When do you hang it up?

[jrs14855]

A few facts:
John Miller flew his Bonanza to age 99. Solo trip from NY to CA at age 94. Passed away years ago at 102. He was a barnstormer, member of Gates Flying Circus, best known for early involvement in Autogyros.
Harry Moyer in CA flew his Mooney solo at age 100.
A family friend flew solo at age 95. Passed away the following year.
United Flying Octogenarians for pilots over 80 has 1700 members. No info on how many are still active.

 

[Jerry Fischer]

I absolutely agree about not setting a arbitrary date. Since I'm retired and don't have the revenue string I used to have, cost may make that decision for me. I just payed my monthly airport bill and it was well over 1K for just rent and fuel. Add in all the other cost to own a plane and over the course of a year, it comes to a fairly tidy sum.

Two of my good friends that owned Bonanzas gave it up. One due to aging (78) and the other couldn't get insurance once he hit 80.

I'm leaning to the opinion that cost and aging will be my triggers.

Pretty much my reasons for only flying occasional right seat. I started my pvt training at 46 back in 1986, started my RV7 build back in 2006, finished and flew her in 2011 to 2013. Flew the Mockingbird from Creswell, OR to Winder, GA back in 2013. Flew for another 10 years and decided to spend time mentoring in our chapter's Youth Airplane Program building planes instead of flying. It's been very rewarding and I still enjoy being around old friends at Oshkosh and Sun N Fun hangar flying. I'm 85 and still have Basic Med.

 

[Jerry Fischer]

My wife and I celebrated my 86th a couple of weeks ago by going skydiving! No longer own my own airplane, but fly 3-4 times a week in my buddies RV7s and 10, and the Cherokee 235 I take care of for a friend. Currently spending a lot of time under the panel doing new Garmin upgrades in the Cherokee. As an instructor, I get a good bit of time as safety pilot in several airplanes, including a Baron --. As an A&P, I get to help the guys with their condition inspections. Actually got about an hour of dual in a new Sirius light sport the other day. My instructor was younger!
At this point, as long as I can get in and out of the plane, I will keep flying and learning!

I just wish I could contort my body like I used to...

 

[texdog]

I quit flying the jet at 74, insurance got me. I was tired of overnights away from my wife anyway. I’ve been flying my 6A for 12 years and still feel comfortable, I’m more comfortable when my pilot wife is with me!
I once had to tell a pilot it was time to quit, he didn’t take it well. He couldn’t pass the check ride in the Lear 35 and 6 months later he couldn’t drive either. He was in his mid 60s and we had been carrying him for at least 4 years. I wasn’t the boss and I left the company because of this.
I have a partner that I think will tell me when it’s time and we have discussed it. 61 years in the cockpit is a long time and it’s been a blast.

 

[texdog]

I just wish I could contort my body like I used to...

Jerry, at least we can still volunteer for the welcome wagon. I need Judies help, but it works.

 

[Jerry Fischer]

Jerry, at least we can still volunteer for the welcome wagon. I need Judies help, but it works.

You're right about that Fred, see you in a coupla months

 

[Webb]

I thought about this today when I was doing a yank and bank fun fly today. I swear it’s a calm that comes over me as soon as the wheels leave the ground. I know one day the time will come but it ain’t any time soon.

Cowboys get buried with their boots on. It might be a headset for me.

 

[sprucemoose]

At the upper end of the scale is the MORON who recently landed a 737 at Roanoke, VA touching down more than halfway down the runway, and was saved by the EMAS in the overrun. Appears to have closed the airport for a couple of days.

Not to pick nits but that was a E-145 not a 737. But your point is taken.

 

[bobrath]

86 this month. Tri-gear and day VFR only now. The times a comin'.....but not yet.

 

[rocketman1988]

No worries on my side -- just trying to help a fellow VAF member who has had very little prior tower experience, and then had one move-in on him at FNL, where they were not being considerate to flyers based there. I had lived in Colorado too and flew from GXY, FNL and many others there. FNL was the airport he was referring to. The idea was to not over complicate comms at tower controlled airports. FNL is a unique situation to say the least, and it doesn't help when ATC snaps back at pilots -- right?

That's for certain!

