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  #21  
Old 11-23-2020, 05:25 PM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Location: Hubbard Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PMLviator View Post
Greg you must have long arms to change oil with just the top cowl off. Two wrenches under the tank to remove the plug, then catch the plug and hold a container for the oil, and thats not counting holding the bottle for the oil test sample. An "easy changeout", I believe it took me two hours just to install the two bolts through the firewall and that was with no engine and cables in the way.
I think you totally missed Greg's point.....

I doubt anyone changes the oil by removing only the bottom cowl, so that means the top cowl is off at every oil change (what he likely meant).
That means at every oil change there is an easy opportunity to inspect the engine mount standoff.

Secondary comment.... All our aircraft at Van's have quick drain valves for doing oil changes but those are utilized for the convenience of not haveing to remove and then reseal on installation, a drain plug.

We do not at all endorse (in fact we discourage) doing oil changes with part of the cowl still installed.
Stuff breaks on airplanes. A lot of that stuff can cause a serious safety issue. Taking a good look over the entire engine installation every 50 hrs or so is a very good idea.
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Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
Hubbard, Oregon
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")

Last edited by rvbuilder2002 : 11-23-2020 at 05:30 PM.
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  #22  
Old 11-23-2020, 06:33 PM
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Dgamble Dgamble is offline
 
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"Taking a good look over the entire engine installation every 50 hrs or so is a very good idea."

And I don't disagree.

I can count on one finger the times that I have done an annual inspection that had an additional 50 hours since the previous one. I have also changed oil that had no more than 7 hours on it. My oil changes are done by calendar, not hours.

Everyone's situation is different. Some of us rack up a lot of hours, and some of us don't. I take a deep-dive look at any part of the airplane that gets exposed throughout the year, which is often enough with service bulletins and other maintenance jobs that crop up. If it has been awhile when an oil change comes due, I strip it down to take a look.

That said, I don't feel a compelling need to prolong routine jobs if I don't believe that the current situation warrants it.

I'm comfortable with making those decisions for myself. It's why I have an Experimental.
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Grove City, OH

RV-6 N466PG Purchased already flying - SOLD!

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The above web blogs and any links provided thereto are not instructional or advisory in nature. They merely seek to share my experiences in building and flying Van's RV airplanes.
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  #23  
Old 11-23-2020, 09:48 PM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dgamble View Post
I installed a quarter-turn quick drain valve on my oil tank. I can reach it to attach a hose to it by reaching up through the openings at the back of the lower cowl. I can also remove the oil filter and magnetic plug with the lower cowl still attached. It is a much easier process to change the oil that way. FWIW.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dgamble View Post
"Taking a good look over the entire engine installation every 50 hrs or so is a very good idea."

And I don't disagree.

I can count on one finger the times that I have done an annual inspection that had an additional 50 hours since the previous one. I have also changed oil that had no more than 7 hours on it. My oil changes are done by calendar, not hours.

Everyone's situation is different. Some of us rack up a lot of hours, and some of us don't. I take a deep-dive look at any part of the airplane that gets exposed throughout the year, which is often enough with service bulletins and other maintenance jobs that crop up. If it has been awhile when an oil change comes due, I strip it down to take a look.

That said, I don't feel a compelling need to prolong routine jobs if I don't believe that the current situation warrants it.

I'm comfortable with making those decisions for myself. It's why I have an Experimental.

Your first post clearly indicates you can do an oil change without removing the bottom cowl, so I guess what you are saying in the second post is that you do at least one during the year at far fewer hrs than then normal change interval and for that one you donít remove the bottom cowl?

Fair enough, but based on some of the fwf issues I have seen on aircraft over the years, My recommendation is that people use every opportunity available to do an inspection. It takes maybe 5-6 more minutes to remove the bottom cowl on most RVís.
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Opinions, information and comments are my own unless stated otherwise. They do not necessarily represent the direction/opinions of my employer.

Scott McDaniels
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
Hubbard, Oregon
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")
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  #24  
Old 11-24-2020, 07:32 PM
rjtjrt rjtjrt is offline
 
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What is the difference between the new WD-01221-1 and the original design?
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  #25  
Old 11-28-2020, 11:22 AM
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LettersFromFlyoverCountry LettersFromFlyoverCountry is offline
 
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Gosh, I'm getting tired of throwing out parts that have exactly ZERO flight time.

I'm in the middle of installing the engine so it seems prudent to stop, take it off and make this replacement just as I did with the gear leg last year. As someone upstream noted, the engine mount is nothing to mess around with.

Two steps forward....1 back.

Also, can we get some details on the design change?
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St. Paul, MN.
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Last edited by LettersFromFlyoverCountry : 11-28-2020 at 11:42 AM.
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  #26  
Old 11-28-2020, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LettersFromFlyoverCountry View Post
Gosh, I'm getting tired of throwing out parts that have exactly ZERO flight time.

I'm in the middle of installing the engine so it seems prudent to stop, take it off and make this replacement just as I did with the gear leg last year. As someone upstream noted, the engine mount is nothing to mess around with.

Two steps forward....1 back.

Also, can we get some details on the design change?
Bob, you don't need to remove the engine and mount to change the nose gear leg or engine mount truss.
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Hubbard, Oregon
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  #27  
Old 11-28-2020, 12:39 PM
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LettersFromFlyoverCountry LettersFromFlyoverCountry is offline
 
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The timing on these things has been comparatively fortuitous. I did the nose gear leg last winter before I got the powerplant kit. Easy peasy (except on the wallet, of course)

Yes, looking closer at the steps (I saw the engine hoist earlier which is why I thought it'd be more complex than it is), I see that I can just unload the weight, pull the bolts, remove, replace, insert bolts, torque, and be done.

Shouldn't be too hard.
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Blog: Letters From Flyover Country
RV-12iS Powerplant kit
N612EF Builder log (EAA Builder log)
Last article: "Gonna Finish This Sucker" (Kitplanes)
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  #28  
Old 11-28-2020, 05:34 PM
lon@carolon.net lon@carolon.net is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
It takes maybe 5-6 more minutes to remove the bottom cowl on most RVís.
Boy, I'd sure like to see a video of that! And how many minutes to put the bottom cowl back on again?
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  #29  
Old 11-28-2020, 09:56 PM
RFSchaller RFSchaller is offline
 
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I have asked this question before with no answer: why are all these part failures happening in the field, but not on the original Vans RV-12? Leads me to believe pilot technique is causing many of these failures leading to fleet replacements. Case in point: I have 1040 hours and over 8 years on my 12 with the same nose tire that still looks like new tread. Why would I expect a nose gear leg failure. I never found loose rivets on the engine mount, I never had wing skin cracks, my prop hub never cracked, my trim servo isnít bent and I have never seen cracks on my stabilator spar. Seems like some of this stuff is overkill.
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  #30  
Old 11-28-2020, 11:07 PM
rgmwa rgmwa is offline
 
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It may seem like overkill and you may be right. Maybe lots of these issues are the result of rough handling of a plane that’s lightly built for a reason, but at least when Vans become aware of a problem they obviously take it seriously and we end up with an improved aircraft. If they just ignored problems, even apparently minor ones, they’d soon be out of business.
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