RV10 (planning phase)

[RNB]

Background: I own a nice C172 but desire more speed. I have found going 182 route of limited benefit due to small improvement. Was surprised how much I liked test flight with Zach, now build obsessed. Starting AP school in August of 2024, otherwise retired. To build at home I'd want to get a nice set up ready, have some things in mind. I took a video of the proposed area, looking for further ideas and feedback. The building is a 60x16 three sided shed. I'd likely enclose either 30x16 (the middle section plus one half of concrete floor area), 50x16 (I think best, half the concrete section plus the rest), or else 40x16 (just the rock floor area). I already have a nice air compressor. There is 100 amp service at the building, I'd aim for LED lights overhead, outlets along the walls, and a ductless mini split HVAC system for the whole area. Is any of the equipment for the build voltage sensitive? We have solar at our house, each of our inverters adds a volt to the load to "push" excess generation back to the street. Sometimes we see 253V on our 240V circuits and have to get a fancy transformer to step down the HVAC line voltage. Nothing else in the house affected. I'd probably consider a taller bench system as I am 6'6", aim to have most outlets above the benches. What kind of finish should I put on the floors? I can paint over concrete, or maybe some tile? I think of bare concrete as maybe being too dusty? Should I leave the space all open or close off 10x16 area for priming/painting? If I enclose for paint, how should I evacuate the air? How wide of a garage door do I need for kits and getting the wheeled plane out? The building has solar on it with some screwed penetrations, minimal leakage. I wonder if I should make a flat interior ceiling with overtop decked roof. This would prevent any water getting in and add some minimal dry though cramped storage. I'd consider spray foam insulation for tightness.

My plan would be to do the following, most of it hired out:
Clean up space
Contract out concrete pour
Rough in framing
Install siding
Rough in electric
Insulate
Interior walls
finish electric
install doors

I think this could end being a fun but frustrating project. I think I will cover the walls with other peoples first flight photos for motivation.

How does this space look to you and what would you do differently than I propose?
Video below

 

[rocketman1988]

Looks like you have some good options. Realize that the rv-10 is not a small aircraft; once you put the tailbone and forward fuselage together, it will be nearly 6 feet wide at the spar carry through and around 17 feet long without the engine. Once on the landing gear, it will be more than 8 feet wide to the outside of the axle nuts. The wing sections are around 14 feet long.

Concerning your benches, check out the EAA bench plans available online. They work really well and if you put them on casters, you can roll them around. This is a nice feature as the shop layout can be changed as your build progresses. If you build stationary benches against the wall, remember to subtract that distance from the useable build area in that section of the shop.

I have bare concrete floors in my shop and they work fine, however, standing on concrete for hours on end can be hard on a body. I used some 1/2" thick exercise mats to stand on.

Dust is a definite enemy, so closing in your shop would be recommended. Along with that, rodents, especially mice, are incredibly bad for you project. Mouse urine is exceptionally corrosive to aluminum, and they love to get into everything.

It is good to have some electrical outlets over the benches but realize that the cord from the outlet will have to go over the bench as well. That can be problematic at times. For parts that I couldn't use my drill press, I used 12v dewalt cordless drills; small, light, easily maneuverable. I also used a pneumatic drill but found that the cordless was much more convenient than dragging a hose everywhere.

I opted to have a professional paint my aircraft, so I can't comment on the paint booth. I can comment on priming, though. It will add significant time and effort to your build. The question you have to ask is whether you are building an aircraft that will last 100 years or 150 years... : > }

Heating and cooling is a good thing if you plan on building year round. Of note is that the salts in your sweat are corrosive to aluminum. Don't believe me? Put a sweaty palm on a piece of aluminum sheet then check it in a couple of days!

Good lighting is very important. I have had good luck with Hyperlight LEDs.

