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Cooling the hangar ...

bkervaski

bkervaski

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What are you guys using to cool your hangers? It's 104 degrees here today.

Not expecting 65 degrees but perhaps there's a way to drop it 20-30 degrees?

I'm looking at portable ACs, but out of my area of expertise or experience.

Advice appreciated and welcome! :)
 
I'd love to install one of these:

Big Ass Fans - Home

Ceiling fans and Industrial HVLS fans engineered for powerful airflow, quiet performance, and year‑round comfort in any space. Shop Big Ass Fans.
bigassfans.com

Alas, not sure that's in my budget or the hangar lease. For now, a 10'x10' "reception/wedding" tent and a portable AC unit.
 
bkervaski said:
I'm looking at portable ACs, but out of my area of expertise or experience.
Click to expand...
Portable A/Cs have come a long way since my first one. My current one will cool down one of my rental units (1500 sq') during the summer. It won't be cold but it will be nice inside compared with nothing. I bought it and have used it once as an emergency A/C when one of my tenant's unit broke down on a weekend until it was fixed. You just need a place for it to vent the hot air outside and any window will work.
 
Insulation can make a significant difference.
I was just doing some research because the bottom of my metal patio cover is reading over 110F (when it was < 90 out).
Basically each unit of R value will cut that by 2 degrees.
So if you put up R 7.7 foam board you'd be seeing a temp 15F less than what that metal roof is currently.
And a small portable A/C might have a hope of doing some good.
 
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Not inexpensive, but if you have electricuty and water a PortaCool works well. Mine is 36" fan. I got it for a steal from a cnc shop that was selling everything. Doubt I'd spring for new.

Also.. what size space are you talking? A smakker size coould work for a small T.
 
More to the point I guess, is there a portable AC unit that may work? I'm looking at the BAF Evaporative Coolers right now, kind of pricey, but wow it's hot!
 
rolivi said:
Not inexpensive, but if you have electricuty and water a PortaCool works well. Mine is 36" fan. I got it for a steal from a cnc shop that was selling everything. Doubt I'd spring for new.

Also.. what size space are you talking? A smakker size coould work for a small T.
Click to expand...
It's a standard T.
 
I use a portable room AC unit and attach a 20’ flex duct in it to exhaust the heat. Move it around and blow on me. It doesn’t break the bank and provides some help. Attach a garden hose to carry off the condensate.
 
I have a PortaCool Cyclone in my shop at home. It works well, but not really that portable. Also, it takes quite a bit of water, so not ideal in my hangar where the water is labeled "non-potable, not for human consumption" meaning any water I want misting my body should come from home, and even if I did want to use airport water, I'd have to haul it across the airport.

I've recently bought an EGO misting fan, originally for providing a little air flow on the patio, I've found it's my favorite cooler for the hanger and a real nice mini swamp cooler. It's battery operated which helps with limited power or outlets. It moves a lot of air, and the misting is excellent. I can work a full day in the hangar on one battery and 5-gallon bucket of water, but it can run off of a hose if you have that available.

Another thing I did was coat the roof of my hangar with Henry's Tropi-Cool that I bought at Home Depot and put on with a mop. I installed a solar powered exhaust fan up high in the hanger as well. Combined, these two dropped the interior temp A LOT, something around 10-15 degrees. Now, with the misting fan sitting about 5-10' away, the air blowing on me is about 75-80º and actually bearable to work in the hangar when OAT is at a balmy Byron 105º (which it was this last Saturday afternoon...oof).

Lastly, when I have longer maintenance periods, such as "annual", I try to do those earlier in the Spring, otherwise I get out there early and try to be gone by mid-day.
 
I use a Pinguino DeLonghi Portable AC thats meant for 700 sq ft in my 900 sq ft garage in the greater Houston area. I also have 3 fans blowing air and it keeps the garage 80 or below until about 1 or 2 in the afternoon and workable all day long. Given our high humidity it does take about 7-8 gallons of water out of the air each day. Depending on where you are I’m not sure an Evaporator Cooler would be the best choice if it’s a very humid area. Great for Arizona but maybe not so great for the greater Houston Area.
 

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Insulation is the key. Any AC is a waste of time in most open ceiling T and steel walls and door hangars so a fan is the only viable option.

