SL-00092 and SL-00100

[jcbarker]

Hello all,
Picked up the kits for the SL-00092 and SL-00100 on July 19, 2024. I was told I was the first one. I started on the 100 first as that is what's in the shop right now. My completed QB wings are in storage. I started working on it in earnest 7/27. The labor required estimate stated in the Service Letter is 8 hours if, and this is a BIG IF, you are starting with an as delivered QB fuse. My fuse is done so there is a lot of drilling out of rivets for the baggage and floor boards. Plus disassembly of flap actuation. Anyway, here's the time I've spent so far:
Steps 1-10 8.5 hrs
Steps 11-16 2.0 hrs
Steps 18-19 4.0 hrs this is tough. access is limited. You'll need a compact right angle air drill for this.
Steps 20-24 2.0 hrs
Steps 25-30 6.0 hrs
Steps 33-34 8.0 hrs
Steps 35-38 5.0 hrs This is for the left side only
TOTAL: 35.5 hrs

I probably have another 8 to 10 hours to go.

As an aside, determining if I have LCP or not is nearly impossible on a factory assembled fuse. Van's informed me I "probably" had Laser Cut Parts in my fuse so rather than wonder I decided to install the remediation. The structure will be stronger than original and removes any concerns when it comes to resale.

Until next time,

 

[ryane67]

I just started 00092 on my completed wings. one wing's disassembly was 6.5 hours, it wasn't too bad but sure was heart breaking tearing open completed wings... I'm about 2-3 hours into re-assembly at the moment, and think it'll be another 3 until finished so likely 24 hours total for wings that are closed up... doesn't count re-painting the outside tho

Here's my tear-down video to give anybody a little more confidence in the process:

 

[ben barron]

I just started 00092 on my completed wings. one wing's disassembly was 6.5 hours, it wasn't too bad but sure was heart breaking tearing open completed wings... I'm about 2-3 hours into re-assembly at the moment, and think it'll be another 3 until finished so likely 24 hours total for wings that are closed up... doesn't count re-painting the outside tho

Here's my tear-down video to give anybody a little more confidence in the process:

This is great. Look forward to the next (install) video...THANKS

 

[ryane67]

Thoughts on setting / pulling cherrymax in the corners here? can't grind down a cheap puller any more than I have already.. the stem breaks before the mandrel engages when pulled because of the really tight angle of these.

 

[docjjrmd]

Thoughts on setting / pulling cherrymax in the corners here? can't grind down a cheap puller any more than I have already.. the stem breaks before the mandrel engages when pulled because of the really tight angle of these.

This Pulling Wedge with a POP PRP26A puller should get you there. (Us RV 12 guys fight pulling rivets in weird places vs the rivet bangers of the rest of the RV gang)...Ask around I bet you can borrow both for 4 rivets. Also would make that whole top row easier to pull. FWIW.

 

[jcbarker]

Van's specifically recommends against using a wedge to pull CherryMax rivets. The stem is heat treated steel which is to say hard and brittle. It will likely break before being fully set. Having not tried it I'm curious what other's success has been.

 

[docjjrmd]

Van's specifically recommends against using a wedge to pull CherryMax rivets. The stem is heat treated steel which is to say hard and brittle. It will likely break before being fully set. Having not tried it I'm curious what other's success has been.

Not recommended yes, necessary occasionally/rarely, either use it or never get the rivet in. When pulled can feel the double pop of set and mandrel break. Be sure and lubricate rivet. In all honesty my experience is 4 Cherry max rivets with wedge.

 

[jcbarker]

Not recommended yes, necessary occasionally/rarely, either use it or never get the rivet in. When pulled can feel the double pop of set and mandrel break. Be sure and lubricate rivet. In all honesty my experience is 4 Cherry max rivets with wedge.

Thanks Cape, good to know.

 

[ryane67]

This Pulling Wedge with a POP PRP26A puller should get you there. (Us RV 12 guys fight pulling rivets in weird places vs the rivet bangers of the rest of the RV gang)...Ask around I bet you can borrow both for 4 rivets. Also would make that whole top row easier to pull. FWIW.

Bought the tool, but the prp26a doesn't have the grip to pull these cherry max rivets, it just slides off the stem.

Going to have to go the direction of an a&p friend who said just drill them up to #19, put a #8 structural screw and steel nut on there.

 

[docjjrmd]

Bought the tool, but the prp26a doesn't have the grip to pull these cherry max rivets, it just slides off the stem.

