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Icom or Garmin Comm?

MarkC

Active Member
Hi Folks,

I am going through the panel layout process and trying to decide on a comm radio. The choices that many people seem to use are either the Icom A200 or the Garmin SL40. There is quite a big difference in price so I am trying to figure out if it is worth almost double the price for the Garmin over the Icom.

Any feedback is appreciated.

Cheers,

Mark (234C res)
 
You might be interested in using either of the two radios' intercom. I have been told by others on one of the forums that the Garmin intercom doesn't work very well -- I think it was described as an afterthought or an add-on to the SL-40.

Icom's intercom is switch activated only. I had an A200 and liked it quite well after installing a dedicated intercom.

The Garmin has a tad more power,but you probably won't know the difference in that respect. it's only a Watt or two as you have no doubt seen in the literature.

Hope this helps a little. I'm sure others will help in other ways.

Don Gray
Cortland, OH
N17QB 7A in progress
 
The SL-40, like it's Nav cousin the SL-30, allows active monitoring of the standby frequency while using the primary frequency. This one feature alone, in my opinion, makes the SL-40 a heckuva deal.
 
Go for SL40

I went for the extra and bought the SL40.......I use the monitor feature on EVERY flight.......
EVERY flight.......
EVERY flight.......
I feel it is some of the best spent money in the plane!
you will too.
Bob Martin
RV-6
 
Love my Icom

I've been using a Icom A200 in my spam can for about7 years now. I downright LOVE it. I have had several friends say that it is VERY clear when they hear me talking on it. I've never had a problem being able to hear or talk to someone with it. Great friggin deal for under $800 bucks if you ask me. Heck for that price you can afford to buy two of them and still save money compared to other coms! You can bet my panel in my RV-7 is going to be sporting at least one if not two of them!
 
I'm seriously considering replacing my A200 with an SL40, not because there is anything wrong with the ICOM unit, but I wouldn't mind having the second-channel monitor as mentioned above. I occasionally fall into the trap of trying to save pennies when I'm spending lots of dollars elsewhere, and at the time I bought my #2 Comm, I went with the A200 becasue I got a good deal on it, and I had just started spending large sums of money on other major airplane parts. Now that the building is "done", and the monthly wallet hemorrage is over, I want to get what I wanted in the first place.

Once again, let me emphasise - the A200 is a great radio that does everything it's supposed to!


Paul
 
Monitor 2nd frequency

Being able to monitor a second frequency is *really* nice. Like Bob, I use it on every flight. The planes I'm flying today have a Garmin 430 and a King KY-197 with a Garmin audio panel.

The SL-40 (and the SL-30) can monitor the second frequency without the audio panel. I fly in some pretty dense airspace, and being able to monitor another frequency is really a safety issue.

The XCOM 760 can also monitor a second frequency, as can some of the other former UPS/Apollo radios. It's a great feature.

It was a big surprise to me that the 430 did not have the ability to monitor a second frequency. The GNS480 (formerly Apollo CNX80) can do it.
 
Icom

ICOM is a fantastic company. They have been manufacturing high quality HAM stuff for a very long time. I'm not a HAM but a friend's entire setup is ICOM. The DA-20 I've been flying lately has a 430 and an A-200. The A-200 is a slick COM and supports lots of features that I really like -- remote flip-flop...remote toggle through pre-programmed freqs (great for putting in your home base's tower/ground/awos), etc. I really like it and in the DA-20 I usually end up using the COM features of the ICOM and the NAV/GPS features of the 430. Having said that, I've ordered an SL-40 to go into my panel...primarily for the standby monitoring feature. I actually find the standby monitoring to be more useful than a second com since the SL-40 will give priority to the active freq, meaning that if you're listening to AWOS and someone transmits over the active, it will mute the AWOS so you can here the active.

Another advantage of the SL-40 is if you're going to be using a GPSMAP 396 or a panel-mount GPS that can send it frequencies. I don't believe the A-200 has this feature, but I could be wrong.

The only complaint I've heard about the A-200 is someone here on the forums reported that the front cover of their unit melted in the sun. This may be something to consider.
 