 

[Daddyman58]

This is a very GOOD discussion. I'm 68 and am in pretty good health and shape. I was an ICU RN for over 3 decades and have seen many people pass... some suddenly. Just yesterday I found out that my cousins 41 year old son in law got out of his car then dropped to the ground. People were close. Checked his pulse and nothing. After EMS arrived, the coded him and nothing so he's gone. I know a sudden and without warning kind of event can happen to anyone. It's what I worry about when I carry a passenger but most of the time I fly alone. I have a Dr appointment in a couple weeks and it's always the usual listen to my heart and lungs and see you in 6 months. This time I'm planning to request a couple things to ease my mind. A carotid ultra sound (a check for build up that could lead to a stroke), an EKG and cardiac echo to check heart function... cardiac output. If I get these two done and I'm good that will make me feel better.
When to hang up the keys is a tough decision indeed. I'd say get a good checkout by your doc and not just the standard look and listen. For me it will give me
some peace of mind.

Paul5r4,
Good plan. My brother died of a massive heart attack at 63. He did not know he was diabetic. I flew up to his ICU, and could smell keto acidosis when I entered the room. He was gone. Super sad, yet I had my doc check things out on me in (deep check).
He said " you are fine". I asked what would happen if I died as I stepped out of the hospital? He thought for just a second and replied "we'd turn you around and make it look like you were coming in".
I also had a good friend hand it up at the age of 93. He was a very good pilot up until the end.
Daddyman58

 

[DickF]

Hmmmm.

 

[Paul 5r4]

Paul5r4,
Good plan. My brother died of a massive heart attack at 63. He did not know he was diabetic. I flew up to his ICU, and could smell keto acidosis when I entered the room. He was gone. Super sad, yet I had my doc check things out on me in (deep check).
He said " you are fine". I asked what would happen if I died as I stepped out of the hospital? He thought for just a second and replied "we'd turn you around and make it look like you were coming in".
I also had a good friend hand it up at the age of 93. He was a very good pilot up until the end.
Daddyman58

I love the turn you around to be coming in! Yes, At this age I 100% feel it's good to get the carotid ultrasound done as well as a cardiac echo to check for any wall motion abnormality which "something" had to cause. EKG is useless at predicting anything past this present moment... however, if it shows any EKG abnormalities or changes from a previous one you may have had, it would be prudent to press on to another test. I've seen many patients over my career that had positive indication for a previous heart attack and they never had a clue. Someone mentioned a stress test which would be another good option. The real reason for these kind of non-invasive work ups is for me personally at 68, I absolutely owe in to a passenger. I will state this too. Just because you "feel" fine and consider yourself in great shape and healthy... it can mean nothing. I've seen this many times as well. Folks who thought everything is great then a stroke or sudden onset of chest pain up to the crushing type pain that is incapacitating. I've seen it. I would say ask your MD for a small work up on these type of issues. I owe it to my passengers.

 

[woxofswa]

Funny the things you think about when you are reflecting on things in life. In this case, I was thinking about pop giving up flying at 55 due to hearing issues. He was flying and was unable to understand Atlanta Center and decided to head back home and give it up.

At 68, I'm still going strong but was thinking where/when do you draw the line?

Hanging up the Spurs - KITPLANES

As I write this, it is August 31, 2020, which wouldn’t normally mean anything to anybody, especially me. Except for this particular day is my official termination (retirement) date as a pilot for Southwest Airlines. Because of accrued vacation, I flew my last official trip a few weeks ago and I...

www.kitplanes.com

 

[RV-9erA]

This is a very GOOD discussion. I'm 68 and am in pretty good health and shape. I was an ICU RN for over 3 decades and have seen many people pass... some suddenly. Just yesterday I found out that my cousins 41 year old son in law got out of his car then dropped to the ground. People were close. Checked his pulse and nothing. After EMS arrived, the coded him and nothing so he's gone. I know a sudden and without warning kind of event can happen to anyone. It's what I worry about when I carry a passenger but most of the time I fly alone. I have a Dr appointment in a couple weeks and it's always the usual listen to my heart and lungs and see you in 6 months. This time I'm planning to request a couple things to ease my mind. A carotid ultra sound (a check for build up that could lead to a stroke), an EKG and cardiac echo to check heart function... cardiac output. If I get these two done and I'm good that will make me feel better.
When to hang up the keys is a tough decision indeed. I'd say get a good checkout by your doc and not just the standard look and listen. For me it will give me
some peace of mind.