Going to have to go the direction of an a&p friend who said just drill them up to #19, put a #8 structural screw and steel nut on there.

Sorry to hear that. I haven't had that issue with the prp26a. They do require a drop of Boelube periodically and they are a 2 step, tighten, open, slide down on mandrel and second pull. Mine pulls the little CCR264-SS-3-02 flush rivets for nut plates which has the smallest diameter mandrel I've run across. - JJR

 

[docjjrmd]

https://vansairforce.net/threads/prp-26a-rivet-puller-wont-grip-rivets.90623/ A 2012 thread on slipping prp26a puller.

 

[ryane67]

Thanks for the tips.. I tried but I think the issue is just that these are 5/32 cherrymax.. stems are a bit big for that tool oh well.

I've got a shipment coming soon with the last bits needed to complete the job, so I'll get another video out on that... so far the install is quite a bit easier than the removal.

 

[bobrv7taildragger]

I just started 00092 on my completed wings. one wing's disassembly was 6.5 hours, it wasn't too bad but sure was heart breaking tearing open completed wings... I'm about 2-3 hours into re-assembly at the moment, and think it'll be another 3 until finished so likely 24 hours total for wings that are closed up... doesn't count re-painting the outside tho

Here's my tear-down video to give anybody a little more confidence in the process:

man I almost feel sick for you having to do this....keep going man you are getting there.

 

[Phil Sprang]

I'm working on SL-00092 and my quick build wings. I'm passing along an issue I discovered in hopes that others may trap it sooner than I did.

My SL-00092 KIT was shipped 7/19/24.

On the packing list, were two ribs, the inboard rib for each wing.
W-1010-L-1-14MOD and W-1010-R-1-14MOD
The ribs I received were:
W-1010-L-1-MOD and W1010-R-1-MOD
Notice the subtle difference?

I missed it when doing the inventory.
The person packing the kit missed it too.

The issue is this, at the spar. The bolt holes are half a hole off.




I've spoke to Support at Vans and they are sending me new ribs. Apparently, I'm the second call in two days with this issue.

The only damage here is a chink in my pride and a slight delay in getting this done. Vans is making it right and I'm not upset at all.

I hesitated posting this as I don't want to start WWIII but I do want to share it so others can check their part numbers and perhaps get them replaced before they start, if they have the incorrect ones.

 

[bertschb]

The only damage here is a chink in my pride and a slight delay in getting this done. Vans is making it right and I'm not upset at all.

You have such a great attitude Phil. I hope I have the same positive outlook if I ever need to tear apart something already completed.

 

[docjjrmd]

Thanks for the tips.. I tried but I think the issue is just that these are 5/32 cherrymax.. stems are a bit big for that tool oh well.

I've got a shipment coming soon with the last bits needed to complete the job, so I'll get another video out on that... so far the install is quite a bit easier than the removal.

Did you get the 5/32 tip PRN-514? I understand the frustration and sounds like you have found an alternate fix. I have the utmost respect for your sharing of a painful situation and how you are fixing it! You have made me curious now and I may have to grab a handful of those oversize rivets to see exactly how much different they are. - JJR

 

[ryane67]

I'm working on SL-00092 and my quick build wings. I'm passing along an issue I discovered in hopes that others may trap it sooner than I did.

My SL-00092 KIT was shipped 7/19/24.

On the packing list, were two ribs, the inboard rib for each wing.
W-1010-L-1-14MOD and W-1010-R-1-14MOD
The ribs I received were:
W-1010-L-1-MOD and W1010-R-1-MOD
Notice the subtle difference?

I missed it when doing the inventory.
The person packing the kit missed it too.

The issue is this, at the spar. The bolt holes are half a hole off.

View attachment 68386


I've spoke to Support at Vans and they are sending me new ribs. Apparently, I'm the second call in two days with this issue.

The only damage here is a chink in my pride and a slight delay in getting this done. Vans is making it right and I'm not upset at all.

I hesitated posting this as I don't want to start WWIII but I do want to share it so others can check their part numbers and perhaps get them replaced before they start, if they have the incorrect ones.

I noticed the part number discrepancy in my inventory too but didn't think anything of it, thinking all the ribs were the same... sigh I'll be calling parts to get new ribs tomorrow.. yet another delay in this... and Van's now has to spend more money that they don't have because their QA on packing kits is a process that needs to be fixed asap.

Yeah, I'm griping.. I just want this laser cut and bankruptcy mess to be behind all of us and it won't be until they get silly little things like this fixed.