I installed an A200 with Commant antenna in my Tri-Pacer 10 years ago. It worked great (excellent clarity and range) except:
- the intercom was always hot. I disconnected it after 2 flights and installed a dedicated intercom.
- the rubber "tires" on the control knobs cracked and fell off after a year or so. I raided my son's Legos for replacements.
- the sideband never worked so I never heard myself transmit. It was probably a wiring boofoo on my part.
I'll be installing an SL-40 in my -9 for the standby freq monitoring ability.
Steve
 
Thanks folks, this is all good information.

So let me ask another question: I see panels out there, some with audio panels built in (again like the Garmin 340) and some that just use an Intercom like the Flightcom. If I don't need the "monitor 2 radios at once" feature (if I buy the SL40 and use that feature there) and I don't need the marker beacon (just VFR for now) then what benefit would I get from the 340?

As you can see I'm kind of new to the avionics stuff so if this is a dumb questions please forgive me.

Mark (234C res)
http://websites.expercraft.com/markc/
 
I'm the one with the melted faceplate. I never did figure out what happened and I haven't yet contacted them about it. Otherwise, a very nice radio with good documentation.
 
audio panel?

So let me ask another question: I see panels out there, some with audio panels built in (again like the Garmin 340) and some that just use an Intercom like the Flightcom. If I don't need the "monitor 2 radios at once" feature (if I buy the SL40 and use that feature there) and I don't need the marker beacon (just VFR for now) then what benefit would I get from the 340?

it's a fair question. for years i operated certain spam cans with only a "transmit select" switch, using the volume control knobs on the various radios as the "select" portion of the audio panel. (i have also owned several planes with "real nice" audio panels.) for the minimalist approach, there's no doubt one can do without an audio panel, and quite nicely, too. some of the newer incercoms even have acceptable audio in, if you're into tunes while you you fly.

but, well, you see i sorta did want a marker beacon receiver (i know, not required for ifr flight, but still sort of 'nice to have'. who knows? maybe i'll get cat ii certified in my rv7, and an inner marker or radar altimeter is required for that). i also wanted stereo. i usually don't listen to music when i fly, but it's nice for the s.o. on long x/c's. and, when i saw this deal at chief aircraft for "reconditioned" 340's, well, i bit. (i just looked, and don't see it on their website anymore.)

so, for me, there isn't a _compelling_ reason for an audio panel, but i have one anyway.
 
Steve said:
I installed an A200 with Commant antenna in my Tri-Pacer 10 years ago. It worked great (excellent clarity and range) except:
- the rubber "tires" on the control knobs cracked and fell off after a year or so. I raided my son's Legos for replacements.
- the sideband never worked so I never heard myself transmit. It was
Steve


Yup the "tires" on my A200 did the same. While at Sun N Fun I mentioned it to the reps in the Icom booth. they pulled out a box of spare parts, dug out some new "tires" and said "here ya go" Great friggin company.

The sideband has a pot that you use a screw driver to adjust it up or down. I forget if it was on the top or bottom of the case. Either way you just slide out the radio and adjust it.

Yup the so called "intercom" feature is more like just a hot mike than an actual VOX intercom. Like I said great radio for the $$$$
 
I went with an Icom A200 as my second radio, my first being in a Garmin GNC 250XL. Given the choice I use the Icom almost every time in flight. It sounds better and just works great. The prior post about the little rubber tires rotting and falling off of the knobs called it right on. This happened to mine also after 1 1/2 years of living in a hanger, or being covered when not in use. About 3 weeks ago I called Icom and ordered replacements. They were about 59 cents a piece so there is now a supply of them wrapped up and stashed away in my map box for future needs. My suggestion, save the money and buy the Icom, and find other ways to trim also. Take what you save and put on a constant speed prop!

My 2 cents
 
Side tone for the A200

Steve said:
I installed an A200 with Commant antenna in my Tri-Pacer 10 years ago. It worked great (excellent clarity and range) except:
- the sideband never worked so I never heard myself transmit. It was probably a wiring boofoo on my part.
I'll be installing an SL-40 in my -9 for the standby freq monitoring ability.
Steve

Steve,

There should be 3 holes on the top of the A200 with little stickers covering the holes. These are access holes to "pots" ? on the board to adjustments.
One of them is to adjust the side-tone. Yours' is probably turned way down so you can't hear yourself. I had the same problem with one in an RV-4 we bought last Sept. Sure enough someone told me about this and I went in and adjusted the side tone "pot" with a small phillips screwdriver, and now I hear myself just fine when key'ing the mic.
 
