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Van's Aircraft RV-15 Update -

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From the EAA website. Homebuilders Week online seminars. RV-15 update at 7pm CST tonight, Jan 26th.

Rian Johnson and Marc Cook from Van's Aircraft will review everything about the RV-15, the company's newest total performance aircraft. Designed as a STOL-capable, backcountry aircraft the RV way, with exceptional handling and cruise capability. They will update us on the status of kit production, shipping timelines, and a detailed discussion of the technical aspects of the RV-15.
 
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Do these seminars get captured for later publication on YouTube? I'd love to watch, but that pesky 4-letter word (work) gets in the way!
 
dbhill916 said:
Do these seminars get captured for later publication on YouTube? I'd love to watch, but that pesky 4-letter word (work) gets in the way!
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Yes - they get archived by EAA and you can watch them (if you are an EAA member) once they get posted (which can sometimes take a few days or weeks).
 
Did anyone catch Rian's comment about the optional? step in Section 21 regarding if the airplane will be on floats? I can't seem to find anything in the Section 21 KAIs. Awesome update on the RV-15, especially the news about the tail!
 
jollygreenpilot said:
Did anyone catch Rian's comment about the optional? step in Section 21 regarding if the airplane will be on floats? I can't seem to find anything in the Section 21 KAIs. Awesome update on the RV-15, especially the news about the tail!
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The new tail sound good. I'm also excited about the option for a BRS.
 
Good presentation.

Cliff notes in no particular order for those who were not able to watch it:

No pitch trim tab. Instead, it will be a trimmable HS with two chain driven jack screws. Full elevator movement no matter where the HS is at. One Jack screw can carry the entire load if the other fails.

HS will have a shorter span and a shorter chord than the airplane had at OSH. Tail kits available to order late February with deliveries starting in April.

HS leading edges come pre dimpled for screws for easy replacement/repair in case of damage.

Fuselage and firewall forward kits available to order in August.

Finish kits available to order in November.

No appreciable gain from droop wing tips so they will be Hoerner style. Ship out with tail kits if wings were ordered.

Fuselage will have provisions for an optional BRS.

8" tires will likely be the standard. Flying with 26" tires lowers the cruise speed from 140 kts to 125 kts. The only time you'd need those bigger tires would be for landing on very rough river banks. The gear design gives you the effect of having 5" greater size tires. You can land pretty much anywhere with those. If you did go with bigger tires you'd need bigger brakes. However, no stall speed published yet. They don't want people getting bigger brakes and parking this airplane on its nose.

Float fittings are a definite. Other manufacturer floats to start with but Vans wants to come out with their own float kit.

Lift points built into the forward fuselage for changing from wheels to floats and vice versa.

Ground handling handles/bars are still being designed into the fuselage.

Fuel selector will have L, R and Both. Both only to be used on the ground to balance both tanks if wanted. 1 gallon L&R header tank ensures plenty of fuel for an extended slip. It will also have an electric fuel pump that self circulates with no return line to the tank.

Parking brake will be standard with the kit.

Vans designed/manufactured brakes standard, Beringer will be an option.

If you can fly a Cub or are proficient in any other tail dragger they don't think any transition training will be necessary.

That's it. They said the recorded presentation would be available "later" on EAA.org.
 
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jollygreenpilot said:
Did anyone catch Rian's comment about the optional? step in Section 21 regarding if the airplane will be on floats? I can't seem to find anything in the Section 21 KAIs. Awesome update on the RV-15, especially the news about the tail!
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Yeah, I don’t know what he was referring to in section 21. That’s fuel level sensor and sealing top access covers after cleaning.
 
Vans really needs to decide how they want to communicate new RV15 information. EAA, VAF, Emails, Posting on websites, etc - publish it, and stick to it. I am feeling like it is 2007 again . . . stumbling and chasing relevant RV15 specific information (as a builder) from multiple (seemingly random) sources. I can accept changes and improvements - that is expected, but please get an organized plan.
 
I have wing kit ordered # 125. I have a few questions.

- I built an RV-14 from 2020 to 2021. The 14 had been out several years and kit was very refined. When the 14 came out initially was it like the 15 where kits are sold with the rest of the kits not fully designed or did it get released as a full plane?

- Last night I didn't hear if it was mentioned how many RV-15 wing kits have been ordered. What do we think the highest serial number is currently?

- Frankly I think it's great to be involved so early on. Its exciting. I believe Van's is giving this scratch built design a lot of thought. I think it is going to have many unique features. I understand that I am an early adopter and expect the process to be a bit random and have less support, at least from other builders, than I had with the RV-14.

I can't wait to get started.
 
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I would like to know how many have sold as well. We will have #155.
It would be helpful if those posting will all include their serial number in their post or signature.
 