For my 2400 sq ft well insulated hangar I use a large window air conditioner from Lowes. It was about 1/4th the cost of a split uniti for the same BTUs. I turn it on when I go into the hangar and it cools the hangar below 75 degrees in short order.

The problem most will have is getting the FBO to allow it, having the power to run it, and getting the FBO to allow you to install a ceiling and insulation all around.

Carl
 
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Something similar to this. Sits about 2 feet from me pointed right at my face. If you are inside your airplane, you can keep the cockpit very cold actually. Or your car if you're working on it.

Screenshot 2024-06-24 at 6.06.13 PM.png
 
Mel said:
Yeah swamp coolers work OK temporarily but long term use in hi humidity areas will do quite a number on your tools. Be careful.
Click to expand...
In the SE, they don't work particularly well. Too much humidity, which means the opportunity for evaporative cooling is greatly reduced.
DeltaRomeo said:
Something similar to this. Sits about 2 feet from me pointed right at my face. If you are inside your airplane, you can keep the cockpit very cold actually.

View attachment 65418
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Yep. Spot cooling is about the best you're gonna do unless you want to spend real money on insulation and HVAC.
 
Thanks for all the suggestions. For the weekend, wondering if one of the Home Depot or Lowes units would do anything at all. Trying to get my current project finished, shouldn't take more than about a week.

Not opposed to buying two units. It's hot.
 
Businesses rent those high-level spot coolers all the time. There was a business on our airport that had hundreds of them - might be feasible to look into that for a couple of weeks rental.
 
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5 Ton Trane heat pump with six vents in the ceiling rafters (ceiling not finished). Central FL and it's the only way to work all spring, summer and fall. Wouldn't go to the hangar otherwise. 2000 sq ft hangar, 12 ft ceiling height, rafters and spray foam on rafters and hangar door. Worth EVERY dollar!! I remotely cool it down via app when enroute to hangar. Put it at 80 when I leave. I own the hangar though.

Best part is humidity stays 40-50%.

Bill is about $120/month in summer.

Hangar neighbors without a/c don't come to their hangars. Too hot by 9:30am.
 
I am a big fan of mini splits. Very energy efficient for cooling & heating. No duct work required. I've put several mitsubishi units in my new house & they work great.
 
Unless your T hangar is in the end of the row, a Minisplit or standard Heat Pump won’t work. No place to put condenser and coils.
Like others have said, insulation will help a lot. If you’re in an area that cools down enough at night, you may be able to put in an air exchange system to get the cool air in, and buy some time. You will still have condensation issues if you’re in a humid environment unless you install a dehumidifier.
Tough problem…..
 
Perhaps something that is less expensive that would really help is controlling the humidity. Getting a portable dehumidifier and attaching a garden hose to take the water outside is an inexpensive way to improve comfort. While I have a 3 ton mini-split for my shop, before I installed it I used a dehumidifier to help with comfort. It was surprisingly comfortable up to about 85 - 90 degrees. A medium quality unit will get the humidity down to about 30%. Note that like any system that conditions the air, the tighter the space the better it will work. Not sure a T-hangar would be tight enough. On the other hand, with multiple units you might be surprised.

Today, I still use a dehumidifier in conjunction with my air conditioning. The result is greater comfort at a higher temp.
 
So no options for me to go buy something today and expect it to knock 20 degrees off the top? Seems like the portable AC units just don't work well enough in non-insulated environments to be worth it?
 
Reflex said:
Perhaps something that is less expensive that would really help is controlling the humidity. Getting a portable dehumidifier and attaching a garden hose to take the water outside is an inexpensive way to improve comfort. While I have a 3 ton mini-split for my shop, before I installed it I used a dehumidifier to help with comfort. It was surprisingly comfortable up to about 85 - 90 degrees. A medium quality unit will get the humidity down to about 30%. Note that like any system that conditions the air, the tighter the space the better it will work. Not sure a T-hangar would be tight enough. On the other hand, with multiple units you might be surprised.

