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Looking for IO-360 Clone for RV-7A – Builder-Assist & Aerobatic Setup

K

Katja

I'm New Here
Hi everyone,

I am currently building an RV-7A in Germany and am researching engine options. I am interested in a “clone” / experimental engine as an equivalent to a Lycoming YIO-360-M1B, or alternatively an IO-360-type engine that fits the RV-7A well (around 180 hp, fuel injection preferred).

My goals:

  • Aerobatic-capable configuration: I plan to fly aerobatics, so negative-G capability is important to me.
  • Builder involvement: I would like to participate in assembling the engine myself (builder-assist / supervised assembly / build school).
  • Price-conscious: I am looking for the best value option (new vs. overhauled vs. kit-built engine).
What I’m hoping to learn from you:

  • Which brands or engine builders are recommended for a Lycoming-style 360 “clone” (reliability, parts support, resale value)?
  • For aerobatics: what configuration is preferred — for example an inverted oil system (Christen/Raven), recommendations for the fuel system (e.g. flop tube / fuel injection), and which options are considered “must-have”?
  • Do you know of any builder-assist programs where one can be actively involved in the engine assembly(Europe preferred, USA also of interest)?
  • If anyone is flying an RV-7A with a clone/experimental 360 engine, what has your experience been (smoothness, temperatures, support, total cost)?
Thank you in advance for any advice or contacts.

Best regards,
Katja
 
Katja,

I little searching through the forums might answer your questions, but I’ll try and give a summary of the little I know:

-This thread probably belongs in “traditional aircraft engines”, as that is what the IO-360 and clones are.

-A factory new Lycoming ordered through Vans is probably the best option, and unless you have a known good core, close in price to a top tier overhaul these days.

-I don’t know of any “build assist” programs for engines in Europe, but Aerosport Power in Canada have a program. I believe they can build engines from Lycoming factory parts and Titan factory parts.

-For clones, I think the Titan line is as close to a factory new Lycoming as you can get; they might be a little cheaper but the biggest savings will be in time, their lead time is likely a few months faster than Lycoming

-At the moment, I would pass on Superior, as they have been having QC issues with cylinders.
 
F18Sailor said:
Katja,

I little searching through the forums might answer your questions, but I’ll try and give a summary of the little I know:

-This thread probably belongs in “traditional aircraft engines”, as that is what the IO-360 and clones are.

-A factory new Lycoming ordered through Vans is probably the best option, and unless you have a known good core, close in price to a top tier overhaul these days.

-I don’t know of any “build assist” programs for engines in Europe, but Aerosport Power in Canada have a program. I believe they can build engines from Lycoming factory parts and Titan factory parts.

-For clones, I think the Titan line is as close to a factory new Lycoming as you can get; they might be a little cheaper but the biggest savings will be in time, their lead time is likely a few months faster than Lycoming

-At the moment, I would pass on Superior, as they have been having QC issues with cylinders.
Click to expand...
Titan lead times are a year, according to them, when I reached out a couple of months ago. Obviously could have changed.
 
I just got a quote on a Superior engine kit. So one that would need to be built up. It’s very close in spec to an M1B from Vans. $55k. So just a kit is running more expensive than a new engine from Vans. Also a year ago Titan were $5k more expensive than Vans, I don’t imagine that has changed.

Neither Aerosport Power or Barrett responded to my emails.
 
Same boat you Katja. Been on this subject for a couple months. Titan slightly more expensive. You get more features and more customization. At this point I couldnt find any actual data on weather titan is better than Lyc. Most of the engine shops never responded to me. I know you can sorta do a build assist with superior parts in Belgium. But their quote just for the engine was a lot higher than new from vans. Any way I spin it it seems that the Vans engine is going to be the cheapest of you want a NEW engine. Also been thinking about resale value. I would prefer the M1B to a rebuild of any kind. Also some of them will make your FWF kits change a bit. if you opt for the cold induc sump.... It will make the stock exhaust not fit. If you trly want accro you want a CS prop. Take the 1000$ bundle discount into account as well. Just things to think about. I am also in Germany. Feel free to send me a PM.
 
RV7ForMe said:
Same boat you Katja. Been on this subject for a couple months. Titan slightly more expensive. You get more features and more customization. At this point I couldnt find any actual data on weather titan is better than Lyc. Most of the engine shops never responded to me. I know you can sorta do a build assist with superior parts in Belgium. But their quote just for the engine was a lot higher than new from vans. Any way I spin it it seems that the Vans engine is going to be the cheapest of you want a NEW engine. Also been thinking about resale value. I would prefer the M1B to a rebuild of any kind. Also some of them will make your FWF kits change a bit. if you opt for the cold induc sump.... It will make the stock exhaust not fit. If you trly want accro you want a CS prop. Take the 1000$ bundle discount into account as well. Just things to think about. I am also in Germany. Feel free to send me a PM.
Click to expand...
The vetterman crossover exhaust will fit the M1B and cold air sump, at least with the James cowl. Not sure about the standard Vans cowl.
 
Jonnyb said:
I just got a quote on a Superior engine kit. So one that would need to be built up. It’s very close in spec to an M1B from Vans. $55k. So just a kit is running more expensive than a new engine from Vans. Also a year ago Titan were $5k more expensive than Vans, I don’t imagine that has changed.

Neither Aerosport Power or Barrett responded to my emails.
Click to expand...
I think you are saying a Superior IO-360-B1AC roller lifter kit price quote was more than $55,000.

This is just a data point....Spruce says they sell the kit for about $32,000. I have an interest in having an engine up built up and have been exploring options.
www.aircraftspruce.com

Superior - XP Experimental Engine Series | Aircraft Spruce ®

Superior - XP Experimental Engine Series These engine models include fuel pump, fuel system, magnetos, harness, spark plugs, lightweight starter, oil filter adapter, oil filter and updraft cast sump.
www.aircraftspruce.com www.aircraftspruce.com
 
Bcone1381 said:
I think you are saying a Superior IO-360-B1AC roller lifter kit price quote was more than $55,000.

This is just a data point....Spruce says they sell the kit for about $32,000. I have an interest in having an engine up built up and have been exploring options.
www.aircraftspruce.com

Superior - XP Experimental Engine Series | Aircraft Spruce ®

Superior - XP Experimental Engine Series These engine models include fuel pump, fuel system, magnetos, harness, spark plugs, lightweight starter, oil filter adapter, oil filter and updraft cast sump.
www.aircraftspruce.com www.aircraftspruce.com
Click to expand...

They can’t get crank shafts apparently.
So my supplier looked to source one outside of the kit. The crank on its own was $10k.

Made the whole kit very expensive
 
I would strongly suggest to avoid Superior, who are known to not stand behind their products. Personally I'd never buy anything from them again.
 
airguy said:
The vetterman crossover exhaust will fit the M1B and cold air sump, at least with the James cowl. Not sure about the standard Vans cowl.
Click to expand...
I asked Clint about this because your comment made me unsure. The Crossover is similar but NOT the same. The M1B crossover will not fit the Cold air sump with the Titan...
 
I am in The Netherlands and have the Aerosport M1S which is a clone of the M1B.
Build school was awesome.
Vetterman has an exhaust that fits the ColdAir Sump and horizontal induction. But for the SamJames cowl you have to make two bumps to clear the exhaust.
 
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