What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Radio Call - RV use in initial calls to controller / tower

N395V said:
I will continue to use experimental as a descriptor in my communications.
Click to expand...
OK, the pet peeve police will grant you an exemption due to your unique circumstance. ;)

The rest of you flying garden vaiety RVs have no excuse, though.

On a serious note, have you considered using a more descriptive initial call up, like "Rocket 91TX, white low-wing, ......" This might eliminate some of the back and forth on the radio. Just a thought.
 
I've actually thought of using Bearcat 91TX in the hopes most people would look for something shaped like an F8 with a round motor.
 
"Experimental"

Kahuna said:
Does anyone know what the original intent of this op lims language was?
Did/Do tower controllers handle experimental planes differently?
Why the language in the op lims. There must be a reason for it.
Perhaps controllers pay extra attention to experimental planes?
Click to expand...

I believe this was to provide controllers options for special routing for "experimental Aircraft" around populated areas. I think this was a cause- effect case after an 80's fatal accident with ground casualties. But my long term memory is "fussy logic"....
 
Our OpLims say we must identify ourselves as EXPERIMENTAL on INITIAL CALL to ATC. I use RV tail-number EXPERIMENTAL on ALL FIRST calls. I then use RV tail-number after that.

It does not mater if it is RV-3, 4, 6, 8, 9, or 10 as the stall speeds are all close. IMHO, Using EXPERIMANAL Tail-Number or EXPERIMENTAL Color is a very very very poor choice as the EXPERIMENTAL could be a very slow flying Kitfox, SX-300, or one of the FAST glass airplanes. Does not tell me anything about the speed capability of the airplane behind or infront of me.

I like to keep all radio communications as SHORT and INFORMATIVE as possible.
 
YEP!

bigbill25 said:
So, will a RV-12 built E-LSA, not E-AB, still have to state experimental on first contact with Tower/ATC?

--Bill
Click to expand...

Experimental is experimental! Your operating limitations will have the same statement as amateur-built.
 
allbee said:
I agree, I flew into spokane international, class c, and told them experimental, they wanted to know the type, I came back with rv7, they started calling me rv287rv after that.
Click to expand...

I was thinking about this earlier. When I contact a controller for the 1st time, it's goes something like this:

me: xyz approach, experimental 32ww
atc: experimental 32ww, xyz approach
me: 32ww is a rv7/g, 2 miles north abc, passing 1 point 9, would like flight following to abc

From then on, its always n32ww or rv32ww and I don't hear experimental again.

It would seem that you satisfiy the requirements. I guess I don't really think much it since the airport I fly out of is adjacent to class c airspace and almost every flight we are talking with them.
 
Last edited:
My experience with ATC has me contacting them now with "lex approach, rv 727bm with you at......." All other communication from ATC is always RV7BM or just 7BM......"could you make an immediate left turn on climbout past the tower....."

I'm with Webb here, RV is now in the FAA ATC data base. Identifying myself as RV up front just avoids additional clarification with additional radio chatter. ATC is aware of the speed of RV's so, my take is, they know what to expect out of you.

At uncontrolled I've just gone to RV 7BM.

Go ahead, slap me with a wet noodle:D
 
ATC ID: "Experimental" vs "RV" or "Vans"

Has there been any discussion regarding how RV drivers identify themselves to ACT? My standard "Experimental 95RV" doesn't seem to provide the type of AC info that I expected it would - and at airports unfamiliar with my plane the controllers seldom know if they are dealing with a Lance air 4 or a Kitfox. I've heard other's ID themselves as "Lance air 123" or "Glass air 123" and was wondering if I too should provide more detail: "Experimental RV 95 Romeo Victor?" "Experimental Van's 95 Romeo Victor?" or just "RV / Van's 95 Romeo Victor?" Sounds like a mouth full...
 
I've heard "experimental RV" used a bunch of times when pilots are away from their own airport.... otherwise at the uncontrolled home airport they usually just say "RV ###"

I know there are some ATC guys who frequent this forum so maybe they will have some words of wisdom :)
 
Last edited:
There is one legal requirement for saying "experimental"; this legalism serves no other useful purpose. Always say the type; it helps everyone.