 

[RNB]

Looks like you have some good options. Realize that the rv-10 is not a small aircraft; once you put the tailbone and forward fuselage together, it will be nearly 6 feet wide at the spar carry through and around 17 feet long without the engine. Once on the landing gear, it will be more than 8 feet wide to the outside of the axle nuts. The wing sections are around 14 feet long.

Concerning your benches, check out the EAA bench plans available online. They work really well and if you put them on casters, you can roll them around. This is a nice feature as the shop layout can be changed as your build progresses. If you build stationary benches against the wall, remember to subtract that distance from the useable build area in that section of the shop.

I have bare concrete floors in my shop and they work fine, however, standing on concrete for hours on end can be hard on a body. I used some 1/2" thick exercise mats to stand on.

Dust is a definite enemy, so closing in your shop would be recommended. Along with that, rodents, especially mice, are incredibly bad for you project. Mouse urine is exceptionally corrosive to aluminum, and they love to get into everything.

It is good to have some electrical outlets over the benches but realize that the cord from the outlet will have to go over the bench as well. That can be problematic at times. For parts that I couldn't use my drill press, I used 12v dewalt cordless drills; small, light, easily maneuverable. I also used a pneumatic drill but found that the cordless was much more convenient than dragging a hose everywhere.

I opted to have a professional paint my aircraft, so I can't comment on the paint booth. I can comment on priming, though. It will add significant time and effort to your build. The question you have to ask is whether you are building an aircraft that will last 100 years or 150 years... : > }

Heating and cooling is a good thing if you plan on building year round. Of note is that the salts in your sweat are corrosive to aluminum. Don't believe me? Put a sweaty palm on a piece of aluminum sheet then check it in a couple of days!

Good lighting is very important. I have had good luck with Hyperlight LEDs.

Thanks for the measurements, was not sure how wide to make the garage door. It will be interesting to see how things go engine time. I am expecting to get an airport hangar in the next year.

EAA benches planned, perhaps for all benches.

Will evaluate priming and paint as I go. It seems like a good idea, but I do want to end up flying whilst able.

Will check out Hyperlight LEDs

 

[Auburntsts]

Good foresight on getting the hangar now vs later. That said, unless said hangar is 5 min or less from your house, try and stay in your workshop as long as possible before moving out to the hangar. Otherwise there a good chance your productivity will take a major hit.

 

[rocketman1988]

Good foresight on getting the hangar now vs later. That said, unless said hangar is 5 min or less from your house, try and stay in your workshop as long as possible before moving out to the hangar. Otherwise there a good chance your productivity will take a major hit.

You beat me to it...

Having to travel to build makes you time a lot less productive, that's for sure.

 

[RNB]

Good foresight on getting the hangar now vs later. That said, unless said hangar is 5 min or less from your house, try and stay in your workshop as long as possible before moving out to the hangar. Otherwise there a good chance your productivity will take a major hit.

the hangar is for current plane until I absolutely need it for the 10. 7 miles away. No AC there.

 

[Auburntsts]

the hangar is for current plane until I absolutely need it for the 10. 7 miles away. No AC there.

Being able to work in comfort is a plus. I started off my project in Northern Virginia in my finished basement. Eventually when I had to relocate to the garage and ultimately the hangar I was only comfortable for about half the year (Spring & Fall). Otherwise, I alternatly froze or broiled. Of the 2 conditions I accept being broiled over freezing, but that's a personal preference. I'm living that dream today here in Florida as I conduct my 10th condition inspection sweating my hiney off and contemplating why I haven't changed the date to December vs June.

 

[rocketman1988]

Being able to work in comfort is a plus. I started off my project in Northern Virginia in my finished basement. Eventually when I had to relocate to the garage and ultimately the hangar I was only comfortable for about half the year (Spring & Fall). Otherwise, I alternatly froze or broiled. Of the 2 conditions I accept being broiled over freezing, but that's a personal preference. I'm living that dream today here in Florida as I conduct my 10th condition inspection sweating my hiney off and contemplating why I haven't changed the date to December vs June.