BillL said:
Vans really needs to decide how they want to communicate new RV15 information. EAA, VAF, Emails, Posting on websites, etc - publish it, and stick to it. I am feeling like it is 2007 again . . . stumbling and chasing relevant RV15 specific information (as a builder) from multiple (seemingly random) sources. I can accept changes and improvements - that is expected, but please get an organized plan.
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Well, it is my observation that you can't go wrong by diligently following VAF. It is all here, although not on one page and sometimes it may direct you to factory websites for detailed information or EAA webinars.
 
Jetmart said:
I have wing kit ordered # 125. I have a few questions.

- I built an RV-14 from 2020 to 2021. The 14 had been out several years and kit was very refined. When the 14 came out initially was it like the 15 where kits are sold with the rest of the kits not designed or did it get released as a full plane?

- Last night I didn't hear if it was mentioned how many RV-15 wing kits have been ordered. What do we think the highest serial number is currently?

- Frankly I think it's great to be involved so early on. Its exciting. I believe Van's is giving this scratch built design a lot of thought. I think it is going to have many unique features. I understand that I am an early adopter and expect the process to be a bit random and have less support, at least from other builders, than I had with the RV-14.

I can't wait to get started.
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I don't know if the -14 was released with all kits available but the lead up to release was totally different. Van's kept its development completely secret with no seminars for user input and no opportunity for us to follow the development. When it showed up at AirVenture, it was fully formed and a shock even to close followers of the RV line.
 
BillL said:
Vans really needs to decide how they want to communicate new RV15 information. EAA, VAF, Emails, Posting on websites, etc - publish it, and stick to it. I am feeling like it is 2007 again . . . stumbling and chasing relevant RV15 specific information (as a builder) from multiple (seemingly random) sources. I can accept changes and improvements - that is expected, but please get an organized plan.
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I agree, as a customer I would appreciate being informed via there website or an email and not having to hunt the web for relevant information.
 
Jetmart said:
I have wing kit ordered # 125. I have a few questions.

- I built an RV-14 from 2020 to 2021. The 14 had been out several years and kit was very refined. When the 14 came out initially was it like the 15 where kits are sold with the rest of the kits not fully designed or did it get released as a full plane?

- Last night I didn't hear if it was mentioned how many RV-15 wing kits have been ordered. What do we think the highest serial number is currently?

- Frankly I think it's great to be involved so early on. Its exciting. I believe Van's is giving this scratch built design a lot of thought. I think it is going to have many unique features. I understand that I am an early adopter and expect the process to be a bit random and have less support, at least from other builders, than I had with the RV-14.
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The RV-14 rolled out pretty much in the same way that we're seeing now. My former neighbor across the taxiway built one of the first 14As, and was left waiting for weeks on end for the next kit or missing parts. But in the end he has (had, now sold) a beautiful plane.
 
Jetmart said:
I have wing kit ordered # 125. I have a few questions.
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Hey 125, this is 127. I’m hoping being a little deeper in the queue means fewer missed/wrong parts as they debug process.

It would be nice if they had a “units shipped “ ticker running on the -15 page.

Given the number of kits already on order and the fact that this many are jumping in with the higher cost wing kit, I expect Vans is both stunned and a bit overwhelmed. It’s likely the shift to empennage kits will slow down wing kit orders until they catch up.
 
Alphalpha said:
Hey 125, this is 127. I’m hoping being a little deeper in the queue means fewer missed/wrong parts as they debug process.

It would be nice if they had a “units shipped “ ticker running on the -15 page.

Given the number of kits already on order and the fact that this many are jumping in with the higher cost wing kit, I expect Vans is both stunned and a bit overwhelmed. It’s likely the shift to empennage kits will slow down wing kit orders until they catch up.
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Don't you think that's somewhat unfounded fear-mongering? We have no way of knowing how many people will be ready financially to spring for another kit right away, nor how streamlined their process will be. After final checking, we're only missing a handful of parts and I do think it was an accident based on the FL vs. W naming convention, which is a pretty honest mistake given they were working hard to meet a deadline they imposed on themseIves. I think in the absence of information, many people are jumping to conclusions about a lot of things that have turned out to be much ado about not much.
 
543TB said:
Don't you think that's somewhat unfounded fear-mongering? We have no way of knowing how many people will be ready financially to spring for another kit right away, nor how streamlined their process will be. After final checking, we're only missing a handful of parts and I do think it was an accident based on the FL vs. W naming convention, which is a pretty honest mistake given they were working hard to meet a deadline they imposed on themseIves. I think in the absence of information, many people are jumping to conclusions about a lot of things that have turned out to be much ado about not much.
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Yes, I looked at most of my missing parts and they are almost balanced by the extra parts I received. Definitely an easy mistake to make, especially if trying to work fast.