However, based on the people I have known, who passed away by natural causes, there were substantial warning signals that were ignored, and most of these folks had long-term health issues such as untreated long-term high BP. Being an ICU RN yourself and seeing it all the time, you probably felt that everyone could be a potential "ticking time boom", but the probability is quite low without prior heath signals for sudden death or incapacitation. However, the probability of having a sudden unexpected heart attack or stroke goes way-up for heavy smokers and long-term poor lifestyle choices.

 

[mic2377]

There are lots of older pilots who still have the skills and cognitive ability to fly safely. In fact the vast majority of general aviation pilots I see are 50-60+. Now that being said, I do think there is a often a lack of insight in objective assessment of their abilities in this population.

Something I can't figure out is why so many older pilots lament the decline in general aviation, but don't incorporate flying with a younger safety pilot. Surely there are younger pilots who are looking to fly as much as possible, either for the love of flying or to accrue hours for a rating, who could help older pilots stay in the air but stay safe? I practically never see this happen.

I think about an incident I had. I had relocated and due to the combination of moving as well as my RV being down for maintenance, I hadn't flown in almost a year. I flew up and picked the plane up to fly 3.5 hours home. Unbeknownst to me, on takeoff, I had hit debris which punctured one of my main tires. After a nice soft initial touchdown, the plane immediately made a HARD left for the runway edge when the main tire was weighted and hung up on the wheel pant. Fortunately I was able to straighten it out and keep it close to the centerline with max rudder and opposite brake, but it was a situation that required very prompt and aggressive action that was unanticipated. The airport manager told me that the last time this happened, the pilot departed the runway and damaged the aircraft further. He was impressed by how it was basically a non incident in my case.

Now I would ask that while some can still handle routine flights, can you handle these rare events that require quick reflexes and prompt, decisive action? And how about after a period of inactivity? If not, maybe it is time to hang it up.

In my case I am WAY younger than most pilots here (late 30's), and enjoy a wide variety of hand/eye coordination activities like mountain biking and tennis on a regular basis. I credit this with keeping me both fit and sharp.

Personally if I wanted to still fly but felt I was fading, I would take up flying an ultralight with no passenger, and fly in an unpopulated rural area. Then I would worry a lot less about hurting someone else, with the consequences being a couple stalks of corn I crashed into.

 

[Amadeus]

Personally if I wanted to still fly but felt I was fading, I would take up flying an ultralight with no passenger, and fly in an unpopulated rural area. Then I would worry a lot less about hurting someone else, with the consequences being a couple stalks of corn I crashed into.

Other than the handful of urban cities in Ohio the state is basically one big unimproved airstrip. You couldn't carry enough fuel on an ultralight to escape unpopulated area!

 

[622BH]

There are times medical issues kick us in the face and there's no choice but hanging it up. Sure, there might be opportunity to get back in the "saddle" after you put up with the timeline FAA medical regs require for controlled care, etc...
Being diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, which doesn't give most patients a lot to time to survive the medical requirements, I've got to hang it up. Last year I sold one-third of the plane. As the year progressed, I talked with the co-owner about buying me out at some point, as fitting to his financial situation. I guess over the year without me being in the plane but twice, he has decided its time to move forward.
Personally, it's a roller coaster ride. YES, I would love to continue flying. NO, I don't believe I will ever be able to be PIC again. The medications, etc. just don't permit. The time has arrived... I'll admit, right now, I'm content with the decision. I'm sure there'll be regret in the future. But, as they say... Better to be down here wishing I were up there, than being up there wishing I were down here. Most importantly, I won't be endangering any "innocents" in the air or on the ground.
I've got my simulator configured to perform like the real plane, and if I crash and burn on that, who cares - hit the reset and go fly again - and enjoy the memories. There have been quite a few over the past 50+ years.

