When compared to other builders, it seems like my rv12is is going together real slow. I'm putting in the time but maybe im being too meticulous deburring and straitening. For instance I'm currently working on the nose wing ribs (w-1208-r and w-1208-l). It's seems Iike it's taking me forever to prep and debur the ribs. About 20-30 minutes per rib. Is this normal? I'm deburring all the flanges and faceting. Also the lightening holes and one side of rivet holes. Is this what everyone is doing? Is it technically necessary? Your feedback will be greatly appreciated.
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Am I being too meticulous?
- Thread starter Cobra427man
- Start date
Its what I did and yes 20-30 mins each was the norm. Worse part of building the wings.
It supposedly isn’t necessary to debur the pre punched rivet holes, but I always run a finger over them (backside of the punch) to be sure. Sounds about right for wing rib prep time.
Using the right tool would save a lot of work time. Mine also took an inordinate amount of time until I discovered a straight die grinder with a 1" 3M 7A wheel did a perfect job of deburring aluminum edges and holes. The 1" EXL wheel is another choice, but I prefer the 7A. You will go through several for an entire RV-12 build. If you start at the end, the wear will eventually make it tapered and useful for getting in smaller holes and tighter bend radius. I could probably debur a rib in about a minute, straightening will still be a lot of work. Be careful, with a die grinder running at 15,000+ rpm the 3M abrasive will make quick work of the skin on your free hand if you slip or grind too close.
BTW, my quality standard started out as "perfect" and eventually (over a 10-year build period) morphed to "are you willing to bet your life on it".
Thank you everyone for your responses and feedback! It's reassuring to know that my efforts are on par with others. More so, it's uplifting to have such a great community of fellow builders willing to share and help. I'll keep plugging away on my ribs.
MechaSteve
Well Known Member
A few power de-burring techniques I found to speed things up:
Maroon scotch brite wheel in a drill press
Works great for deburring the inside of flanges on ribs.
You do have to be a little strategic on approaching edges, but it soothes out the burr on inside.
Power screwdriver and a deburring bit
I did time-motion studies and it is faster than the hand tool.
This is a slow screw-driver, not a drill.
Swivel blade de-burr for big holes
There is a bit of a technique, but when you hit it just right, it can remove material remarkably quickly.
Beyond that, I found that batch processing was generally easier.
- peel all the film and label 14 Left ribs
- trim and file corners
- smooth edge with 3M wheel
- deburr flange with maroon wheel
- deburr big holes
- scuff surfaces
- Windex to remove scuffing debris
- Alcohol to remove windex residue
- Primer
- Relabel with sharpie
then repeat for the right nose ribs
then the left main
then the right main
Maroon scotch brite wheel in a drill press
Works great for deburring the inside of flanges on ribs.
You do have to be a little strategic on approaching edges, but it soothes out the burr on inside.
Power screwdriver and a deburring bit
I did time-motion studies and it is faster than the hand tool.
This is a slow screw-driver, not a drill.
Swivel blade de-burr for big holes
There is a bit of a technique, but when you hit it just right, it can remove material remarkably quickly.
Beyond that, I found that batch processing was generally easier.
- peel all the film and label 14 Left ribs
- trim and file corners
- smooth edge with 3M wheel
- deburr flange with maroon wheel
- deburr big holes
- scuff surfaces
- Windex to remove scuffing debris
- Alcohol to remove windex residue
- Primer
- Relabel with sharpie
then repeat for the right nose ribs
then the left main
then the right main
Norman CYYJ
Well Known Member
The real reality to your original question "Am I Being too meticulous" can only be answered by you.
Sounds about right to me. As others have mentioned, deburring over 50 wing ribs is the worst part of building the RV-12 iS wings.
Something else that just came to mind. At first deburring seemed like just one endlessly boring chore. Then I adopted a different mindset. I started treating it as a ‘getting to know you’ session with the parts.
Took each part and tried to make it look and feel as good as I could get it, after all, I need them to all work together to keep me in the air. May sound a bit ‘new age’, but it really did reduce the boredom factor for me.
Headphones and music also helped.
Just a thought,
Cheers DaveH
Took each part and tried to make it look and feel as good as I could get it, after all, I need them to all work together to keep me in the air. May sound a bit ‘new age’, but it really did reduce the boredom factor for me.
Headphones and music also helped.
Just a thought,
Cheers DaveH
I am just past where you are and it took me about 5 years to get through the wing ribs. There was 4 years and a few months between, but we won't talk about that. I think you are pretty close to where I was with time per rib but I might have moved a little faster.
Right or wrong, my process was two angle grinders. One has a 1" cut and polish wheel for the lightening holes, and I have a Roloc arbor on the other. The cut and polish wheel makes quick work of the lightening holes, but they do go pretty quick due to the flange on the holes, it kind of bites into it, but I would think 5 or less wheels would do the ribs. I think I have purchased 10 so far and have 5 left after about 80 percent of the sheet metal work done on the plane.