Sidetone

The Icom phone rep told me to check if the sidetone pot was full CW. It was. I slid another A200 into my rack and it performed the same. I concluded the problem was outside the radio. I'm guessing it could be related to the fact I used a Telex PTT switch instead of wiring in a switch to ground one of the radio chassis pins, per schematic.
Anyway, I got kinda used to it and never really considered it a bad thing. The factory replacement tires also cracked after a year (hangared, too) but the Lego tires were still looking good when I sold the Tri-P last May.

Hopefully priming fuse parts this weekend,
Steve
 
Yes, I can see it now... ICOM knob PN LEG----. Neat :cool:

This reminds me of the Luscombe stick grip PN HD???? from back in the '1940s. Stands for "Harley Davidson". Yep, it's true. BTW, they are hard to find. There are probably lots of parts like that we don't know about.

Don Gray
Cortland, OH
N17QB 7A in progress
 
I want monitoring capability

The most basic audio panels I've found are still in the $800+ price range. For someone like me who has no other need for an audio panel (VFR setup with GPS nav only) the SL-40 seems like the most cost-effective/simplest way to get monitoring capability.

Is there another option??....Does anyone know of an inexpensive basic comm switching panel that would allow me to switch between 2 seperate radios?
 
DB1033 said:
The most basic audio panels I've found are still in the $800+ price range. For someone like me who has no other need for an audio panel (VFR setup with GPS nav only) the SL-40 seems like the most cost-effective/simplest way to get monitoring capability.

Is there another option??....Does anyone know of an inexpensive basic comm switching panel that would allow me to switch between 2 seperate radios?


I think I saw Stein from SteinAir or someone else with a great deal of avioncis knowledge on this forum point out that you can just wire your two radios to a toggle switch before they head to the intercom. The only problem is that this would not allow for monitoring both at the same time and so you'd still need to go off-frequency. For avioinics experts out there: might a 3-position switch possible allow for monitoring both at the same time??

Coincidence, though, as I was just laying awake last night thinking about your question! :eek:
 
Love the SL-40

I have the SL-40 and love it. There are several adjustments on the System menu or setup menu for sidetone, mic squelch, etc. The intercom works great. The standby monitoring is really cool and the frequency memory really helps. I wish I had a 396 so I could use the frequency pre-select feature (I will someday :) )

I have Lightspeed 20 3G headsets which has the music input feature and this works fantastic. The music is in stereo in the headsets, you can still hear/use the intercom or comm and clarity is very good.

FWIW
 
When you use a toggle switch for transmit select, you only switch the mic audio and PTT. You still monitor both recievers.
 
I have 2 SL40's and Love them...

Loved the first one so much I finally got around to putting the 2nd com in and of course used another SL40. These teamed up with the 396 makes a terrific package. It can download a list of frequencies relevant to your location or the destination you have plugged into the 396 to the SL40 and it can also transfers freqs at the push of a button from the 396 (these can be obtained in any number of ways on the 396). It also stores local freq by name that you store as well as keeps an active list of last 10 freqs used. My audio panel is a 4P2T switch(four pole double throw mil spec gold contact) which I use to switch headphone audio, mic audio, mic key and data. I couldn't be happier with the set up!
 
sl40

I took a Icom out of my 9A and replaced it with a SL40 for many of the same reasons as above. If you use a 200 you will have to add an intercom too control the squelch!!!! The SL40 has so may nice features about the master squelch and pilot/copilot squelch, pilot/copilot volume, ect. it is worth the extra $$$.

Frank
 
Off Topic A Little

I have not started panel design yet but the comments about needing/wanting/using an audio panel are interesting. From reading other threads, it seems more and more pilots are going for lots of audio streams - EFIS systems, Engine monitors, GPS, MP3 players, DVD players, Cell Phones, et el. Is there a reasonable way to manage all of these audio feeds without using an audio panel?
 
The following is all theory until I finish wiring my panel, which should happen right after I finish the canopy in the coming weeks. Again, this is theory and I hope it works.

My -9 will have the iCom A200, intercom, Dynon EFIS, Dynon EMS, and Garmin 396 GPS.

All of those items have the ability to output some type of audio. Since I don't want to spend close to $1,000 or more on an audio panel I had to figure out how to connect all that "stuff".