Today, I still use a dehumidifier in conjunction with my air conditioning. The result is greater comfort at a higher temp.
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Totally agree. Unfortunately, the cheap ones at the big box stores don’t last more than a year or two in my experience, doesn’t seem to matter the brand.
I have had excellent luck with Quest, 6 year warranty, but not cheap.
Anything below 50% humidity will do the job.
(Sorry, 50% will keep tools and such from rusting but for heat index the lower the better)
 
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Neck wraps you soak in water and a fan. Might allow you to work a bit but 104 is dangerous to your health.
 
JonJay said:
Neck wraps you soak in water and a fan. Might allow you to work a bit but 104 is dangerous to your health.
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Years ago when I was ddoing alot of work in the shop, Suzanne insisted that I put a 15000BTU window unit in. Actually worked pretty well.
 
Carl Froehlich said:
Insulation is the key. Any AC is a waste of time in most open ceiling T and steel walls and door hangars so a fan is the only viable option.
Click to expand...

I wonder why... Heat, I agree, in an open hangar will just rise and escape out the roof. Cool air, however, is more dense and collects near the floor naturally. If you have a well sealed set of walls and doors around the bottom perimeter, if you cool the air it should stay there.
 
bkervaski said:
So no options for me to go buy something today and expect it to knock 20 degrees off the top? Seems like the portable AC units just don't work well enough in non-insulated environments to be worth it?
Click to expand...
20 degrees is a lot. I don't think even a large window unit in a non-insulated hangar is going to do that.
 
Snowflake said:
I wonder why... Heat, I agree, in an open hangar will just rise and escape out the roof. Cool air, however, is more dense and collects near the floor naturally. If you have a well sealed set of walls and doors around the bottom perimeter, if you cool the air it should stay there.
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The metal roofs of the typical hangar get HOT. And then that hot metal re-radiates heat downward. Yes it will be hotter higher up. Like 120F near the ceiling. Oftentimes these roofs have a peak and the heat doesn't escape out the roof. Typically no vents up there, so no escape route.
 
bkervaski said:
So no options for me to go buy something today and expect it to knock 20 degrees off the top? Seems like the portable AC units just don't work well enough in non-insulated environments to be worth it?
Click to expand...
I would think a couple portable units from you local home improvement store would get you from heat stroke zone to ugly sweating. Maybe not 20 degrees but seriously noticeable. and you can stand in front of them occasionally to cool down.
 
I just ordered one of these after talking to the rep, anyone else have one that can report their results?

store.bigassfans.com

Big Ass Fans - Cool‑Space 300 Evaporative Cooler | Big Ass Fans

Compact evaporative cooler built for workshops, garages, and small industrial spaces. Offers portable, efficient cooling through advanced swamp‑cooling technology.
store.bigassfans.com

Pricey but it's hot. Real hot. And humid. So humid we're just going to swim to the field today.
 
bkervaski said:
I just ordered one of these after talking to the rep, anyone else have one that can report their results?

store.bigassfans.com

Big Ass Fans - Cool‑Space 300 Evaporative Cooler | Big Ass Fans

Compact evaporative cooler built for workshops, garages, and small industrial spaces. Offers portable, efficient cooling through advanced swamp‑cooling technology.
store.bigassfans.com

Pricey but it's hot. Real hot. And humid. So humid we're just going to swim to the field today.
Click to expand...
Evaporative coolers work well when you live in a DRY climate like the desert Southwest USA. I have a friend that has one like in the link but may be a different company but he is in the Mojave Desert and it works great.

The humid southeast really needs a refrigeration cooler to remove humidity and chill the air.

When I was out west, I was able to get by with a large fan in the hangar and would drink lots of water. Now that I am in the southeast with the humidity, I run an old dehumidifier that I inherited from my father. It removes over a gallon of water per day and is approaching 40-years old. My hangar is on a slap, the walls are insulated and drywalled. I have a heat pump that will keep the place as comfortable as I want as long as I am willing to pay for the electricity. The compressor in my Trane heat pump pulls 8 amps at 240 volts and will make the hangar comfortable enough to work in. It cost about 20-cents per hour to run it for heat or cold and it does not need to run continuous. The dehumidifier costs about sixty cents per day to run.
 
