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Wing wiring

M

Mark Basel

I'm New Here
Hello, TIA I’m working on my -8 wing wiring/routing. I’m Using The recommended size of 5/8” holes from the bellcrank area to the wingtip/wing root ribs by opening up the tooling holes. I am debating using conduit and or just the snap in bushings. Has Anyone experienced issues with just the snap in bushing through the wing? I’m concerned about the wires getting beat up from vibration and just moving around unsecured between the ribs. With any conduit however I’m losing space for wires to travel through as I will be using using Flyleds. If anyone is using just the bushings, are you securing the wires through the wing as well as at the end ribs of the wing.? What are you using? waxed string, zip ties or something else?

Thanks

Mark
 
I’m
www.vansaircraft.com

Wing Wiring: Routing Wires in the Wings - Van's Aircraft Total Performance RV Kit Planes

There are a number of installations that require routing of wires and tubes in the wing. These may include nav lights, strobe lights, landing lights, heated pitot, nav antenna, autopilot, AOA and maybe a stall warning device. Listed here, in no particular preference, are some ways to run wires...
www.vansaircraft.com www.vansaircraft.com

I am the leading advocate for the nylon corrugated conduit. I used method 3 , the conduit through the lightning holes zip tie approach on quick build wings. If you use FAA AC 43.13 par 11-96 as a guide the nylon conduit with ties meets all guidelines. Also it suggests wires should not be laced except behind panels. Vans specified nylon. It is tougher and has a higher temperature rating than the box store polyethylene substitutes.

The wires for FlyLeds slide in without a pull-string. The wingtip conduit will handle any reasonable cable bundle. Add additional runs the autopilot, pitot as required.
 

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I have FlyLEDs and the black corrugated conduit. No issue with space or pulling wire. I use a section of Cat5 cable as a pull. Years as a "wirejock".
 
Little Wing said:
I'm probably in the minority, I ran everything through snaps secured with Adel's and click bonds.
Click to expand...
If you are in the minority then I am there with you. I have run many wires through snap bushings in many wings building several planes. Including my personal plane. My plane is over 14 years old now with no problems. Snap bushings make it easier to run more wires in the future.
 
Little Wing said:
I'm probably in the minority, I ran everything through snaps secured with Adel's and click bonds.
Click to expand...

I've used the snap bushings on two airplanes. They work very well, are light, inexpensive, and make it easy to fish new wires later. The wing rib spacing is close enough so the wires don't move or misbehave in any way.
 
I used conduit on my 3 builds. Both conduit or snap bushings will work. Comes down to personal preference. I find it easier to run additional wires through conduit than trying to fish through snap bushings...but that's just me.
 
wirejock said:
I have FlyLEDs and the black corrugated conduit. No issue with space or pulling wire. I use a section of Cat5 cable as a pull. Years as a "wirejock".
Click to expand...
Hey Larry. What did you use for a conduit in the 5/8” holes? Vans doesnt stock corrugated conduit that small and anything I’ve found elsewhere is split. I found the 5/8” OD cold water pipe from Lowes fits perfect but the ID diameter is only 7/16-1/2”, is that big enough for all the wires coming from the Flyled wingtip lighting? Guess there is only one way to find out and build the lights but would like to get the conduit/snap bushings figured out so I can finish skinning the bottom of the wing…
 
Little Wing said:
I'm probably in the minority, I ran everything through snaps secured with Adel's and click bonds.
Click to expand...
Nice clean look. Reminds me of all the wiring running along the top of the fuse interior of KC-135. There are hundreds of wires running through clamps and laced up. I see one clamp in your picture, where else did you use them?
Thanks
Mark
 
