Several are there only because they didn't yet formally resign or get canned.
Scott,
4 days after my email, I got a reply asking me to reconsider my cancellation. Of the 4 points I had made, the only one they responded to was that the October issue would come out at the same time as [note implying it's still a separate issue] the November issue. Basically, their reply was simply a stall tactic. After 12 days, I finally got my money back. Fireclown is right!!!
AvBrief Media Expands With The Experimental Aviator - AvBrief.com
New weekly newsletter features articles written by the top experts in the Experimental/Amateur-Built world.
Yes, we’re getting the band back together - informally, because anyone can contribute whenever they want, free from the taskmaster of monthly publication deadlines! Russ has created a nice place for Experimental Aviation writers to publish their tips, stuff, and musings as they come up with them. Or… any of us can take time off (a little or a lot) and come back with new material whenever we want. It’s really a garage jam session for writers!
And you won’t find reviews of Aeronca Chiefs (a nice airplane of course, but hardly E-AB…..) in the Experimental Aviator!
I was taken aback by how few pages this edition had. I have subscribed to Plane and Pilot for many years also. I have watched that magazine go down in quality for quite a while. I didn’t think a publisher could get fewer content than that. I see now it is possible.
Da(&*(&^^%(^)()()!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Life got busy but I had a sneaking suspicion this was going on, Googl'd "Kitplanes going under" a few minutes ago and this thread was at the top of the list, unfortunately.
Hopefully the Mods will leave this up since I had 2 general interest and 1 technical articles published in Kitplanes. I got this hat from Paul Dye himself at Sun n' Fun a few years ago, now it'll go on the "treasured items" shelf in my hangar. Even though I'm not a RV guy I've been building my SeaRey for about 15 years now, and Kitplanes was the only magazine I immediately stopped to read when it came.
Tenley: I've also loved reading about your progress, instead of submitting to an entity you should consider becoming (holds nose) an "influencer" and start your own website/blog (please don't use FB), ask for people to kick in if they enjoy the site but leave it free otherwise. Partner up with WIA, etc., but stay independent and do your own thing on your own schedule. And if people donate too much you pay it forward to YE or WIA or....
Life got busy but I had a sneaking suspicion this was going on, Googl'd "Kitplanes going under" a few minutes ago and this thread was at the top of the list, unfortunately.
Hopefully the Mods will leave this up since I had 2 general interest and 1 technical articles published in Kitplanes. I got this hat from Paul Dye himself at Sun n' Fun a few years ago, now it'll go on the "treasured items" shelf in my hangar. Even though I'm not a RV guy I've been building my SeaRey for about 15 years now, and Kitplanes was the only magazine I immediately stopped to read when it came.
Tenley: I've also loved reading about your progress, instead of submitting to an entity you should consider becoming (holds nose) an "influencer" and start your own website/blog (please don't use FB), ask for people to kick in if they enjoy the site but leave it free otherwise. Partner up with WIA, etc., but stay independent and do your own thing on your own schedule. And if people donate too much you pay it forward to YE or WIA or....
Attachments
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Steve, when is that SeaRey gonna fly? --(Your nearby hangar neighbor)
Wednesday.
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Tried to cancel my subscription this morning, got a very polite operator who told me that since I had renewed with a 3rd party I would have to contact them and they would not issue me a refund.
Every year at SnF I renewed at the Kitplanes booth itself. Oh well.....
Every year at SnF I renewed at the Kitplanes booth itself. Oh well.....
Yep, the old owners who you renewed with are now "The Third Party".
Actually, no - while the “Kitplanes” booth at Airventure was sanctioned by the longtime owners (Belvoir) of KP, Consumer, Avweb, etc., they were actually an independent contractor, and had been for at least two generations. Great folks! But the new owners (Firecrown) have absolutely no idea how anything was done at any of the former-Belvoir publication, don’t care, and can’t figure it out.
Just tried to access the PDF back issues. There is no longer a link for that. And it looks like they're curating the digital magazine through a new online app. I see the last three months' issues available and that's it.
I guess I'll have to rely on their "Search" function to look for particular articles. That has always been pretty hit and miss in the past, like looking for a needle in a haystack. I'm guessing it's not going to get any better. :-(
I guess I'll have to rely on their "Search" function to look for particular articles. That has always been pretty hit and miss in the past, like looking for a needle in a haystack. I'm guessing it's not going to get any better. :-(
I just received an email from Firecrown today asking for the name and address of the subscriber (me) to send a check. Will update if it comes.