 

[RV-9erA]

There are lots of older pilots who still have the skills and cognitive ability to fly safely. In fact the vast majority of general aviation pilots I see are 50-60+. Now that being said, I do think there is a often a lack of insight in objective assessment of their abilities in this population.

Something I can't figure out is why so many older pilots lament the decline in general aviation, but don't incorporate flying with a younger safety pilot. Surely there are younger pilots who are looking to fly as much as possible, either for the love of flying or to accrue hours for a rating, who could help older pilots stay in the air but stay safe? I practically never see this happen.

I think about an incident I had. I had relocated and due to the combination of moving as well as my RV being down for maintenance, I hadn't flown in almost a year. I flew up and picked the plane up to fly 3.5 hours home. Unbeknownst to me, on takeoff, I had hit debris which punctured one of my main tires. After a nice soft initial touchdown, the plane immediately made a HARD left for the runway edge when the main tire was weighted and hung up on the wheel pant. Fortunately I was able to straighten it out and keep it close to the centerline with max rudder and opposite brake, but it was a situation that required very prompt and aggressive action that was unanticipated. The airport manager told me that the last time this happened, the pilot departed the runway and damaged the aircraft further. He was impressed by how it was basically a non incident in my case.

Now I would ask that while some can still handle routine flights, can you handle these rare events that require quick reflexes and prompt, decisive action? And how about after a period of inactivity? If not, maybe it is time to hang it up.

In my case I am WAY younger than most pilots here (late 30's), and enjoy a wide variety of hand/eye coordination activities like mountain biking and tennis on a regular basis. I credit this with keeping me both fit and sharp.

Personally if I wanted to still fly but felt I was fading, I would take up flying an ultralight with no passenger, and fly in an unpopulated rural area. Then I would worry a lot less about hurting someone else, with the consequences being a couple stalks of corn I crashed into.

It depends on how much previous flying experience the older pilot has. Many pilots take-up flying after retirement, so they are actually low-time pilots. In that cause, "yes" you're probably right. But, take an older pilot with thousands of flight hours over many years, then I would say these pilots are more experienced at sudden abnormal in-flight anomalies. I've flown many different types of aircraft since 1978, including the KC-135ER tanker, and I have been regularly flying and maintaining the RV-9A we completed 21-years ago. I have also experienced soft and flat tires upon landing a number of times, including one just last summer. Staying on the centerline by applying opposite rudder and brake is exactly how you do that (i.e. fly the airplane, don't let it fly you). I also don't have wheel-pants for this reason, so I can inspect my tires and brakes during each per-flight. Experience and training makes you ready for these things -- not younger age. And, also for many other things that you have not yet experienced but probably will if you fly long enough. So in this case, I would say "no" -- an older more experienced pilot would do better.

 

[Stevea]

There are times medical issues kick us in the face and there's no choice but hanging it up.

Just like 622BH said, sometimes the medical issue comes for you. It can be completely independent of medical history, good or bad lifestyle choices, age, etc. Sometimes bad stuff just happens, and the ability to act as PIC is a casualty.

Best to enjoy every second you have to fly..........

 

[RV-9erA]

In my case I am WAY younger than most pilots here (late 30's), and enjoy a wide variety of hand/eye coordination activities like mountain biking and tennis on a regular basis. I credit this with keeping me both fit and sharp.

Over the years, I have noticed "flying safely" is less about physical abilities but much more about good judgement, remaining proficient and matching the amount of money one has to the aircraft type they have enough training and experience in. Personally, I have seen more young doctors killed in aircraft they didn't have enough training nor experience in, along with a strong desire to get places in less than desirable conditions. Like the old saying goes -- "there are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots". And, most older pilots that I know seem to already know this.

 

[mic2377]

There are a lot of great points here that without question have to be agreed with... It is difficult to make an apples to apples comparison in many of these cases.

Flying is all about mitigating risk. The calculus of balancing experience, age, physical abilities, choice of aircraft, and controlling external risks (IE weather) are all part of it.

There is no doubt that experience is huge component (both in terms of skill and judgement) and to some degree can crutch physical/mental decline. But the best scenario is to have both. The points made above were in reference to the pilots who have neither experience or skill... And are older. There are way more of these out there than you can imagine. I would imagine that this is disproportionately less represented in a place like VAF where pilots probably fly more than average, and have more experience. If you doubt this, look at the insurance rates for this demographic. Or if you can even get insurance period.