Call Quest. Good American company in Madison Wisconsin. They can guide you to the right dehumidifier for your needs.
I use their 225 unit and it does great in a large space (3200sqft in one 3600sqft in the other). You won’t need that big of a unit.
You still need to cool the air.
 
bkervaski said:
I just ordered one of these after talking to the rep, anyone else have one that can report their results?

store.bigassfans.com

Big Ass Fans - Cool‑Space 300 Evaporative Cooler | Big Ass Fans

Compact evaporative cooler built for workshops, garages, and small industrial spaces. Offers portable, efficient cooling through advanced swamp‑cooling technology.
store.bigassfans.com

Pricey but it's hot. Real hot. And humid. So humid we're just going to swim to the field today.
Click to expand...
We use tons of those in the plants and they are pretty effective. Not as great on the humid gulf coast, but still better than nothing.
 
bkervaski said:
What are you guys using to cool your hangers? It's 104 degrees here today.

Not expecting 65 degrees but perhaps there's a way to drop it 20-30 degrees?

I'm looking at portable ACs, but out of my area of expertise or experience.

Advice appreciated and welcome! :)
Click to expand...
Having built a few hundred way more than normal energy efficient homes in my home building career I have a bit of information to help.
Ya I'm spoiled with a fully sheet rocked insulated heat pumped hangar. It wasn't when I bought it though.
The most important thing you can do is """STOP""" the heat/cool from escaping.
I would start with sealing up any air leak you can find with caulking weather-stripping or what ever.
I built homes in 6 energy efficient government programs where the homes were tested for leakage and overall performance
Air leakage is the predominant problem. And no you won't suffer with moisture either. In houses the humans create all the moisture.
So after you tackle the leakage problem you might think of getting a Daikin mini split zonal system. You can even buy a preset up system off Amazon.
It's just money But it's nice to be cool
My luck varies FIXIT
 
bkervaski said:
What are you guys using to cool your hangers? It's 104 degrees here today.

Not expecting 65 degrees but perhaps there's a way to drop it 20-30 degrees?

I'm looking at portable ACs, but out of my area of expertise or experience.

Advice appreciated and welcome! :)
Click to expand...
What is the constrcution of your hangar? metal T-Hangar with gravel floors? Concrete bliock hanar attached toa home with concrete floors.... What power do you have available? 110/220 how many amps can we add?

Thanks
 
For my hangar, 3,000 SqFt (60 x 50) concrete block construction, 22 feet tall, insulated hangar door, R30 in the ceiling, I used qty 2-3 ton Gree min-splits. Each mini split has qty 2 -8K heads (4 total). It works to keep the temperatures in Florida heat at 72 and humidity around 50-65%, sometime lower. I still have leakage at the hangar door that I could fix and really improve the efficiency.

My other hangar has the same constrcution but smaller 45 x 39 foot hangar and 12.5 high plus roof trusses and open cell foamed roof. A few years ago I installed an LG 5 ton mini-split system with 2 heads in the hangar. The LG system is by far the best for me. It can keep that Florida hangar in the 60s if I wanted to.
 
[email protected] said:
Having built a few hundred way more than normal energy efficient homes in my home building career I have a bit of information to help.
Ya I'm spoiled with a fully sheet rocked insulated heat pumped hangar. It wasn't when I bought it though.
The most important thing you can do is """STOP""" the heat/cool from escaping.
I would start with sealing up any air leak you can find with caulking weather-stripping or what ever.
I built homes in 6 energy efficient government programs where the homes were tested for leakage and overall performance
Air leakage is the predominant problem. And no you won't suffer with moisture either. In houses the humans create all the moisture.
So after you tackle the leakage problem you might think of getting a Daikin mini split zonal system. You can even buy a preset up system off Amazon.
It's just money But it's nice to be cool
My luck varies FIXIT
Click to expand...
It’s a T hangar Art. No place to put an ac unit,even a mini split.
 
JonJay said:
Anybody ever use a cooling vest?
Click to expand...
I use a cooling vest (the kind that you soak with water) on my motorcycle, and have used one in a car without A/C. They work fine with the humidity below about 30% with good airflow. If you head east from Salt Lake, as soon as you start to see cornfields (indicating a much more humid climate), they quit working.