Mark Basel said:
Hey Larry. What did you use for a conduit in the 5/8” holes? Vans doesnt stock corrugated conduit that small and anything I’ve found elsewhere is split. I found the 5/8” OD cold water pipe from Lowes fits perfect but the ID diameter is only 7/16-1/2”, is that big enough for all the wires coming from the Flyled wingtip lighting? Guess there is only one way to find out and build the lights but would like to get the conduit/snap bushings figured out so I can finish skinning the bottom of the wing…
Click to expand...
Odd. I used the Vans black corrugated stuff.
store.vansaircraft.com

50' Nylon 5/8" Tube, Wire Loom

Corrugated Tube for Installing in Wing for Wiring Conduit
store.vansaircraft.com store.vansaircraft.com
 

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Mark Basel said:
K, hmm,I believe I have what you’re showing there, I believe that’s 3/4”OD and 5/8”ID.
Click to expand...
That's the stuff. The corrugated valleys are 5/8. It's not easy to install. Apply a dab of proseal at each rib to prevent vibration and rotation. Once it's done, wires slip right through. If a wire needs to ve routed mid span, drill a hole in the conduit with a pencil soldering iron. Stall wire for example. My OAT probe comes out mid span because it mounts to the outboard access panel.
 
wirejock said:
That's the stuff. The corrugated valleys are 5/8. It's not easy to install. Apply a dab of proseal at each rib to prevent vibration and rotation. Once it's done, wires slip right through. If a wire needs to ve routed mid span, drill a hole in the conduit with a pencil soldering iron. Stall wire for example. My OAT probe comes out mid span because it mounts to the outboard access panel.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the help! My project for today😝🤪
 
Little Wing said:
I'm probably in the minority, I ran everything through snaps secured with Adel's and click bonds.
Click to expand...
Same with my wings. I used snap bushings and ziptied the entire wire length. I added spiral wrap in the section of wire right above the wing access panels to prevent any chance of the #8 screws from punturing the wires.
 
Personal preference, I find it easier to push/pull wires through smooth wall conduit, rather than corrugated conduit. Harbor Freight Tool has a kit that is perfect for pulling/pushing wires through the wing: it consists of a bunch of fiberglass shafts, that you screw together sequentially, to push or pull the wire bundle through the wing. This allows you to work from inside the cockpit or where the wing is close to you hangar wall, because you are adding on a short shaft at a time.
 
The secret to easy conduit pulls is a pull string. Use 1/16” nylon string and pull it through with a vacuum cleaner or blow it through with compressed air. Most of the time blowing an air nozzle in the conduit will carry it right in. Tie a knot in the end of the string and fray a few inches of the end. Sometimes tying a little piece of foam in the end will help. Leave the string long enough so you can pull it back through half way when you are done. Leave it in the conduit for future expansion. The corrugated nylon pulls easily up to capacity. On the wing run I actually pushed the pull string through with the lighting wires. The other secret is to attach the pull string as close to the end of the wire as possible.
 
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Mark Basel said:
Nice clean look. Reminds me of all the wiring running along the top of the fuse interior of KC-135. There are hundreds of wires running through clamps and laced up. I see one clamp in your picture, where else did you use them?
Thanks
Mark
Click to expand...
I used clamps along the fuel tank z brackets then click bonds for the outboard wing spar.
 
My humble opinion...
A bit of advise from an old "wirejock". I've pulled wire in places most can't imagine. Everything from romex in Insulated walls to 200-pair telephone cable hundreds of feet long. Anyone ever heard Icky Pick? Yuk.

Once under a building in a crawl space. My flashlight went wacky. I got it lit and a pair of eyes was staring back. :oops:

Anyway. Strings are fine. However, they can get tangled. No idea how. Cat-5 or any four pair telephone wire works great. If your pushing it, fold the end over about 1/2". If your pulling, strip a foot of jacket and lace the pairs into a loop. Wrap the wires in the loop. Tape any wires that might catch. Pull the wires in along with a new pull wire. I'm not a fan of string. I've snapped too many. That ribbon stuff rocks. If you see a fiber job, ask for some. It will handle ridiculous amount of tension and weighs very little.
 