And I will note that I also fly pant-less now too...

 

[GyroF-16]

At the upper end of the scale is the MORON who recently landed a 737 at Roanoke, VA touching down more than halfway down the runway, and was saved by the EMAS in the overrun. Appears to have closed the airport for a couple of days.

Point of order - I fly 737s for a living now, so this caught my attention, since I had heard nothing about it. A little Googling revealed that it was a regional airline crew in an Embraer 145.

NTSB: First officer twice tried to stop botched landing before plane skidded off Virginia runway

The first officer of a United Express flight that ran off the end of a wet runway at Roanoke-Blacksburg Regional Airport last month tried to get the captain to abort...

www.wtvr.com

Let’s at least make the distinction between a regional crew and the “upper end of the scale”.

On the “when to hang it up” topic. I’ve seen mental decline and Alzheimer’s up close. It’s a much bigger issue than simple medical problems that can be detected with various cardiovascular tests mentioned earlier. It’s essential that people close to you come forward and tell you when it’s time to stop. The person experiencing the decreased function will rarely see it on their own.

 

[622BH]

There are times medical issues kick us in the face and there's no choice but hanging it up. Sure, there might be opportunity to get back in the "saddle" after you put up with the timeline FAA medical regs require for controlled care, etc...
Being diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, which doesn't give most patients a lot to time to survive the medical requirements, I've got to hang it up. Last year I sold one-third of the plane. As the year progressed, I talked with the co-owner about buying me out at some point, as fitting to his financial situation. I guess over the year without me being in the plane but twice, he has decided its time to move forward.
Personally, it's a roller coaster ride. YES, I would love to continue flying. NO, I don't believe I will ever be able to be PIC again. The medications, etc. just don't permit. The time has arrived... I'll admit, right now, I'm content with the decision. I'm sure there'll be regret in the future. But, as they say... Better to be down here wishing I were up there, than being up there wishing I were down here. Most importantly, I won't be endangering any "innocents" in the air or on the ground.
I've got my simulator configured to perform like the real plane, and if I crash and burn on that, who cares - hit the reset and go fly again - and enjoy the memories. There have been quite a few over the past 50+ years.

The thread is focusing (my opinion) on pilots simply aging to a point of no longer being "cognitively" safe to act as PIC. Sure, there are some people well into their 90s - heck I've know a couple of centenarians - who are sharp enough to continue. And there are some in their 60s who should be removed from the active pilot rolls.
What they are NOT thinking about is when life deals us a really crappy hand, with little probability of full recovery. Given the FAA's requirements, and my age -72- I don't believe I'll ever be PIC again. Even if I could, due to lack of currency, no insurance company would touch me.
As I read the FAA requirements, anyone with cancer has a five-year "controlled" condition (my term for their words) to regain a medical. I'd be 77, with no recordable PIC time in that five years. Way I see it, I can put the monthly fees required to support ownership, while the airplane sits, to better active use over that period.
Andrea Boccelli has a beautiful song titled "Conte Partiro" translates to "Its Time to Say Goodbye." Beautiful song, but emotionally difficult for me at this time...

 

[jrs14855]

Point of order - I fly 737s for a living now, so this caught my attention, since I had heard nothing about it. A little Googling revealed that it was a regional airline crew in an Embraer 145.

NTSB: First officer twice tried to stop botched landing before plane skidded off Virginia runway

The first officer of a United Express flight that ran off the end of a wet runway at Roanoke-Blacksburg Regional Airport last month tried to get the captain to abort...

www.wtvr.com

Let’s at least make the distinction between a regional crew and the “upper end of the scale”.

On the “when to hang it up” topic. I’ve seen mental decline and Alzheimer’s up close. It’s a much bigger issue than simple medical problems that can be detected with various cardiovascular tests mentioned earlier. It’s essential that people close to you come forward and tell you when it’s time to stop. The person experiencing the decreased function will rarely see it on their own.

in theory there should be no distinction between a Regional Pilot and the upper end of the scale. Probably the worst pilot I ever flew with was a former 747 Capt for an airline that no longer exists. Don't insult the regionals with that kind of erroneous statement.