 

[steve997]

I'm working on SL-00092 and my quick build wings. I'm passing along an issue I discovered in hopes that others may trap it sooner than I did.

My SL-00092 KIT was shipped 7/19/24.

On the packing list, were two ribs, the inboard rib for each wing.
W-1010-L-1-14MOD and W-1010-R-1-14MOD
The ribs I received were:
W-1010-L-1-MOD and W1010-R-1-MOD
Notice the subtle difference?

I missed it when doing the inventory.
The person packing the kit missed it too.

The issue is this, at the spar. The bolt holes are half a hole off


I've spoke to Support at Vans and they are sending me new ribs. Apparently, I'm the second call in two days with this issue.

The only damage here is a chink in my pride and a slight delay in getting this done. Vans is making it right and I'm not upset at all.

I hesitated posting this as I don't want to start WWIII but I do want to share it so others can check their part numbers and perhaps get them replaced before they start, if they have the incorrect ones.

Thanks for the heads up Phil... I just got home from vacation and my SL-00092 and SL-00100 kits were awaiting me.
First thing I did was check these same parts and I too, have been sent the incorrect ones ... ughh...

Steve
Perth, Australia

 

[ryane67]

Thanks for the heads up Phil... I just got home from vacation and my SL-00092 and SL-00100 kits were awaiting me.
First thing I did was check these same parts and I too, have been sent the incorrect ones ... ughh...

Steve
Perth, Australia

I called parts to get replacements and told them of the other reports and they should check their stock of these pre-packed kits.. she sent a message over to the packing and shipping people for them to check it out and fix but I bet quite a few of them went out wrong.

 

[dustin_96]

Has anyone successfully pulled the rivets in the rear spar? I drilled out the rivets corresponding to the W-1025B-R (the rib portion that attaches to the flap attach bracket) to accept the CR3213-5-4 Cherry Max. I have been able to pull three of the four rivets successfully but the one under the upper skin is too close. I have tried pulling with the Van's wedge that section 5 has you manufacture but the stem breaks before the rivet is fully seated. Out of frustration I ordered the POP close quarters puller but after reading this thread I'm wondering if it is going to work when it gets here. I have tried everything I can think of with the tools I currently have but all attempts have been with the Van's wedge. Ugh. I would have just driven the rivets had I known it was going to be this difficult but the holes have been upsized at this point. I haven't even gotten to the 16 pulled rivets that go through the flap attach bracket. Again I already drilled it thinking it would be easier but am totally regretting that decision at this point.

 

[docjjrmd]

Has anyone successfully pulled the rivets in the rear spar? I drilled out the rivets corresponding to the W-1025B-R (the rib portion that attaches to the flap attach bracket) to accept the CR3213-5-4 Cherry Max. I have been able to pull three of the four rivets successfully but the one under the upper skin is too close. I have tried pulling with the Van's wedge that section 5 has you manufacture but the stem breaks before the rivet is fully seated. Out of frustration I ordered the POP close quarters puller but after reading this thread I'm wondering if it is going to work when it gets here. I have tried everything I can think of with the tools I currently have but all attempts have been with the Van's wedge. Ugh. I would have just driven the rivets had I known it was going to be this difficult but the holes have been upsized at this point. I haven't even gotten to the 16 pulled rivets that go through the flap attach bracket. Again I already drilled it thinking it would be easier but am totally regretting that decision at this point.

Make sure and get the nose piece for 5/32 rivets PR33A and the type D jaw for use with the prp26a. Lubricate!. see op instructions for prp26a. Understand the prp26a is really meant to only pull aluminum 5/32 mandrels. Plan on two hands to do final squeeze. I have used the Clevland Tools pulling wedge with 1/8" CherryMax successfully 4 times, never tried with the homemade Vans aluminum wedge which is thinner and has a more acute angle. YMMV.

 

[dustin_96]

Make sure and get the nose piece for 5/32 rivets PR33A and the type D jaw for use with the prp26a. Lubricate!. see op instructions for prp26a. Understand the prp26a is really meant to only pull aluminum 5/32 mandrels. Plan on two hands to do final squeeze. I have used the Clevland Tools pulling wedge with 1/8" CherryMax successfully 4 times, never tried with the homemade Vans aluminum wedge which is thinner and has a more acute angle. YMMV.

Thanks for the information! I’m having difficulty finding those two items. Do you happen to know a supplier?

 

[docjjrmd]

Thanks for the information! I’m having difficulty finding those two items. Do you happen to know a supplier?

Crest Fastener has both of them, Hansen has the nose piece but is more $. Search by part number on both sites.

