Van's Air Force
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Lights
- Thread starter JoeB15
- Start date
There is a custom Flyleds for the RV-15. I thought that the early comments when the kit was announced were that lights were part of the added value proposition. I don't see anything about that in current published info so I must be imagining that.
flyleds.com
Products – Flyleds
flyleds.com
I hope so. I didn’t purchase the kit to “brew my own” anything.There is a custom Flyleds for the RV-15. I thought that the early comments when the kit was announced were that lights were part of the added value proposition. I don't see anything about that in current published info so I must be imagining that.
Products – Flyleds
Been there, done that….
Going through a lighting upgrade on the 6 now. It will be Aeroleds.
The fit and finish of the product is outstanding. I’m only doing this once and am happy to pay the extra dollars to support an Idaho based manufacturer.
If Vans has a canned package, regardless, I’ll be using that on the 15 as I mentioned earlier.
The fit and finish of the product is outstanding. I’m only doing this once and am happy to pay the extra dollars to support an Idaho based manufacturer.
If Vans has a canned package, regardless, I’ll be using that on the 15 as I mentioned earlier.
Thank you for linking our product! We custom designed this combined landing and taxi light specifically for the RV-15 more than a year ago. They are installed in the prototype RV-15, and the feedback we're getting from the test crew is positive to say the least! The guy in the blue shirt on the left (that would be Rian from Van's Aircraft for those that didn't know) told me "it lights up twice as much of the runway as the -15 needs to land".There is a custom Flyleds for the RV-15. I thought that the early comments when the kit was announced were that lights were part of the added value proposition. I don't see anything about that in current published info so I must be imagining that.
Products – Flyleds
As for the second part of your comment; we're working on it!
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I bought this kit from Paul and put it together a few weeks ago. Super simple and straightforward, just follow the directions. It fits the lighting bracket on the wings as expected. In the video above Paul says it may be sold through Van's already assembled, if that's the way you want to go.
Similar has been mentioned in other threads and components. I would caution the 'by the book' builders (speaking generically, not assuming that's you Marc) regarding buying this type of stuff early. It's hard to say for sure how things will be packaged but chances are that most builders who buy all the kits will have the lights included in one of them. You may end up buying duplicate components.
Maybe Van's will make the lights optional or change their current policy of not allowing kit deletions. This would better accommodate people who wanted to buy them sooner, or use an alternative light.
The website price is per side. I confirmed it last week with Paul.
The kit does not include the lights, only the wire harness. The harness terminates with a round screw on plug with a ziplock baggie containing crimp male terminals and receiver plugs for attaching to the light side wires when you purchase the lights.
Right, I have the kit and I'm aware of that. What I said is that chances are one of the later kits will include the lights. Speculation as to which one, but probably the finish or avionics kit.
There are new builders here. There are also repeat offenders who are have been clear they have no intention to deviate, and others who are not up to speed with some changes in Van's kits in recent years. The point of my comment was just to prevent people from thinking they really need to buy and install these right now. These people would have a good reason to wait and see how this plays out.
Of course this does not apply if you have some need for the lights right now, or want to have them 'just because'. It would be fun to light up the driveway and I get it the interest, but I'll personally hang on the $700+ and others may prefer to do the same if they understand you could end up paying for them anyway.
Huge disclaimer here that there is some speculation involved and we just don't know what Van's will do. I'm reluctant to put more detail into words because of that, but will try to stick to the signal vs the noise. Everything could change with a few decisions from Van's.
You should separate out the 12 from the 14 for this question, since the 12 is offered as an ELSA kit and the 14 is not. Van's has made fairly strong statements that the -15 would also be offered as an ELSA kit. In an ELSA scenario, every single component in the aircraft would be included at some point across the series of kits. This would mean that things like lights (pitot tube mentioned in different thread) would be included. Van's currently does not allow deletions of components.
Of course there could be lights as an *option*. In the RV-12is the lights were a builder selectable option. When I built mine that was the case. I just took a look at the order forms for RV-12 kits and I don't see the option any more. I may just be missing it, but this would imply they are now standard, which would be consistent with Van's post-bankruptcy practice of streamlining kit options.
Making things optional seems like an easy solution and I think it's reasonable to assume that things work out that way. It's just not the direction that Van's has gone in the last couple years.
I do personally think it's nearly certain that lights will be included in one of the later kits, and the question is just whether they will be optional/deletable.
Has anyone asked Van's directly if they plan on including them in future kits or are they an option? In my 14 kit lights were an option. I can't imagine one would want to wait for something that goes into the wing for it to show up in a future kit that isn't even offered for sale yet.
The answer has to come from Vans and from FlyLED. Until either, or both, state one way or another, all of this conversation is just speculation.
I will say, speculating on whether this RV15 construction will be like an old school 3,4,6,7,8,9; or the newer school 10, 12; or the newer school 14; or even newer school SLSA 12 ready to fly plane(s), is an exercise that will more likely than not end up much different than everyone thought once this kit, in its final configuration, comes to light.
