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P-Mags

Cool

Then either something is not calibrated on my airplane or its horribly slow for some reason..We need a fly off..:)

Frank
 
scard said:
I still have the question: Is Brad or Tom a pilot, and are either of them flying behind their product on a regular basis?

Note, I have a qualified history to be asking such a question.
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I don't think either of them have a PPL. I know they don't actively fly. Brad is a business guy and Tom is a 20 pound brain, engineer type. Who by the way has invented a number of other aviation items. Great guys and they care about their products.
 
Bump...

Just putting this out there...

Comments on the E/P-mags have been very quiet for some time.

Have any of you experienced any problems with your E/P-mags that you haven?t previously reported?

How many hours do you have now?
 
480 hrs, dual 113 series P-mags on my 7A with IO-360M. Running lean of peak in cruise all the time. No problems, all service bulletins complied with.

Martin Sutter
building and flying RV's since 1988
EAA Technical Counselor
 
Lightspeed + P-Mag??

My 7-A build includes one Slick & Lightspeed II.
In a discussion with another builder, we talked about when the time comes to O/H the mag, just replacing it with a P-Mag.
Does anyone run this combo?? Lightspeed II + P-Mag...

I couldn't seem to find any posts that mention this combo...but then there are a bazillion posts about lightspeed & p-mags.

I, also am glad to hear that the E-mags & P-mags are now performing well.
Great concept!

Thanks
 
:) in Norway

IO-360, dual P-mags, 113 series, 130 hrs, and all SB's complied with.
No issues after the completing the SB that "secured" the sensor magnet.

The engine performs outstanding during all phases, including hotstart (no purgevalve installed)

50* LOP ops without problems. (No problems above 50* either)

I absolutely love them and dual 114 series P-mags are already bought for my second -7.

Brad are great to work with too.
 
7A_@ABI said:
My 7-A build includes one Slick & Lightspeed II.
In a discussion with another builder, we talked about when the time comes to O/H the mag, just replacing it with a P-Mag.
Does anyone run this combo?? Lightspeed II + P-Mag...

I couldn't seem to find any posts that mention this combo...but then there are a bazillion posts about lightspeed & p-mags.

I, also am glad to hear that the E-mags & P-mags are now performing well.
Great concept!

Thanks
Click to expand...
Contact Brad at E-mag, he might know if a customer is doing that.

Now back to the thread...
 
Had trouble starting the O-320 in our RV-4. Troubleshooting every system led us to resolution. Both magnetos had impulse couplings and seemed to check out properly, although they were at least as old as the total time (approximately 810 hours) on the airplane. Plugs were good. Timing was correct. Primer worked. Accelerator pump was strong. We couldn't figure it out. I had the nagging suspicion it was the mags.

So, I ordered a P Mag from Brad two weeks ago. We put it on this weekend. Extremely straight forward installation. Timing it was a joke. Put number one cylinder at TDC and blow into a tube. Voila! Done! Buttoned everything up and cranked. Bam! Fired right away (after I figured out that the mags needed to be on - hard to see in the dark) and ran beautifully. Ran it up numerous times to check it over and took it for a flight.

Easy installation and setup. Flawless operation after 1 hour. Couldn't be happier.
 
Pmag Installation is dirt simple!

Just installed a new Pmag. I can tell you having gone through a lengthy nightmare of issues with a LS PIII awhile back, finally giving up and going back to MAGs it was a risky leap of faith to give another EI a try. I haven't cranked up the engine yet as I'm not quite ready. The installation was very straight forward and the timing as easy as it can be without it being automatic.

A very elegant, well engineered system. I'll report on how it functions soon but I suspect most of you already know.

Ken
 
I've never liked the soft timing of the Pmags (blow into tube), so I've always stuck with the mechanical method. Fortunately, even the mechanical timing is very easy.
 
how did you "mechanically" time the Pmag? And did you have an issue with the "blow in the tube" method?
 
There is a "hard" timing reference point in the Pmag that is converted by the software magic to a "soft" timing point with the blow in the tube method. Some time ago, there were reports of the Pmags getting their brains scrambled and reverting back to the hard reference point. Since this could be a long way from the soft point, I felt it was better to simply time the mag to its mechanical reference from the start. If I ever do get a glitch, at least the timing will end up back where I thought it was.
 
Toobuilder said:
There is a "hard" timing reference point in the Pmag that is converted by the software magic to a "soft" timing point with the blow in the tube method. Some time ago, there were reports of the Pmags getting their brains scrambled and reverting back to the hard reference point. Since this could be a long way from the soft point, I felt it was better to simply time the mag to its mechanical reference from the start. If I ever do get a glitch, at least the timing will end up back where I thought it was.
Click to expand...

Michael,

I'm not sure this is true. Back in '97 when I installed mine and first flew with them the only way to time them was by turning the gear until the light turned green, plug them in, and reacquire the green light. Sure enough, on my second flight, the timing mark was lost and it was nowhere close to the "hard" timing reference.

Emag has since fixed this problem and there have been no reported problems of lost timing in since, regardless of which timing method you use.