Yeah, in SE Indiana, I started with a corporate heated/air conditioned hangar. The CI was in November. Due to the sale of the airport, I was forced out and I to an unheated or airconditioned hangar. Needless to say, my new CI date is a far more reasonable September/October.

 

[imrah6]

I am building my RV-10 tail, after much delay getting in 4 to 5 hours a day, mostly after 12 noon.

I spent 2 years prepping my shop which is 24 x 36 with a 12 ft x 12 ft door. The floor is 8 inches of concrete with epoxy coating. The walls and roof (peak is 18ft) are all covered with 3" rigid styrofoam (R15) and I have a 36k BTU Mr. Cool minisplit, v4 which is DIY.

The building it is in is a 48 x 36 barn with 2 side sheds. I formed the concrete floor with a friend, had the concrete company deliver the concrete and hired a couple of guys to do the leveling. The dividing wall between the barn and workshop is 2 x 6 x 12' at the edges and 18' in the centre, built with the assistance of the same friend. I put in all the electrical and plumbing. Lots of outlets. I built a home studio before and put lots of outlets in there too. You can never have too many.

I have 2 benches 12ft x 2ft along wall sections and a 6 x 8 bathroom in one corner with toilet, hand basin, hot and cold water, shower and just outside I have a laundry sink.

I also have a partial attic floor at 11ft which has some carpet on it for stashing sub-assembled parts and other stuff out of the way.

I currently have 2 surveillance cameras on an 8 x 4 bench which is on wheels and I have 2 drawers, 4 x 2 just underneath the surface where I keep all my tools.

I have a 4ft electric plug strip on one end of the bench that I will probably move as I want to put surface extensions at each end to give me 12 to 16ft when I need it. I also have these strips on the front of my wall benches as well as 2 x 4 way outlets on the wall above each bench.

I have another 2 x 4 bench on wheels onto which I mounted my dimpler with another surveillance camera, and plan to build another with a flipping top to install my drill press on one side and grinder / deburr wheel on the other.

I have every work surface with a close surveillance camera that will record video and also take snapshots while there is motion in front of the camera.

I am using the cameras for transmitting live video while I am working and creating an online log while I am building. At some point after finishing building I will edit the videos but in the meantime I am just putting them up on the web site with some related build comments.

Oh yes, I have tunes , a tv, a dart board, a small fridge and keurig.

It is an incredibly comfortable place to work.

As for priming...I am using the P60G2 primer and reducer and plan to prime everything. Vans suggested scuffing with grey 3M and cleaning with isopropyl alcohol. I did have a scratch in one of the fuse sheets which I removed with wet and dry and primed immediately with zinc phosphate from a rattle can.

I have 2 * 500 watt high bay lights and 6 strips from HF. It's like daylight. I also have 2 roller parts racks from HF and I put velcro on the boxes because they're too easy to knock off the rack.

I also bought a really cheap $300 bandsaw from HF. I built 4 practice projects and I was not happy with the tin snip results hence the bandsaw. I used the bandsaw to trim the rudder spar caps and it worked great ! Well worth the money (as is the C-frame dimpler at $500).

My web site is www.myeabuild.com. and if I am working on the build the video will be streaming, otherwise the archive clips will be there. Generally, my goal is to work M-F from sometime between 12 noon and 1:00 p.m. until around 5:00 p.m. Saturdays I could be in the workshop most of the day, or not at all, and Sundays after church and lunch.

I will try to post the previous day's videos and snapshots first thing in the morning following.

 

[PhatRV]

I am building my RV-10 tail, after much delay getting in 4 to 5 hours a day, mostly after 12 noon.

I spent 2 years prepping my shop which is 24 x 36 with a 12 ft x 12 ft door. The floor is 8 inches of concrete with epoxy coating. The walls and roof (peak is 18ft) are all covered with 3" rigid styrofoam (R15) and I have a 36k BTU Mr. Cool minisplit, v4 which is DIY.