 

[JDA_BTR]

My PRP26A slips on Cherry rivets too. If you use a similar slim-nose puller made for Cherry rivets (G28) I've had it work with a wedge, but I make sure not to bend any more over than the wedge requires. But in the location you are using it for a wedge is likely not needed.

 

[ryane67]

I'd like to call something out to anybody doing the wings.. you *may* need a 5/32 dimple die and a countersink cutter with a #20 pilot... though the #8 screw stuff is really close and would probably do just fine.

 

[ryane67]

Total hours to complete one wing for me was a bit over 16.. here's the re-assembly video.

 

[jcbarker]

Since I was the OP of this thread I thought I'd post an update on hours for the Fuse remediation:

I ended up putting 41.0 hours in. This was spread out over 3 1/2 weeks. Not how I wanted to spend the better part of a month but it's done. I can put it behind me and move on to the remediation on the wings. Uggh!

Hang in there everyone!

 

[ryane67]

Since I was the OP of this thread I thought I'd post an update on hours for the Fuse remediation:

I ended up putting 41.0 hours in. This was spread out over 3 1/2 weeks. Not how I wanted to spend the better part of a month but it's done. I can put it behind me and move on to the remediation on the wings. Uggh!

Hang in there everyone!

I finished out the remediation for my completed wings, the time came in at 30 hours total, but due to tool requirements, the whole parts snafu with van's etc, it was 1.5 months on and off. I started the process immediately after getting home from OSH. Thankfully I was able to do the big join on my fuse during the downtime of the wing re-work.

 

[PeteT]

Ryan and everyone-
Thanks for the information about the fix- nice encouragement to press on. Another character builder in the category of “There’s no way I can do this!” But, somehow you do.

Pete

 

[dustin_96]

After having difficulty pulling the 5/32 Cherrye max rivets with the close tolerance pop rivet tool, I called the support line at vans aircraft. Support then contacted the engineers to make sure that the pop rivet tool should be able to pull those rivets and they confirmed that it should. I have tried everything I can find to get those rivets to pull, but the stem is simply too short for the tool to engage the rivet appropriately. Has anyone successfully pulled a 5/32 Cherrye max rivet with the close tolerance pop rivet tool? Unfortunately, I have already drilled all of the holes up to a 5/32 in accordance with the procedure outlined in the service letter so I am very frustrated and not sure what to do. By the way, Support indicated that a wedge or similar device should never be used with a cherry max and will most likely never work. That is the exact result that I had when trying to use both the Cleveland wedge and the vans, pulling wedge.

Is there another took out there that is capable of pulling these rivets in a close tolerance situation?

 

[PeteT]

Dustin-
We’re tackling the 16 rivets with a big tungsten bucking bar (planning that is). I’m lucky to have a riveting partner- probably a requirement here. You could possibly get 5/32” solid rivets to do the troublesome holes? Maybe you’ve already thought of this. We’ll see if my confidence gets dashed to pieces on Friday.

Pete

 

[ryane67]

Dustin, could you try solid 5/32 rivets?
I was suuuuuuper careful (and lucky the manufactured head was inboard facing) drilling out the tight quarters rivets on my second wing and was able to re-set solid 1/8 rivets in those places with the offset set. It was a challenge, but not nearly as much of a challenge as trying to pull cherrymax in those spots (thus going to the #8 structural screw in one wing) I would bet you could get a 5/32 solid rivet in there but it's gonna take a lot of pressure on the gun.. between the rivet needing more force, and the corner areas not moving very much when the gun pulses, it will be tough.

 

[dustin_96]

I thought about using 5/32 solid rivets but I think I would be more likely to just reorder all of the necessary parts and go in with #4 solid rivets. Setting 5/32 rivets would be extremely difficult and I would be concerned about those forces and what they would do to the surrounding structure. Maybe I’ll get this procedure completed by Christmas.

My advice to anyone planning to comply with Sl-00092 would be to be very careful drilling out the holes in the flap attach brackets then reassemble with #4 solid rivets. Cherry max rivets are not a practical option for this procedure. The procedure itself should be amended immediately in my opinion.

 

[PeteT]

To make things easier and predictable- IMHO- using new 1025 flap brackets is the key. You’ll have clean 1/8” holes to work with. I was able to set the rivets around the perimeter using a slight offset rivet set. Suffice it to say, it took six hours to set 9 rivets. Probably use 1/8” Cherrymax in the middle seven rivets so we don’t press our luck.

Pete