FWIW, I only time mine with the blow-in-the-tube method and with the development of the EICommander, I probably have pulled my P-mags/retimed them more than anyone else except for Brad and Tom at Emag.
 
N941WR said:
Michael,

...Emag has since fixed this problem and there have been no reported problems of lost timing in since, regardless of which timing method you use.

FWIW, I only time mine with the blow-in-the-tube method and with the development of the EICommander, I probably have pulled my P-mags/retimed them more than anyone else except for Brad and Tom at Emag.
Click to expand...

I've heard that they have fixed this problem, however, my use of the "alternate" timing method described in the manual (vs the "quick set") simply aligns more closely with my own comfort zone. I know the unit does have a definate internal crank sensor timing ("hard" reference), and it is from this reference that all advance/retard functions are derived, so I just like to keep the mechanical timing of the engine lined up with this reference point. Again, if the ignition ever "reboots" and reverts back to the hard reference, then my engine will be at TDC and it should run. In my mind, it's simply one less thing to worry about.

If the quick set is bulletproof, great, but the "alternate method" certainly can't hurt, and it takes only a little bit more time...
 
RV8R999 said:
I didn't even see that referenced in the installation instructions.
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Well, I looked in the 114 series instructions and it is not there... It's still in the 113 manual though - look for "alternate timing method" if you are curious.
 
If the quick set is bulletproof said:
Mike, I time my 113 the same way you do for the same reason. Just call me an old fashion hardware EE. Software can do funny things for funny reasons like a cosmic ray hitting the wrong cell in a RAM. I have steam gauges to back up my flat screen too.
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Hard Timing did Not Prevent Timing Loss for Me

One of my p-mags lost its timing despite being "hard timed" (yes I did clear out the factory setting). It was all up to date from the factory too, not subject to the magnet positioning recall. When they couldn't find anything wrong with it besides having been over temp by 17 degrees, that left me somewhat perplexed. I went ahead and used the blow into the tube timing method on reinstall, since hard timing didn't prevent the loss of timing anyway.

Hans
 
Considering all timing is subject to software manipulation, it does not surprise me that the unit does not always return to the hard timing reference after a glitch... I just think that's where it will usually go.

My preference for the hard timing is simply playing the odds in my favor (in my mind anyway), not an absolute cure.
 
Wasting your time

There is no "hard" timing in the P-Mag. The way Tom has written the software, it is always a software offset.
 
Well there must be an internal reference, so what I think you are saying is that the "alternate" timing method does not align with that reference.

What is the purpose of the alternate method?
 
Always an offset

Everytime the system boots it loads the offset. There is no way for the ignition to operate without loading the offset and it will never default to zero. search for a post by me titled PMag 101. This is different now than it was back in the day.
 
e-mag gurus- I need help, is vacuum sensor absolute or differential pressure?

I'm trying to understand the vacuum advance on the p/e-mags.

Specifically, would one have more advance at high altitude WOT than low altitude WOT? (leave out the a versus b map and RPM).

Said another way, what would the vacuum sensor be outputting, would high altitude look like 15/15 = 1 or 15/30 in = 0.5 ?

thanks
 
nomocom said:
I'm trying to understand the vacuum advance on the p/e-mags.

Specifically, would one have more advance at high altitude WOT than low altitude WOT? (leave out the a versus b map and RPM).
Click to expand...

My understanding is that as you go to higher altitudes WOT the MP will decrease, causing an increase in advance and correspondingly greater power / fuel efficiency. (I am assuming you are really talking about climbing to an altitude where WOT gives you 75% power or below and then climbing higher).

How much advantage this is is probably debatable, but as TAS increases whilst fuel burn decreases as you get higher its better to be at 7000-9000' anyway. You?ve got nothing to loose unless there is a headwind or you burn more fuel getting there then you save in the cruise/descent.

Using that logic, it seems to me that the B curve is most useful at altitude as that is where you would see the ignition using maximum advance.


Regards
Richard
 
rwtalbot said:
...Using that logic, it seems to me that the B curve is most useful at altitude as that is where you would see the ignition using maximum advance.


Regards
Richard
Click to expand...

Keep in mind the B curve is configurable and with the EICad program you can change the max shift, advance, and a few other parameters. I highly recommend you verify the settings before you run on this curve.

Or you can use the EICommander to manage your E/P-mags from your instrument panel.
 
e/p-mag advance

rwtalbot said:
My understanding is that as you go to higher altitudes WOT the MP will decrease, causing an increase in advance
Click to expand...

According to the factory, that's right. Talked to the factory yesterday (Brad). Brad reports that the ignition is set up to advance during lower power engine operation, either from high altitude ops or from partial throttle ops, at any altitude. He also pointed out that they have a conservative failure mode, if the hose leaks or unhooks, then the sensor sees ambient pressure rather than manifold, which will retard timing. A substantial amount if you are down low- partial throttle, up high, not much, since manifold pressure and ambient are nearly the same.

Brad seemed aware of the vansairforce discussion regarding their product and commented that given their three person business and tight resources they weren't following the online discussion. I let him know I was posting online, he encouraged it, and asked me to add that while he regrets they don't have the resources to follow the bulletin boards, he is happy to take phone calls.

best
 
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