John Siebold
 
My Operating Limitations require that I identify the Experimental nature of the aircraft on the INITIAL call to a Control Tower and in the REMARKS section when filling an IFR Flight Plan.

I use: RV 157 Golf Sierra Experimental and the request or position, altitude, ATIS, request. I drop the EXPERIMENTAL for approach control and CTAF. I always use RV first to help identify the type of aircraft.

See some of the other threads.
 
I always use Experimental never RV

I always use Experimental never RV. As had been mentioned before this has been cussed and discussed to death.

Bob Axsom
 
Bob Axsom said:
I always use Experimental never RV. As had been mentioned before this has been cussed and discussed to death.

Bob Axsom
Click to expand...
Well I have probably talked about it before too, but experimental alone just doesn't help anyone else. I really like to know if you are a Breezy or a P-51 or something in between. It gives a lot of useful information like speed and what do you look like.
 
Checking in...

Wouldn't it be more helpful to identify by all of the important stuff?

"Center, this is Experimental Romeo Victor with a Tailwheel and slider, and primed with AZCO, checking in with EFIS..." :cool:

Just another thread to add to the never-ending debate.
 
Yup - talked to death - and I am with Larry - "Experimental" by itself is completely useless to anyone on the frequency...you might as well just say "airplane" - except that then you don't sound as "cool" I suppose.

The radio is to communicate useful information. Evaluate everything you say, and how you say it relative to how useful it is to others. THINK about what you do when you fly, and why you do it.

I use "Experiemntal" when required - that means on the initial call to an Air Traffic Control Tower (only).
 
I think the initial question was identification to ATC... RV alone won't really help, are you an RV12 or an RV10...? I think ATC can figure out your speed rather quickly. :D You'd be surprised what your N# can tell them. :)
 
Last edited:
What do you call yourself on the radio?

When calling a controller, or when checking in with a new controller along your flight plan route, how do you refer to yourself?

"Experimental N1234?"

"RV N1234?"

Something else?

-----------------
And, what do the controllers call you?
 
Call sign

On initial call I use "Experimental RV 898 Delta Kilo." Using just Experimental and your tail number is okay but usually the next communication is "What type Experimental?" So I try to shorten the exchanges. After that first call it's up to the controller to designate what he wants to call you, e.g. Your full call sign or a shortened version.

For uncontrolled airports I use "Red RV 8 Delta Kilo". I don't see the point of using the full number as no one is there at an uncontrolled strip to see it or use it for clarity. I'd rather state my aircraft color so others in the pattern can differentiate a red airplane from a white one, etc. I figure it might make all the difference in preventing a mistaken identity someday.

Chris
 
Just the Facts!

Experimental one x-ray sierra. Occasionally asked for the entire call sign (November one x-ray Sierra).
 
Depends.

With a control tower the initial call is Experimental NXXXX, then followed by type.
With ATC I use RVXXXX.
When at uncontrolled fields I dispense with any numbers and just say red RV10 or such so everyone knows what to look for.

Vic
 
With a Tower I use: RV157GS Experimental.

With ATC I use: RV157GS.

Using Experimental 157GS is not clear as to what kind of Experimental the aircraft is. Experimental 12345 could be a Kitfox or a Glassair III. Both have different landing speeds and flight speeds near an airport. For a Controller to sequence the fight with others in a busy environment, they need to know more than Experimental with the least amount of radio chatter.

OpLims only require that I identify my self as Experimental to a tower and in the REMARKS section of an IFR flight plan.
 
For communications with any controller I use "Experimental White RV N509PE"

For uncontrolled airspace I use "Experimental White RV"
 
I use "Experimental N331JH". I found around here if I add "RV" it adds confusion and 80-90% of the time they hear "Army". Lots of Army traffic around here and near Fort Hood.
 
Here are the ICAO codes for the RVs along with the weight category. That's what the controllers see on a flight plan.