 

[wil780]

I have what I think is a fairly objective way of assessing my physical and cognitive abilities. I'm curious what people here think of think of it, since many of you clearly have been doing a lot of thinking about when to quit.

My current question is somewhat different than when to quit flying, but it's close enough to the issue of the thread that I think the method is relevant. At 77 I'm still flying my hardcore aerobatic plane to +7 and -4.5g and enjoying practicing Advanced level sequences (although I don't compete any more). The question is, when should I give this up and move over to an RV4/8 for the rest of my flying days.

For 60 years I've been riding motorcycles aggressively on winding backroads, and for about 30 years I've been doing the same in sporty cars. I estimate that my corner speeds are in the 98th percentile of what I see on those roads. When conditions are right I get up to the traction limit in cars, but I don't intentionally slide motorcycles. I did enough motorcycle roadracing in my 20s to be fairly sure I know what I'm doing. (I've never had an accident and my last speeding ticket was in 1983, so spare me the tut-tutting.)

The way I set my speed is to keep track of the small mistakes I make and slow down if the frequency is more than I'm comfortable with. Examples would be a foot off the line I want, or I misjudge a corner enough that my chosen line takes me 2 or 3 feet off the best line.

I've been using this technique my entire life, and I find I am still running corners at the same distance from the traction limit as when I was many years younger. I'm not making any more mistakes, despite my age. That gives me confidence that I'm still capable and safe at flying hard core aerobatics, and at general flying as well. The day I have to slow down on the road will be the day I sell my aerobatic plane and consider whether I should get an RV for more gentle, less demanding flying or maybe quit flying altogether.

 

[MacCool]

If one is interested in evaluation of the aging mind, there is no shortage of self-administered cognitive screening tools online. They shouldn't be viewed as actual diagnostic tools but they can be useful in identifying areas of concern.

 

[GyroF-16]

in theory there should be no distinction between a Regional Pilot and the upper end of the scale. Probably the worst pilot I ever flew with was a former 747 Capt for an airline that no longer exists. Don't insult the regionals with that kind of erroneous statement.

No insult intended, but I’m not sure what was erroneous. Just pointing out that, in general, regional pilots are not usually at the “upper end of the scale” in experience, nor in compensation.
Not a slight, as many work their way to major airlines through the regional system.

 

[clarenceoveur]

No insult intended, but I’m not sure what was erroneous. Just pointing out that, in general, regional pilots are not usually at the “upper end of the scale” in experience, nor in compensation.
Not a slight, as many work their way to major airlines through the regional system.

My x wife told me "its not so much what you said but how you said it"

 

[RV-9erA]

There are a lot of great points here that without question have to be agreed with... It is difficult to make an apples to apples comparison in many of these cases.

Flying is all about mitigating risk. The calculus of balancing experience, age, physical abilities, choice of aircraft, and controlling external risks (IE weather) are all part of it.

There is no doubt that experience is huge component (both in terms of skill and judgement) and to some degree can crutch physical/mental decline. But the best scenario is to have both. The points made above were in reference to the pilots who have neither experience or skill... And are older. There are way more of these out there than you can imagine. I would imagine that this is disproportionately less represented in a place like VAF where pilots probably fly more than average, and have more experience. If you doubt this, look at the insurance rates for this demographic. Or if you can even get insurance period.

And I will note that I also fly pant-less now too...

I thought you might enjoy watching the video of a younger former F-15E fighter pilot being schooled in RV-8 formation flying by an older but very experienced pilot. Personally, I think it has more to do with staying active and proficient in terms of cognitive ability, especially with flying.

 

[Dugaru]

Cowboys get buried with their boots on. It might be a headset for me.

I’ve left instructions that I am to be buried in my RV, with my head stuck up under the panel. A bonus of this plan is that they may not need to move my body, since under-the-panel work is likely what will have killed me.

 

[Italiancowboy]

My brother-in-law is 80, former Air Force and Marine pilot. He's had a C421 forever and has gone through periods of "downsizing" but he's just more comfortable with the 421. Over the years he's gone from 50% of his hours solo to about 95% of his flights with me in the right seat (I'm mid-60s). That keeps him going not only in keeping his pilot skills current but the friendship and getting out and doing things, etc. I know this "buddy system" works to keep him flying.
I'll be looking for my "co-pilot" in the not too distant future.