On a separate note, a couple of us have actually checked the CR3213-4-3 CherryMax rivets that were sent with our kits and found then to actually be incorrect. I believe they sent CR3212-4-3 which is a flush head rivet instead of the CR3213-4-3 which is a universal head rivet.

Obviously, the flush head version will not work but more importantly, you need to actually CHECK those particular rivets to make sure they are correct instead of just counting them.
 
Thanks for the catch on the rivets. I went back to bin 1 and sure enough - I had 77 CR3212-4-3 and ONE CR3213-4-3. I took a photo that I am going to forward to Van’s with my missing parts list.
 

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I dare to predict some wait until the skies are obscured by hoards of -15s...

Wait for the kits, wait for the BOs, maybe wait for one's personal funds, and wait... for the aircraft to be designed?
I wonder, is that the first Van's stable model being sold prior being fully designed (not talking about improvements here)?
The resources Van's presently uses must be enormous, and that will be an expensive exercise.

I must be getting super old fast as times have changed, as I recall folks having built very non-quick built RV-4s in the eighties... in a matter of months.

The -15 definitely is, and certainly will continue to be, a fascinating development.
 
tow_dog said:
Second the thanks; I too now know that I have 78 flush head CR3212-4-3s..
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Yep, all 78 are flush head.

Okay, so this could be an actual problem, seeing as every single supplier appears to be out - Occam's razor suggests that Van's didn't realize they had a supply of the incorrect ones, but there isn't much they can do about it unless they also have a big supply of the correct CR3213s.

Looking at the KIA, though, it doesn't really appear that there is a reason the Inboard Mixer Box couldn't be assembled in situ after the tank is attached to the spar, as long as you put the nut plates in first and use standard rivets to make the spar connection. Then use the called for LP4-3s to attach the ribs using the space in the bays. We might attempt to do it this since we haven't yet assembled the Mixer Box.
 
543TB said:
Don't you think that's somewhat unfounded fear-mongering? We have no way of knowing how many people will be ready financially to spring for another kit right away, nor how streamlined their process will be. After final checking, we're only missing a handful of parts and I do think it was an accident based on the FL vs. W naming convention, which is a pretty honest mistake given they were working hard to meet a deadline they imposed on themseIves. I think in the absence of information, many people are jumping to conclusions about a lot of things that have turned out to be much ado about not much.
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I do not see how that is either founded or unfounded fear mongering. People universally start with the lower cost kit which is always the tail kit. Vans always sells more tail kits than the other kits. In this case it wasn't available but once it becomes available new orders will probably start with the tail kits, which are easier to produce for Vans. And in so doing it will be easier for Vans to catch up on the "flow" of -15 kit deliveries. Although with the advent of each new kit going into production I suspect there will be hiccups because some of us will be hungry, dare I say ravenous for the next kit in line. For the experienced builders the wing and empennage will not take us until December to finish.
 
Alphalpha said:
I do not see how that is either founded or unfounded fear mongering. People universally start with the lower cost kit which is always the tail kit. Vans always sells more tail kits than the other kits. In this case it wasn't available but once it becomes available new orders will probably start with the tail kits, which are easier to produce for Vans.
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After the update describing the jack screw, I'm interested to see just how much space there is between the cost of the wing and emp kits. The latest iteration of the emp kit seems like it will have some hardware that could significantly raise the price. I suppose that hardware may end up in a finish kit which would keep tail kit costs down.

Van's shift from tail kits to empennage kits, include the tail cone also narrowed this gap in the last few kit generations.
 
N8DAV8R said:
After the update describing the jack screw, I'm interested to see just how much space there is between the cost of the wing and emp kits. The latest iteration of the emp kit seems like it will have some hardware that could significantly raise the price. I suppose that hardware may end up in a finish kit which would keep tail kit costs down.

Van's shift from tail kits to empennage kits, include the tail cone also narrowed this gap in the last few kit generations.
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It will be entertaining to see what makes it into the fuselage kit or the finishing kit.
 
Dan 57 said:
I dare to predict some wait until the skies are obscured by hoards of -15s...

Wait for the kits, wait for the BOs, maybe wait for one's personal funds, and wait... for the aircraft to be designed?
I wonder, is that the first Van's stable model being sold prior being fully designed (not talking about improvements here)?
The resources Van's presently uses must be enormous, and that will be an expensive exercise.

I must be getting super old fast as times have changed, as I recall folks having built very non-quick built RV-4s in the eighties... in a matter of months.

The -15 definitely is, and certainly will continue to be, a fascinating development.
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Yes, our memories definitely start to go as we age….

Pretty much every model since the RV-8 had the first kit sections become available before the entire airplane design process was completed.
This was particularly true with the 10, 12, and 14.
It was probably true with the earlier kits as well, but that is too far back to comment about the specifics.
I am not aware of an RV-4 that was built in just a few months. There was an RV-6 built in 85 days but that happened a number of years after the complete kit had finally become available.
 
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