Auto racers use cooling vests with tubing attached through which cold water from a chest filled with an ice/water mix is pumped. These work regardless of humidity.

bkervaski said:
I just ordered one of these after talking to the rep, anyone else have one that can report their results?

store.bigassfans.com

Big Ass Fans - Cool‑Space 300 Evaporative Cooler | Big Ass Fans

Compact evaporative cooler built for workshops, garages, and small industrial spaces. Offers portable, efficient cooling through advanced swamp‑cooling technology.
store.bigassfans.com

Pricey but it's hot. Real hot. And humid. So humid we're just going to swim to the field today.
Click to expand...
I have a much higher capacity evaporative cooler in my hangar. It puts out about 20 * cooler air if the humidity is 20%. The hangar door must be open quite a bit for it to work. If the door is closed, the temp drops about a degree and the humidity approaches 100%. See this chart :
https://www.captiveaire.com/CATALOGCONTENT/EVAPCOOLER/EVAP_COOLER_OUTPUT_TEMP.ASP
Note: the chart shows only the temp of the air exiting the cooler. 96* ambient and 80% humidity gives you 93* air out of the cooler at a much higher humidity.
 
these evap. coolers are really a mixed bag of pluses and minuses.in a dry climate they are great but as you get into more humidity it is diminishing returns. if you are not in a dry area no way will you feel 1 degree cooler for a 1 deg drop in room temp as the humidity rises.
20 yrs ago when i got my hangar i built an insulated 10x10 shop. i did this so i could do airplane work in the winter. it is great to have this space with a bench and my tools in one place. i wired it so i could crank as much electric heat as i needed.
i also have a 5000 btu airconditioner for hot weather. i know i don't see any heat like a lot of you guys do but 90 degrees and 75-85 humidity is probably comparable to desert heat over 100 deg. water cooling doesn't work very well here anyway compared to a dryer area.
anyway, like working in the cold, there are usually enough things done better on a bench and with good light to warrant frequent trips to the shop. that 5 minutes takes the hot or cold edge off. the cost for heating or cooling exp. and the expense to run for 100 sq feet is peanuts.
 
If only a temporary situation, CamelBak with frozen water bladder? Then as it melts off, you can sip the cold water from it. Could be handy for hot flights, too!

REI Sale Camelbak
 
You have had a wide variety of recommendations and some of them good. Like me, you are screwed.
Un-insulated metal hanger in a humid climate.
Your biggest heat load is the metal roof. (I assume it is exposed bare metal) As has been mentioned, this hot metal radiates heat down just like a radiant heater for winter heating. Stand in the rays of radiant heater and you are warm but move into a shadow and you are freezing.
You are standing under a very large metal roof radiant heater. Same principal as your attic being 120 degrees when it is only 90 outside.
Unless you add a layer of insulation below the roof, you will never be able to cool the space.
Though an evaporative cooler is not a good solution, it may be your best for that amount of money and labor.
I added a mini split in the home garage for working on Harleys but I am screwed at the hanger.
 
My hangar experience over the last 50 years has almost entirely been leased T-hangars. Currently, bare metal, 15 amps of power total, no water, no usable outside walls. I don't think this is rare for those of us who only look for a place out of the weather to keep their airplane and have no desire to make it their man cave away from home. Fortunately, this is Minnesota and my hangar faces east, so my cooling needs are entirely served by a 36 inch drum fan. In the summer, I feel for you guys in hot/humid climates. In the winter...well...I hope you will reciprocate the sympathy.
 
So what is the cut off point for an effective swamp cooler? Here in Oklahoma is is currently running 100deg and 65% humidity and will be for the next couple of months. In my hangar (3200 sq ft) the roof is insulated and covered with white galvanized roofing sheets but the sides are just the metal sheeting. I built a 12 X 20 office/shop with a mini split that works great for small projects, but working in the hangar itself is tough right now, currently I roll around a portable AC/Dehumidifier unit and have it and a fan blow on the area I am working in but it is still hot. Interested if the swamp cooler would be a solution. I do have water as well as power.
Figs
 
At 65% Humidity a swamp cooler will be very effective at raising the humidity a few more percent, but that's about it. Several years ago, Universal Studios installed water misters at the ride lines in their Orlando park. They worked great in the Hollywood park after all? They were great at getting you wet while you waited, but for cooling? Not so much. They were gone the next year.
In Arizona I've been at restaurants with the same misters around their outside seating. They would lower the temp 20 degrees, but no one got wet because at 10% humidity, the water evaporated almost before it was out of the nozzle.
 
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