The building it is in is a 48 x 36 barn with 2 side sheds. I formed the concrete floor with a friend, had the concrete company deliver the concrete and hired a couple of guys to do the leveling. The dividing wall between the barn and workshop is 2 x 6 x 12' at the edges and 18' in the centre, built with the assistance of the same friend. I put in all the electrical and plumbing. Lots of outlets. I built a home studio before and put lots of outlets in there too. You can never have too many.

I have 2 benches 12ft x 2ft along wall sections and a 6 x 8 bathroom in one corner with toilet, hand basin, hot and cold water, shower and just outside I have a laundry sink.

I also have a partial attic floor at 11ft which has some carpet on it for stashing sub-assembled parts and other stuff out of the way.

I currently have 2 surveillance cameras on an 8 x 4 bench which is on wheels and I have 2 drawers, 4 x 2 just underneath the surface where I keep all my tools.

I have a 4ft electric plug strip on one end of the bench that I will probably move as I want to put surface extensions at each end to give me 12 to 16ft when I need it. I also have these strips on the front of my wall benches as well as 2 x 4 way outlets on the wall above each bench.

I have another 2 x 4 bench on wheels onto which I mounted my dimpler with another surveillance camera, and plan to build another with a flipping top to install my drill press on one side and grinder / deburr wheel on the other.

I have every work surface with a close surveillance camera that will record video and also take snapshots while there is motion in front of the camera.

I am using the cameras for transmitting live video while I am working and creating an online log while I am building. At some point after finishing building I will edit the videos but in the meantime I am just putting them up on the web site with some related build comments.

Oh yes, I have tunes , a tv, a dart board, a small fridge and keurig.

It is an incredibly comfortable place to work.

As for priming...I am using the P60G2 primer and reducer and plan to prime everything. Vans suggested scuffing with grey 3M and cleaning with isopropyl alcohol. I did have a scratch in one of the fuse sheets which I removed with wet and dry and primed immediately with zinc phosphate from a rattle can.

I have 2 * 500 watt high bay lights and 6 strips from HF. It's like daylight. I also have 2 roller parts racks from HF and I put velcro on the boxes because they're too easy to knock off the rack.

I also bought a really cheap $300 bandsaw from HF. I built 4 practice projects and I was not happy with the tin snip results hence the bandsaw. I used the bandsaw to trim the rudder spar caps and it worked great ! Well worth the money (as is the C-frame dimpler at $500).

My web site is www.myeabuild.com. and if I am working on the build the video will be streaming, otherwise the archive clips will be there. Generally, my goal is to work M-F from sometime between 12 noon and 1:00 p.m. until around 5:00 p.m. Saturdays I could be in the workshop most of the day, or not at all, and Sundays after church and lunch.

I will try to post the previous day's videos and snapshots first thing in the morning following.

You should make very steady and quick progress if you keep up the schedule like this. When I was building, I made the most progress during my vacation at home. I worked about 8 hours a day and it is incredible how much the airplane is build if I kept on a steady workman like schedule.

 

[imrah6]

You should make very steady and quick progress if you keep up the schedule like this. When I was building, I made the most progress during my vacation at home. I worked about 8 hours a day and it is incredible how much the airplane is build if I kept on a steady workman like schedule.

That's the plan...I got a bit delayed, having started on May 31, by ruining one of the 1014 rudder spar caps and then having to take care of the orchard trees and some travel. This week is my first solid week. I do practice piano in the morning for 2 hours which is why I am not on it 8 hours a day, plus I need to catch up my web log which I will do over the next few days.

Thanks for the encouragement. I really paid attention to the "make your workshop convenient and comfortable" mantra, which is why that took so long (plus we had to have the barn built and run power to it).

Did we meet you at Sun-N-Fun this year at the AOPA 85th party ?