RV10 Vans RV-10 L
RV3 Vans RV-3 L
RV4 Vans RV-4 L
RV4T Vans RV-4T L
RV6 Vans RV-6 L
RV7 Vans RV-7 L
RV8 Vans RV-8 L
RV9 Vans RV-9 L

This begs the question, what is an RV-4T?
 
I was ferrying a AirForce B2 driver home one day and we started talking about this. One thing that stuck with me is he said he always takes the time to start every communication with a "good morning" or similar greeting, it makes it more personal and communications friendlier, nobody is too busy to be nice, I do the same now.
 
Will the correct answer please stand up

I see lots of opinions here, and lots of "this is what I say", but really there is only one correct answer, and I'll save that for last.

First, there is no distinction between Tower and ATC. They are all ATC (ground, clearance delivery, tower, departure, approach, center).

Secondly, you are required to identify yourself to ATC as "experimental". (Actually, only to a tower per 91.139)

Third, you may identify yourself to other pilots any way you believe conveys the important information: Size, shape, speed, color, model, call sign, etc.

Lastly, For ATC I identify myself as call sign "Experimental 58DG" When I ask for services, it's call sign, type, and equipment suffix "Experimental 58DG, a Hotel X-Ray Bravo Slant Gulf" The HXB is for homebuilt/experimental cruise speed 100-200 kts. The /G is for the GPS.
At my non-towered field I am "Blue and silver RV"

Respectfully,

Don
 
Last edited:
cfiidon said:
I see lots of opinions here, and lots of "this is what I say", but really there is only one correct answer, and I'll save that for last.

First, there is no distinction between Tower and ATC. They are all ATC (ground, clearance delivery, tower, departure, approach, center).

Secondly, you are required to identify yourself to ATC as "experimental".

Don
Click to expand...

I'll add my opinion too. I disagree with the above opinion.

ref: FAR 91.319 "(d) Each person operating an aircraft that has an experimental certificate shall --" (3) Notify the control tower of the experimental nature of the aircraft when operating the aircraft into or out of airports with operating control towers."
 
I now stand corrected

That's what happens when you stick your neck out. "Experimental" only required to a tower.

To any other ATC, "November 58DG", or "Experimental 58DG".

Although not regulatory, the AIM says
"3. Civil aircraft pilots should state the aircraft type, model or manufacturer's name, followed by the digits/letters of the registration number. When the aircraft manufacturer's name or model is stated, the prefix "N" is dropped; e.g., Aztec Two Four Six Four Alpha."
 
The RV 10 is our second airplane, thus the number 210LM.

I found that if I do not identity myself as an experimental, the guys on the ground almost always call me a Centurion.

I have learned to call in as Experimental 210LM, sometimes they will ask what kind of experimental but usually not.
 
On initial call up I say "experimental RV, 48 Hotel Tango".After that I parrot back whatever they say. 30% of the time they drop 'RV', 60% of the time they drop 'experimental'. The other 10% ATC keeps both.
 
Mike S said:
I have learned to call in as Experimental 210LM, sometimes they will ask what kind of experimental but usually not.
Click to expand...

Same here - experimental XXX. Maybe 1 in 20 times I get asked what I am. I'm fairly strict about concise radio comms, but also agree with Walt's post and have done it for years. I have found that a quick good morning/afternoon/evening has often done wonders as far as getting worked in, etc. Also, the bottom line is that controllers are part of the system as I am and I look at them as having a vital role in my safe, efficient flight - I want to treat them as friends. I have a few places where I will not do this - Potomac, Houston, etc. When I sit and wait 5 minutes for a free second of air time, I will forego the salutations:D
 
For whatever reason ATC/Tower always gets my "N" wrong (N524AP) About 90% of the time. Sooo... on my initial call up (other than my home field) I say "N524AP, is an Experimental RV..etc". At non-towered fields I am just "yellow RV".

I suspect that EVERY controller knows that an "RV" is an experimental. So I really think just say "RV" is clear enough. I wonder if it really matters? On the other hand, I have had NY center chew me out for saying "nine" instead of "niner".
 