It turns out the iCom has three mono audio inputs and the intercom I selected has a stereo input. Thus the two Dynon units will go through the iCom and the GPS will connect to the stereo in on the intercom.

I do not know if the Garmin radio has similar inputs but it may be worth looking into.
 
No to audio panel and yes to a separate intercom

MarkC said:
Thanks folks, this is all good information.

So let me ask another question: I see panels out there, some with audio panels built in (again like the Garmin 340) and some that just use an Intercom like the Flightcom. If I don't need the "monitor 2 radios at once" feature (if I buy the SL40 and use that feature there) and I don't need the marker beacon (just VFR for now) then what benefit would I get from the 340?

As you can see I'm kind of new to the avionics stuff so if this is a dumb questions please forgive me. Mark (234C res)
Mark it's a good question.

The benifit of an audio panel for you seems about ZERO, regardless of the com radio you end up choosing. In the old days we had a "THE STACK": Two Coms (transmitters), Two VOR's, DME and ADF, each with an audio output for each radio, that we needed to control or select. The audio panel was also a place to put a marker beacon receiver (for IFR approaches).

A typical VFR panel consists of one COM (transmitter) and a GPS. A audio panel for selecting multi audio source or between two transmitters is not needed. If you have two transmitters you have to select which radio to connect the PTT switch and MIC to, which is a little more switching. Since you have one transmitter this is not an issue.

Let's say you want to mix in other audio, say a warning tone or handheld radio, both the ICOM and SL40 have a few aux audio inputs. It mixes what ever audio signals you input with the radio audio. You have no individual select switch like a audio panel but than again you don't need it. You control the AUX input at its source. If you don't want to listen to it, you turn the volumn down at the source. If you want to listen to music I suggest not going thru the low powered AUX radios in the back of the radio and use an intercom AUX input.

The new audio panels are nice, have built in intercoms but cost a boat load. All you need is an intercom and it cost a fraction of a new audio panel, so I suggest you buy a stand alone intercom. Disregard the "built in" intercom that comes with most COM radios.

I can speak to the ICOM A200 built-in intercom; it does have a so called intercom, but it's a NON voice activated/controlled (VOX) intercom, it's an open mic. Also you either use the radio to talk or the intercom but not at the same time. You have to wire in a switch to throw between radio or open mic intercom but not both.

A good stand alone VOX intercom has separate pilot and crew volumn / squelch controls, plus crew isolate features. Set it and forget it. You push the PTT it locks the passenger out. Plus they have better amplifiers (more audio power for clearer sound) and other features like an additional AUX stereo input if desired. Even if you go with a mono intercom music will sound better than going thru the weak low fidelity AUX input on the back of the COM radio. They are just low gain amplifiers.

The SL40 reports to have a voice activated intercom. I don't know how good it is, but it looks stripped down compared to dedicated high end stand alone intercoms, which give more features and better performance (better sound quality, VOX, stereo, an additional high fidelity aux input). A low end intercom opens both mics when one person talks. A high end intercom has separate channels for each mic. This cuts noise down and allows individual control. Only the mic that's spoken into is open. I suggest a DRE or PS engineering intercom. A good intercom is well worth it. I have had both and they are good stuff. They do cost more but that goes with my philosophy to spend money on things that I am going to use every flight and give the greatest benifit.


SL40 or ICOM
To your original question the ICOM A200 is a bargain and a good radio. The SL40 is a better radio in that you can listen to two Freqs and has a slightly higher powered transmitter (1 watt). It also has some other very cool and more expensive features.

We are all on a budget to some degree; we can't gold plate everything, but if you are going to go deluxe and spend more money on something a COM radio is a good place because you use it every flight. People put junk in there plane that adds weight, cost but they don't use it. If you are on a budget the ICOM A200 is a deal and solid radio. It does what it is suppose to and is the "Best Buy". If you have the bucks and fly in high density traffic airspace (B, C and D) where you need to stay on ATC or TOWER and listen to ATIS all at once the Garmin SL40 is way cool. If you fly out of non-towered fields in E & G airspace, than one freq at a time is cool. I carry a handheld that I can that I can pipe into the headset (thru the AUX input) if I want to. I also got my ICOM A200 on sale new for $600. Hard to beat that.
 
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