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  #1  
Old 01-15-2017, 03:31 PM
Saville's Avatar
Saville Saville is offline
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: KBVY Massachusetts
Posts: 1,265
Default Builder Used Wrong Screw Size - Now What?

Now that I've acquired some countersinking skills I can get to the REAL problem:

I'm replacing the battery tray in my -8 to accommodate an Odyssey 925 battery. The footprint of the Odyssey battery is not the same as the Gill that was there - it's narrower side to side. So I bought a new battery tray from Van's and riveted in new angle for the new footprint. So far so good.

The tray is fastened to two flanges aft of the baggage compartment 3 holes on each flange (numbered 1-6 in this picture):



The plans call out for AN509-10R9 (10-32) screws going into K1000-3 nutplates on the underside of the flanges. You can see the rivets for the nutplates in the picture.

BUT................

the builder chose to use 8-32 screws going into K1000-8 nutplates.

I CANNOT fathom why the builder would do such a thing. This tray is right near the elevator pushrods/bellcranks/autopilot. Should the tray rip from it's moorings the controls could get fatally fouled.

Much swearing and cursing.

Ok but now what to do?

I compared a K1000-8 to a K1000-3 and the rivet holes are the same size and the same distance apart. I believe they are interchangable so long as I drill a larger clearance hole for the 10R9's in the flange.

But being a newbie, I don't see how they can be flush riveted in place.

An alternative would be to remove the nutplates, drill the larger clearance holes for the 10R9's, and use stop nuts/cotter pin nuts/ safety wired nuts instead of nutplates. If I did that, and left the rivet holes empty does that somehow compromise the strength of the flange? I'm assuming that the reduced spacing between the larger clearance holes and the rivet holes is not detrimental.

I supposed I could mount a doubler along the underside of the flange fastened by the 3, 10R9's

That's all I can come up with - any thoughts would be appreciated.

(why the !@#$% would the builder do that???)
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  #2  
Old 01-15-2017, 03:40 PM
David Paule David Paule is offline
 
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Location: Boulder, CO
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Default

You could switch to an EarthX battery and use the #8 screws. The EarthX is much lighter and would impose smaller loads.

Or you could contact Van's tomorrow, and get their advice.

I'm certain there are other options as well.

Dave
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  #3  
Old 01-15-2017, 03:47 PM
BobTurner BobTurner is offline
 
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Location: Livermore, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saville View Post

But being a newbie, I don't see how they can be flush riveted in place.
)
I don't see the issue. There appears to be plenty of room to get a rivet gun on top, bucking bar underneath.
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  #4  
Old 01-15-2017, 03:54 PM
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Saville Saville is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTurner View Post
I don't see the issue. There appears to be plenty of room to get a rivet gun on top, bucking bar underneath.
Yep you are right. And the rivets are drilled out from the top.
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  #5  
Old 01-15-2017, 03:59 PM
Ron B. Ron B. is offline
 
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Location: Yarmouth, Nova Scotia
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Why could you not just use countersunk pulled rivets to hold the nutplates, if you are not comfortable with installing solid rivets. The rivet is only there to hold the nutplate from moving. They have no effect after the fastener is secured.
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  #6  
Old 01-15-2017, 04:25 PM
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skylor skylor is offline
 
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Location: Southern California
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Default Battery Tray Nutplates

Borrow a hand squeezer from a builder or mechanic on your field and hand squeeze the replacement nutplate rivets. There is plenty of access there for a hand squeezer. Easy peasy!

Skylor
RV-8
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  #7  
Old 01-15-2017, 05:45 PM
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RV6_flyer RV6_flyer is offline
 
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Location: NC25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTurner View Post
I don't see the issue. There appears to be plenty of room to get a rivet gun on top, bucking bar underneath.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron B. View Post
Why could you not just use countersunk pulled rivets to hold the nutplates, if you are not comfortable with installing solid rivets. The rivet is only there to hold the nutplate from moving. They have no effect after the fastener is secured.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skylor View Post
Borrow a hand squeezer from a builder or mechanic on your field and hand squeeze the replacement nutplate rivets. There is plenty of access there for a hand squeezer. Easy peasy!

Skylor
RV-8
Very easy job. IF you use pop rivets, they are only holding the nutplates in place. Cheaper to use solid rivets and hand squeezer.

When a nutplate needs replaced on my 19+ year old RV-6, I will use pop rivets when unable to get in with a squeezer.
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  #8  
Old 01-15-2017, 06:57 PM
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ChiefPilot ChiefPilot is offline
 
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Location: Twin Cities, MN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saville View Post
I CANNOT fathom why the builder would do such a thing. This tray is right near the elevator pushrods/bellcranks/autopilot. Should the tray rip from it's moorings the controls could get fatally fouled.

Much swearing and cursing.
You must get excited pretty easily. This is far from the most egregious thing a builder has done, and looking at the relative strength differences between the two sizes of AN509 machine screws I really have to wonder if it's that big of a deal. Bias is towards the designer's plans, of course, but you might mess things up more by drilling the rivets/nutplates out if you don't have prior building experience. In that case, replacing the existing nutplates might do more harm than good.
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  #9  
Old 01-15-2017, 07:24 PM
rv7charlie rv7charlie is offline
 
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Location: Pocahontas MS
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edit; just realized he said a PC925; never mind...

Last edited by rv7charlie : 01-15-2017 at 07:26 PM.
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  #10  
Old 01-15-2017, 07:31 PM
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skylor skylor is offline
 
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Location: Southern California
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Default Missing Nut

Is there a nut missing from the elevator pushrod rod end bearing where it attaches to the bell crank?
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