All of my cross country flying is IFR. The FAA now has RV10 as an official aircraft designation. When leaving my controlled field (IFR or otherwise) I contact the tower with Experimental XXXX. For the remainder of the flight I use N XXXX for all frequency changes and hand-offs.
I believe this meets the requirements of FAR 91.319 (d) and I have never been questioned.
 
BobTurner said:
On initial call up I say "experimental RV, 48 Hotel Tango".After that I parrot back whatever they say. 30% of the time they drop 'RV', 60% of the time they drop 'experimental'. The other 10% ATC keeps both.
Click to expand...

I do the same. As a former ATC, I think most ATC would prefer this style.

Bob
 
My habit is to regularly use Flight Following, and often communicate with HOU APPCH while staying below the Class B.

I start 95% percent of my radio calls as "Experimental Two Two Niner Romeo Victor". If ATC gives me a multi-airspace transponder code about half the time they ask me what type RV. I like when they guess/ask if I'm an -8!

Rarely I'll call myself "Yellow RV", just when an uncontrolled pattern is getting busy, or added to my radio message to Ground Control at startup.

Carl
 
Last edited:
Glad to see old thread revived. First 15 or so pages I was reading while still building and not even having Private Pilot License. Now I have my own stories :D


You would be surprised how many busy tower controllers don't know what RV is. I fly a lot within triple class B over Greater New York and often talk to all three towers. Newark and Kennedy are better informed they handle some small fixed wing VFR traffic, the third tower on weekends usually has little clue on experimentals. Once I was asked if I am a jet followed by what maximum airspeed I can go. Jeez I only asked for couple circles over Central Park. Next time they just called me a helicopter 6 beekei...
I know they are overloaded and their routes are structured but sometimes (my guess) when they hear heavy accented "experimental xxx" they say aircraft calling standby. RV moves and in no time you are past your point. Sometimes I identify myself as experimental on second call. Greetings, N-number, location and request on first contact. On second I declare "an experimental" and politely ask what I want. Never hurts to ask for more :D


Non towered or self announcing depends on situation. Nobody cares what my N number is, Silver Experimental would be easier for a student pilot in the pattern to identify. Circling the Statue of Liberty I call myself "fixed wing" and make position reports as tour helicopters do. It makes them aware of the danger. Several times helo drivers said they have RV in sight. I didn't say a word to identify, just usual "fixed wing".


Now I would appreciate some advice based on above situations. Flight Following is much easier controllers are familiar with "Army" airplanes. I know McGuire Approach in my woods is. :)
 
Interesting Thread

I have been flying for a year now and have never identified myself by Experimental. Its always RV - 704CH. Maybe that is because most of my flying up in Seattle is RV country, but I hear RV calls all the time. In fact, if I hear an "experimental" call, I assume it is not an RV.

Also, I understand that "RV" is now recognized and legal to use when identifying yourself as well, can someone confirm? I have never had anyone challenge it. Identifying by RV tells tower/ATC a lot about your performance as well, which is valuable.

I have had an interesting thing happen with flight following, I announce myself and several times they have come back and asked what "type" RV are you? I indicate -7 and they fill in their boxes and I proceed with the flight. Leads me to believe they have "RV" in their system and just need a type.

Thx
 
It's interesting how I've seen this change in just four years. I used to fly a CTLS quite a bit, and I used to have to lead with "experimental" and add type when asked. Nowadays I can specify CT when I fly at my old FBO.

Vlad - kudos for being willing to put up with that much hassle around NYC. I thought LAX airspace was bad.
 
"Experimental RV - 35 Papa Mike" on my first call. A few times I have been asked what 'Type of RV', but mostly they respond with calls for 35 or 5 Papa Mike.

When they call me as 5 Papa Mike, that's how I answer.
 