They lost another subscriber here. As other's have mentioned, I normally renewed at Oshkosh but didn't attend this year. Have gotten a couple of renewal notices in the mail, but after looking at the last issue I received, totally disappointed. The entire issue is hard to read/follow, more like reading a tech manual in the military. I assume this is due to the afore mentioned AI article structuring.
I've got issues all the way back to around the time the magazine started. What a terrible lose of a once great magazine. Sad demise. Capitalism at its finest...NOT!!
I've got issues all the way back to around the time the magazine started. What a terrible lose of a once great magazine. Sad demise. Capitalism at its finest...NOT!!
Two days ago, I received the weekly Kitplanes email, containing a mix of old and new articles.
One of the articles was by Kelly Keller, talking about strategy for the various Firecrown-owned magazines (Flying, Plane & Pilot, Kitplanes).
In the comments section, I submitted the following, which apparently did not pass moderation and was not posted, despite the fact that other comments on the same date were posted.
I thought the refusal to post and the associated lack of response was illuminating. You may or may not think the same.
Here is the comment I posted:
One of the articles was by Kelly Keller, talking about strategy for the various Firecrown-owned magazines (Flying, Plane & Pilot, Kitplanes).
In the comments section, I submitted the following, which apparently did not pass moderation and was not posted, despite the fact that other comments on the same date were posted.
I thought the refusal to post and the associated lack of response was illuminating. You may or may not think the same.
Here is the comment I posted:
Yeah - advertising -I automatically trash these unless it says new issue. That will go away when it expires. So sad, I loved to research past issues, but no longer found or searchable. AVBrief is my new link to the experimental world. Besides VAF of course.
Wait till you find out where all the content used to generate "AI" (LLM) output comes from! It's plagiarism all the way down...
Here’s a page from the December issue…apparently, they don’t yet know how to use AI to proof-read…or they expect all of us to know Latin…. (Read the photo caption…I dare you….)
Looks like a variation of Lorem Ipsum used as a placeholder by their editing software: https://loremipsum.io/
Lazy not to have run a simple spell check, let alone dedicate time to proofread. I would be embarrassed to be affiliated with the publication now.
O tempora, O mores!
I read a couple of the sentences I could see.
I won’t be resubscribing.
“Increasing the altitude of the fuselage”
I think Kitplanes is not unique. I went to a local national bookstore chain, perused the wall of magazines. One whole section was no longer there and perhaps 1/3rd were manga or funny asian comic like. Of what remained, some had strange titles like "How to use Chat GPT as your personal assistant".
The Grit was a nationwide small town newspaper that eventually became a magazine with greatly diminished circulation.
Time Magazine used to offer us a lifetime subscription. Circulation is maybe 1/3rd of what it was in 2012.
Adapt or Die!
I hope that those with something meaningful to say adapt, offer info in new manners, and continue to bring value worth paying for.
The Grit was a nationwide small town newspaper that eventually became a magazine with greatly diminished circulation.
Time Magazine used to offer us a lifetime subscription. Circulation is maybe 1/3rd of what it was in 2012.
Adapt or Die!
I hope that those with something meaningful to say adapt, offer info in new manners, and continue to bring value worth paying for.
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Lufthans
Well Known Member
I received this one from Kitplanes a few days ago:
"Dear Hans: Due to ongoing global delivery challenges for Canada and International print copies, we are unable to guarantee reliable postal delivery of print issues from October 2025 and any future issues. Going forward, all Canada and International subscriptions will be fulfilled in a digital-only format to ensure consistent and timely access to content. If you formerly received the print edition, we have extended your current subscription to a digital term based on the remaining amount of additional postage and shipping you paid. Digital subscriptions and renewals are still available for purchase in these regions. We appreciate your understanding, and if you have any questions we look forward to resolving it for you by contacting [email protected]"
Interesting....
"Dear Hans: Due to ongoing global delivery challenges for Canada and International print copies, we are unable to guarantee reliable postal delivery of print issues from October 2025 and any future issues. Going forward, all Canada and International subscriptions will be fulfilled in a digital-only format to ensure consistent and timely access to content. If you formerly received the print edition, we have extended your current subscription to a digital term based on the remaining amount of additional postage and shipping you paid. Digital subscriptions and renewals are still available for purchase in these regions. We appreciate your understanding, and if you have any questions we look forward to resolving it for you by contacting [email protected]"
Interesting....
I took a brief look at the current issue. Lots of verbiage that indicated that the author (mostly the editor in chief) didn't know what he was talking about. How sad.
I remember good times years ago when I wrote pilot reports for them...
I remember good times years ago when I wrote pilot reports for them...