 

[rocketman1988]

My brother-in-law is 80, former Air Force and Marine pilot. He's had a C421 forever and has gone through periods of "downsizing" but he's just more comfortable with the 421. Over the years he's gone from 50% of his hours solo to about 95% of his flights with me in the right seat (I'm mid-60s). That keeps him going not only in keeping his pilot skills current but the friendship and getting out and doing things, etc. I know this "buddy system" works to keep him flying.
I'll be looking for my "co-pilot" in the not too distant future.

The 421 is an awesome airplane; wish we still had ours. Don’t know how I’d afford to fly it but I suppose I would figure it out.

 

[edf]

Paul5r4,
Good plan. My brother died of a massive heart attack at 63. He did not know he was diabetic. I flew up to his ICU, and could smell keto acidosis when I entered the room. He was gone. Super sad, yet I had my doc check things out on me in (deep check).
He said " you are fine". I asked what would happen if I died as I stepped out of the hospital? He thought for just a second and replied "we'd turn you around and make it look like you were coming in".
I also had a good friend hand it up at the age of 93. He was a very good pilot up until the end.
Daddyman58

This has been a VERY informative number of posts for me. Even though I have been a member since 2008, I rarely respond to posts.

The decision to stop flying can be for various reasons. In addition to your age, current health, insurance, it can also involve other family members. I am 83 and still pass my flight physical with no problems. However, my wife has experienced numerous, serious health issues. Therefore, I have decided to focus on what she wants to do the next few years.

I had a fantastic career in aviation. After getting my engineering degree and a A & P license, I worked in flight test at Edwards AFB and then spent the next 40 years flying before retiring as an American Airlines Captain.

Due to spending a lot more time with my wife, I have flown a lot less and have devoted even less time building my RV-9A recently. It is about 50% to 60% complete. Therefore, I am going to stop flying and sell my RV-9A.

 

[Sam Buchanan]

I found the following thread while running down a VAF rabbit trail, it offers some very thoughtful insight. The original poster (VAF's David-Aviator) suddenly passed from this life three years after he started the thread.

Getting Older and When to Quit

This subject probably is of no interest to most here but it is a sure thing for all of us eventually. Time passes, we grow up and before you know it, you're a senior citizen. (old pilot here) The older you are the quicker time seems to pass, has something to do with years lived and length of...

vansairforce.net

 

[justa6ereh]

I used to watch my neighbor…at 86 years old, he lost his medical. On nice days though, he’d push his Pitts S1 out of the hangar and give it a pre flight inspection, wipe the wind screen and climb in.
he’d taxi on out to the run up area then shut down.

he’d walk across the taxiway to the mailboxes on the other side, collect his mail, start up and taxi back to the hangar. Every once in awhile, he’d stop at the end of the runway and just take it in for a minute. Then he’d taxi back to his hangar…

I took him for rides in my Rocket then, and we’d do loops and rolls and have a ball. He’d thank me each time and ask to go again, any time I had an empty seat.

I asked him one time about taxiing out for the mail and he just looked at the ground and said “ I just can’t stop, ya know…it’s who I am…”. That reply impacted me.

I’m the same, It’s who I am too.

I’ll quit when I’m damn good and ready…and if I want to taxi out for the mail, then I’ll do that too.

This thing that we do, is a privilege of the highest order. A blessing and a responsibility.

I am not me, without THIS part of me. Aviation is what made me run outside as a child looking and learning about planes that flew overhead. it’s what made me learn about virtually everything in the world, from wires to rivets, bolts to carburetors and magnetos and a million things normal people know nothing about.

I can’t figure how normal people can live a whole life without the passion I have in mine for something so precious.

Quit? Won’t happen. The mechanism may change…but aviation won’t. A Champ gave way to a Stinson, then a 180, then a whole string of amazing aircraft over the years…started out building RC models and maybe end up there one day a few decades from now, but aviation will not quit in me. I will always look to the sky. During troubled times, or total tranquility, this is my respite.