I used to identify as RV 664SB. I was in a particularly stressed situation once in decreasing visibility trying to pick up an IFR clearance, and ATC understood me as "Army", not RV, which wasted time as conditions quickly deteriorated. Now I identify as "experimental", and if asked, I'm a Romeo Victor 6 slant Gulf.
 
I have been following this thread with interest, since I don't know just how I will identify myself on initial call.
My registered "manufacturer designation is "Air Force 1". I don't think calling in "Experimental Air Force One 461 Delta Golf would tell much, so I expect to just use "Experimental 461 Delta Golf". My problem comes in when they ask what type experimental I am flying, I am sure "Air Force One" is probably not the answer they are looking for.
pmccoy said:
"Experimental RV - 35 Papa Mike" on my first call. A few times I have been asked what 'Type of RV', but mostly they respond with calls for 35 or 5 Papa Mike.

When they call me as 5 Papa Mike, that's how I answer.
Click to expand...
 
An 'N' Number Containing 'RV' doesn't Help

When registering my RV6-A in 1995 I chose "N-95RV" thinking that it would help ATC and other A/C know what I was flying. Didn't help much then and doesn't seem to work as often as I would like now. Too often I find that I have created a bit of confusion between my 'N' number and my type of aircraft: "N-95RV say again type of aircraft" to which I reply "95 Romeo Victor is an RV6". It also doesn't help that "5" and "9-er" are both a mouthful and sound too similar.
 
Flight following up and down the East Coast this weekend. Always checked in as "Experimental Two Eight Romeo Victor". Only once did a controller come back with "RV Two Eight Romeo Victor" most often they just skipped "experimental". Acknowledgements from me thereafter were either "Eight Romeo Victor", "Three zero zero three, wilco", "Beaufort on Twenty five twelve, good day" Not standard, but communications brevity was beaten into my head long ago, and unless I get complaints about non-standard communications, I am going to keep at it.
 
Vlad said:
...Non towered or self announcing depends on situation. Nobody cares what my N number is, Silver Experimental would be easier for a student pilot in the pattern to identify. Circling the Statue of Liberty I call myself "fixed wing" and make position reports as tour helicopters do. It makes them aware of the danger. Several times helo drivers said they have RV in sight. I didn't say a word to identify, just usual "fixed wing".


Now I would appreciate some advice based on above situations. Flight Following is much easier controllers are familiar with "Army" airplanes. I know McGuire Approach in my woods is. :)
Click to expand...
Agree totally. Non-towered, it's "red & white RV". Talking to ATC, it's always "experimental 1-x-y". (Or a-b-c Flight.) Too many of the more *sophisticated* experimental owners like to use their kit manufacturer as a call sign. One such instance, I followed an RV around the pattern several times all the while looking for the "Aeronca" calling on the radio. Turns out he was calling *rocket*. Give me a break. Or buy a better radio.
 
Not sure why such a big discussion on this. Our Operating Limitations are pretty clear.

"The pilot in command of this aircraft must notify air traffic control of the experimental nature of this aircraft when operating into or out of airports with an operational control tower."

There is some interpretation that can be made as to HOW to notify that you are an experimental but very clear that it is only for ATC when going INTO OR OUT OF AIRPORTS with an OPERATIONAL control tower. It doesn't say you have to tell them on every call you are experimental, just to notifiy them so the initial call-up should be sufficient. I try to keep it simple and quick: "XYZ Tower, Experimental RV4 NXXXX, 10 miles SE with Charlie for landing". No call after that do I use the word experimental....it is not required or necessary.

To Vlad's experience around the NY airspace, based on the wording in the OL's unless he is landing or taking off from one of those airports there is no need to tell them he is experimental. Standard radio phrasology is all you need. For others that feel they must use their registered designation instead of RV, please don't. It's not fair to the tower controller attempting to sequence traffic and I've dealt with a few that have zero sense of humor. Not to mention it ties up the frequency while the controller sorts out that your "Turtle Crawl 2" is really a fast moving RV8. Regardless of what our registerded type is , we are still RV's, hence the reason you are on this board. I'm pretty sure the Turtle Crawl board would be a lonely place.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top