Using 2" maroon and then blue. I go over the edge once with maroon to hit the big stuff, then I go over the edge again with the blue and then hit both sides with the blue to smooth everything. That means 4 times I go over the rib with the roloc discs, but it goes pretty quick. The scallops make quick work of the pads, but I buy them from Amazon/Ebay for cheap. 50 pack of each I think would probably do the whole plane.
The faceting and getting in the 6 or so spots per rib that the roloc can't get kind of sucked, but with small files and then rolls of 3/4" emery in 220 and 400 is what I did. Flossing the teeth basically. Using a piece of masking tape folded over a few times fit inside the ~2-3" piece of emery I cut per wing rib gives it some thickness to easily sand the profile of the notch. Otherwise you end up with just a folded piece of flat emery which doesn't work well.
Just wait til you get to the spars and start attaching the ribs wondering why you spent so much time deburring, when Van's states that the condition that the spars are sent to you is "acceptable". I trust them because I didn't want to affect the anodizing, but it does make you question if you are spending a little too much time deburring. All worth it in the end though, as the wings really go together fairly quick once through the ribs.
Right or wrong, my process was two angle grinders. One has a 1" cut and polish wheel for the lightening holes, and I have a Roloc arbor on the other. The cut and polish wheel makes quick work of the lightening holes, but they do go pretty quick due to the flange on the holes, it kind of bites into it, but I would think 5 or less wheels would do the ribs. I think I have purchased 10 so far and have 5 left after about 80 percent of the sheet metal work done on the plane.
Using 2" maroon and then blue. I go over the edge once with maroon to hit the big stuff, then I go over the edge again with the blue and then hit both sides with the blue to smooth everything. That means 4 times I go over the rib with the roloc discs, but it goes pretty quick. The scallops make quick work of the pads, but I buy them from Amazon/Ebay for cheap. 50 pack of each I think would probably do the whole plane.
The faceting and getting in the 6 or so spots per rib that the roloc can't get kind of sucked, but with small files and then rolls of 3/4" emery in 220 and 400 is what I did. Flossing the teeth basically. Using a piece of masking tape folded over a few times fit inside the ~2-3" piece of emery I cut per wing rib gives it some thickness to easily sand the profile of the notch. Otherwise you end up with just a folded piece of flat emery which doesn't work well.
Just wait til you get to the spars and start attaching the ribs wondering why you spent so much time deburring, when Van's states that the condition that the spars are sent to you is "acceptable". I trust them because I didn't want to affect the anodizing, but it does make you question if you are spending a little too much time deburring. All worth it in the end though, as the wings really go together fairly quick once through the ribs.
I said the very same thing. I’m detail oriented and anal…so what!?
You’ll end up with a beauty, that’s likely an above average build.
I don’t want a ride in a 900-ish hour build…too scary. It took me 4 years and 4 months. It is what it is. Take your time, building is interesting and (mostly) fun.
You’ll end up with a beauty, that’s likely an above average build.
I don’t want a ride in a 900-ish hour build…too scary. It took me 4 years and 4 months. It is what it is. Take your time, building is interesting and (mostly) fun.
I recorded that it took me about 7 minutes per nose rib (7 1/2 hours total). My process was to use a large Scotchbrite wheel to deburr all the edges I could reach (2 passes, one on the inside, one on the outside), then I used 3M cloth (recommended somewhere else on this forum) to deburr between the flanges, and finally a 1" Scotchbrite wheel on a drill press to deburr the lightening holes. Finished with a quick finger check to make sure no sharp edges remained. I always wondered if I was doing too much or too little, but my technical advisor thought it was ok. Then I saw Van's video of the tests they put their laser cut pieces through and I wondered if it really mattered at all.
It was tedious at the time, but feels great when you're done and feel like you have a good set of parts. Assembly goes really quickly after that. Put the radio on, or an audio book and the time goes by quickly.
It was tedious at the time, but feels great when you're done and feel like you have a good set of parts. Assembly goes really quickly after that. Put the radio on, or an audio book and the time goes by quickly.
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
This is similar in time and scope to how I finished the ribs for my RV-6 27 years ago.
I revisited my build log where deburring and fluting the ribs occurred----9.5 hrs total. The plane is still flying.
I could help with transition training. I'm a CFI and have a good amount of time in the 7A, and 9A, and the 10. I'm in Ohio but I'd fly out for cost.
Thanks. I may reach out. Right now I'm training with Caleb Marsh. He is amazing and first day went well.
How did you mount the scotch brite disc in the drill press? Is it a special bit that grabs the disc? The only discs I see look like the regular maroon stuff but cut in a 6” circle
MechaSteve
Well Known Member
That 6" maroon disk is the main way I am deburring the inside of flanges. It won't move metal very fast, but it will absolutely knock off the burr on a punched or drilled hole.
I also have some smaller 7A (grey solid) wheels, 2" x 3/8", and 3" x 3/4", that I mount in a fairly standard drill mandrel.
I have found the key with those in the drill press is to dress the wheel with a diamond point tool. It's not really possible to mount them perfectly concentric, but they can be dressed to near perfection.
Thanks! Will give it a try.