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Mark Basel said:
Hey Larry. What did you use for a conduit in the 5/8” holes? Vans doesnt stock corrugated conduit that small and anything I’ve found elsewhere is split. I found the 5/8” OD cold water pipe from Lowes fits perfect but the ID diameter is only 7/16-1/2”, is that big enough for all the wires coming from the Flyled wingtip lighting? Guess there is only one way to find out and build the lights but would like to get the conduit/snap bushings figured out so I can finish skinning the bottom of the wing…
Click to expand...
Drilled 3/4 holes per Vans and installed 5/8 snap bushings. I used 5/8 OD 9/16 ID FEP. All up (including snap bushing and proseal) weighs about 1.4lbs for both wings. I believe that much PVC pipe from Lowe’s is about 3.5lbs all by itself. PVC is also much cheaper. I bought my FEP surplus $2/ft. I think it goes for about 3.80/ft which is pricey compared to pvc. I probably spent an extra $25 over pvc to save 2lbs and have clear tubing.
The Heyco bushing was slightly less than 5/8 and I had to procure a different one that was truly 5/8 so the tubing would go through easily.

FEP is an alternative to PTFE. It’s very low coefficient of friction and has other very good properties. It is also available in clear. Being thin walled saves weight.

I’d imagine the corrugated from Vans is the lighter and cheaper option but with those funky ribs
 
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Tefzel wire is incredibly durable, and the snap bushings have a fairly wide flange. We opted to avoid the conduit for these reasons.
 
wirejock said:
My humble opinion...
A bit of advise from an old "wirejock". I've pulled wire in places most can't imagine. Everything from romex in Insulated walls to 200-pair telephone cable hundreds of feet long. Anyone ever heard Icky Pick? Yuk.

Once under a building in a crawl space. My flashlight went wacky. I got it lit and a pair of eyes was staring back. :oops:

Anyway. Strings are fine. However, they can get tangled. No idea how. Cat-5 or any four pair telephone wire works great. If your pushing it, fold the end over about 1/2". If your pulling, strip a foot of jacket and lace the pairs into a loop. Wrap the wires in the loop. Tape any wires that might catch. Pull the wires in along with a new pull wire. I'm not a fan of string. I've snapped too many. That ribbon stuff rocks. If you see a fiber job, ask for some. It will handle ridiculous amount of tension and weighs very little.
Click to expand...
Dawn dishwashing detergent is the bomb for removing icky pick, cleaned many a bird covered in that goo.
 
Dr_Dave_MT said:
Dawn dishwashing detergent is the bomb for removing icky pick, cleaned many a bird covered in that goo.
Click to expand...
Birds?
Maybe a different product.
Icky Pick is a tradesman's term for wire pulling lubricant . It's squirted into the conduit before pulling the cable. You can imagine what it's like when you grab the wire on the other end. Hence the term Icky Pick. Nasty stuff, but washes off. Kind of a cross between Jello and dishwashing detergent.
 
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IMG_4436.jpeg

I did the snap bushings thing.
It’s still a work in progress, but I’m running out of space in the right wing. With the roll servo, lights, GMU11 there’s not a lot of room.
 
wirejock said:
Birds?
Maybe a different product.
Icky Pick is a tradesman's term for wire pulling lubricant . It's squirted into the conduit before pulling the cable. You can imagine what it's like when you grab the wire on the other end. Hence the term Icky Pick. Nasty stuff, but washes off. Kind of a cross between Jello and dishwashing detergent.
Click to expand...
I think it was a similar product, we could not use petroleum cleaners on the birds, regular soap wouldn’t work without messing up their wings.

Icky-pick - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
I used thin wall (.016) 3/8 dia aluminum tubing in my -4. Not much weight. I have seen, and would use 1/2" pex tubing, which is very light and very cheap also. The convolute (corrigated) is floppy and not my favorite to work with.
 
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