It’s in the DNA. You get it, or you don’t.

Aviation keeps me alive, keeps me whole, gives me hope and inspires me to be a better human being.

I hope it does that for you too.

Quitting that, is not optional, until life…quits me.

 

[roadrunner20]

I found the following thread while running down a VAF rabbit trail, it offers some very thoughtful insight. The original poster (VAF's David-Aviator) suddenly passed from this life three years after he started the thread.

Getting Older and When to Quit

This subject probably is of no interest to most here but it is a sure thing for all of us eventually. Time passes, we grow up and before you know it, you're a senior citizen. (old pilot here) The older you are the quicker time seems to pass, has something to do with years lived and length of...

vansairforce.net

Yes, I remember David & reading that thread years ago. I'm still flying, but I know there's a future end date. Hoping it will be when I choose to opt out.

 

[Tankerpilot75]

Ah, if only this were true:

View attachment 103718

There’s some real truth to this poster. I recently sold my RV7A because in my heart I felt it was time. No one ever suggested to me it was time to sell and quit flying, I just felt “it’s time.” I’m 78 and feel like I’ve aged five years in the last two months. Going back to the gym now to work off some “years” but it’s not easy.

A friend of mine kept flying to age 90 and his family convinced him to finally sell his RV9A. I flew with him on his last two flights in his aircraft and I will say he flew it beautifully. His background was as a military fighter pilot finishing off his military career in the F100D. He’s still around at 94, living independently, chasing the ladies, and driving his car. The only medication he takes is vitamins. Everyone is different!

All I can say is “listen to your gut”, it’ll help you make the right decision. But remember, don’t lie to yourself!

 

[Aerobaticjunkie]

I'll be 75 in January. I've been flying for 53 years, military, airline, corporate and private. My last flight will be when I can no longer physically crawl into the cockpit. Like many of you, flying is my lifeblood. Without it, I'm just existing.

 

[GyroF-16]

Ah, if only this were true:

View attachment 103718

I need to get one of those…

Just put it on my Christmas list.

 

[RV-9erA]

Ah, if only this were true:

View attachment 103718

I think if you "keep your head in the game" and continue learning on every flight you take, I don't see where age is the biggest factor. Hey -- it's like walking and remaining "active" every day vs sitting in your chair watching tv. That alone provides a huge improvement in "quality of life", both physically and mentally. Continuing to fly is much the same. I've actually seen more guys give-up flying (of all ages) due to the cost and keeping up with new technology.

 

[David Paule]

One of my closer friends is close to 50 years younger than I am. She recently got engaged, and her fiancee flies. I asked them, as a favor, to attempt to answer the question, "when should I quit?"

A few weeks later they gave me this list:

1. Personal performance metrics -
a, Stable and predictable pattern,
b. Do normal tasks feel like a high workload?
c. Maneuvers, are they consistent and within the proper perameters?

2. Cognitive indicators -
a. Delayed or missing radio calls,
b. Trouble remembering checklist items,
c. Decision making, do I hesitate before making time-sensitive decisions?

3. Personal comfort and enjoyment - stress vs joy ratio -
a. Has the desire to avoid certain conditions expanded?
b. Does the no-go list keep expanding?

There was some irony in the timing, since I was medically grounded at the time.

Dave

 

[Sam Buchanan]

One of my closer friends is close to 50 years younger than I am. She recently got engaged, and her fiancee flies. I asked them, as a favor, to attempt to answer the question, "when should I quit?"

A few weeks later they gave me this list:

1. Personal performance metrics -
a, Stable and predictable pattern,
b. Do normal tasks feel like a high workload?
c. Maneuvers, are they consistent and within the proper perameters?

2. Cognitive indicators -
a. Delayed or missing radio calls,
b. Trouble remembering checklist items,
c. Decision making, do I hesitate before making time-sensitive decisions?

3. Personal comfort and enjoyment - stress vs joy ratio -
a. Has the desire to avoid certain conditions expanded?
b. Does the no-go list keep expanding?

There was some irony in the timing, since I was medically grounded at the time.

Dave

That is an excellent list and one I see as applicable as I reflect on the winding down of my flying journey. I'm already nibbling around the edges of some of those indicators...............