This is mostly true, but there is some regulation that supports the logic that lights will be included in one of the kits. Part of the AW certification process for an ELSA involves signing an affidavit that attests to having built the kit exactly to the plans and that all of the components were provided by the kit provider. This is embedded in the 8130-15 statement of compliance. Back to the caveat that 'anything can happen', but we're pretty far out on a limb if we think Van's will not produce ELSA RV-15 kits. Also far out on a limb to think that they will not support a configuration with lights, especially since a bunch of us already have the wiring installed to support them.
A lot of people could care less about the ELSA requirements so this doesn't matter to them. Still, it's been stated by Van's six different ways from Sunday that it is part of the business plan for the RV-15. If they stick to that plan the lights will be required to be provided at the very least as an option.
It will be trivial to screw the light unit in place when it comes in a later kit like finish or avionics. The bracket will already be in place, you'll just remove the the blank adapter and screw/plug in the light. The fact that Van's provides a blank adapter does seem to imply it would be optional.
All of that will be true for an ELSA, even more so for an SLSA, even more for a MOSAIC qualifying RV15. However, none of these RV15 kits we have received, or, have yet to be delivered, will be registered as such. They will be registered as an EAB. None of what you expressed will have to be adhered to by a builder building an EAB RV15.
There is no reason to assume this as fact. I have a wing kit now. I’m confident that mine will be ELSA (at the very least eligible) when it comes time to register and inspect.
I would be glad to walk through it more but we’re getting off topic for this thread on lights. Plus, you probably don’t care that much about how ELSA works. I would love to make a friendly wager on it though!
You can’t build an EAB -15 right now either. Both are equally imaginary right now and both could come into existence on the same day. This can happen with wing we have now.
I have not said anything to imply builders have to adhere to anything. Builders can do whatever they want. What I have said is that if Van's intends for ELSA builders to be able to have lights, they will be obligated to provide the lights. You're not tracking the difference between builder obligations and manufacturer obligations.
Sure, there's a scenario where Van's just says ELSA builders are on their own to add whatever lights they want *after* they get an AW cert. This would be really awkward and there is zero business incentive for Van's to do that.
This is partially true. Van's has to build an ASTM compliant SLSA version and publish the requisite documents. Once they have done that they can provide the 8130-15 to builders who have purchased all of the kit components from them. There is no reason that the wing kits that we have now can not be rolled up into that process once the SLSA version is completed. This is a requirement that seems to exist in your mind, but it is not in the regulations.
The schedule Van's has proposed for full kit development accommodates an SLSA version to be produced in late 2026 or early 2027. The wing design was 'finalized' first, so we have wing kits and the KAI (one of those requisite SLSA documents) now. If you look closely at the timelines for kit release and compare it to the MOSAIC implementation deadline for aircraft this summer along with everything Van's has said, the intent is clear. Tail kit are next, now that the design for those is also completed. Execution of course, is a different story.
So come on...how about that wager?
I have my kit. I have been working on it for over 6 weeks now. There is absolutely no way this wing kit could meet requirements for Vans to use it as a finalized wing kit for an ESLA kit. There are way too many things that will have to change because they are not correct. To say the wing kit I received would meet ESLA requirements is a joke. A joke that is NOT funny.
Like what? What do you specifically think needs to change in the current wing design in order for it to be included in the ELSA process? It sounds like we're in the same boat with some inventory and production problems but that has nothing to do with the design. There are some problems with the KAI and it needs updating, but you need to consider that this is exactly why we are not working from hard copy plans and have been encouraged to keep checking for updates.
Again builders don't have to care about any of this ELSA stuff, but Vans is laying the groundwork right now with the kit that you have.
Attempt to move this to the other thread...
RV-15 S-LSA & E-LSA Speculation
Scattered throughout various interview and articles, comments about plans for the RV-15 to be an S-LSA aircraft are pretty obvious. After watching the 'Homebuilt in Review' video it seemed like it would be worth having a thread to capture some guesses and real info whenever we get some. Along...
vansairforce.net
$800 for landing lights? Gulp. I know I'm a dinosaur, but when I built the RV-10 we dropped a couple of $30 CREE flashlight modules into the wingtips and am perfectly happy with them. Logged a couple more night hours just last night. I certainly would hope that Van's makes boutique items like this optional.
I am curious as well, to here what would make the first kits delivered, not be ELSA eligible.
I am pretty familiar with the FAA certification process (I did some of the leg work for the SLSA certification of both the RV-12ULS and 12iS).
As long as Van's applies for and receives SLSA certification for the RV-15 before customers finish, and the builder doesn't deviate at all from the KAI, they should be eligible for ELSA certification (and I will be happy to do that for builders when the time comes
)
It was definitely not lost on me. My thought was that whatever they are developing must be related to the delivery on wing tips being pushed out.
Steve the "something new coming" relates to a new product for the established lineup of RV's that after more than a year of development time we are 90% ready to launch and 90% to go... We have to get those shipping out the door for a while first, but I can see how it could be adapted to be that "something new" for the -15 wing. No need to hold your breath on that one.
At this stage (to the best of my knowledge!) our lights will be an option. I'm sure there's plenty of folks who will even leave the blanking plates out to save the 2 ounces as they build their lightweight day VFR version. However I'm (very much!) open to and looking forward to the day that Van's lets us know that we need to supply them with two lights for every RV-15 they sell!
Well, either way, I'm excited for your company and look forward to seeing what you develop in the future for the -15.
