If you are in need of one that you can't wait, let me know and as I have some spare ones that I can let you have one.Looks like I won't be ordering any at Aircraft Spruce anytime soon. 3 month back order?
Several threads on that here on VAF, they seem to be pretty good, but also hard to get....
Has anyone ever tried one of those Challenger "lifetime" oil filters? Any idea how well those work?
Several threads on that here on VAF, they seem to be pretty good, but also hard to get.
Interesting, looking back through the archives. Challenger is just up the road from me. But I sent an email this morning to K&P, the non-PMA manufacturer behind them, based on archived threads. We'll see what the current recommendation(s) are. I'll seriously consider them if this Spruce backorder drags on.
I'm sad to learn of K&P's owner passing; I talked with him a few times over the years and appreciate his innovation. However, I did just order an S40 filter for my motorcycle and it came within a few days, so I'd say the business is still running well.
The Challenger filter is made by K&P for Challenger; and they are rightfully protective of Challenger's PMA status, which I discovered years ago when I bought replacement quad rings for my Challenger filters on my Baron.
However, for experimental use, which we are talking about, a Lycoming engine will use the C4 housing, the element is FE-15, the spring is FE-RS1 and the o-ring is QR2. These components together will form a a non-PMA filter that mirrors the Challenger CP48109.
You can order these as parts online at https://usaoilfilters.com.
I personally have K&P filters on all of my vehicles - driven mostly by their very high quality and excellent filtration, but also by no longer tossing oil filters in the garbage and buying new ones. It's $180 or so for the filter components I described, so there is a pay-back period. But it also solves supply chain issues on disposable filters.
I went ahead and ordered an S-15 from usaoilfilters.
Interestingly, I got a reply a few moments ago from K&P, so they're certainly still around. Even though I made clear this was for an experimental engine on an experimental aircraft, their only word on the matter was that they were not set up liability/insurance-wise for anything aviation-related, and that it all had to go through Challenger.
But I'm pretty sure that was a nudge-nudge-wink-wink deal, because in the next paragraph they confirmed that for a /non-aviation application/, the equivalent to a Champion 48108 is still the S-15. Even going so far as to mention the safety wire drill hole locations "which many race applications require" (their words in the reply).
Given the websites' extreme similarities, I wonder if usaoilfilters is just a distributor sister-business of K&P. Regardless, the S15 oil filter assembly combo looks to be what we're all familiar with, by your parts listing below.
BTW, as noted on older threads and both companies' websites, the C4 housing no longer exists. The FE15 filter and S15 assembly both reference fitting into the C3 housing now. I emailed K&P this morning asking for confirmation that this C3 housing is still the intended replacement for a 48108 / 48109-series filter.
Stuff like this, I go ahead and say it's going on a customized RV.Definitely going on an airboat if anybody asks.
I can't find any suppliers with the tempest 48110-2 instock. This problem isn't likely to go away for awhile soooo...... I just spent a couple hundred bucks on one of these K&P filters.
...
Still VERY impressed with this filter. Even if disposable filters become readably available again, just to save the money I'll be using the K&P.
I'm sad to learn of K&P's owner passing; I talked with him a few times over the years and appreciate his innovation. However, I did just order an S40 filter for my motorcycle and it came within a few days, so I'd say the business is still running well.
The Challenger filter is made by K&P for Challenger; and they are rightfully protective of Challenger's PMA status, which I discovered years ago when I bought replacement quad rings for my Challenger filters on my Baron.
However, for experimental use, which we are talking about, a Lycoming engine will use the C4 housing, the element is FE-15, the spring is FE-RS1 and the o-ring is QR2. These components together will form a non-PMA filter that mirrors the Challenger CP48109.
You can order these as parts online at https://usaoilfilters.com.
I personally have K&P filters on all of my vehicles - driven mostly by their very high quality and excellent filtration, but also by no longer tossing oil filters in the garbage and buying new ones. It's $180 or so for the filter components I described, so there is a pay-back period. But it also solves supply chain issues on disposable filters. The additional benefits include quick and easy inspection; I've described this in other forum threads at length as well.
The S15 kit with the C3 housing is what I am running.
For those of you getting the K&P, just curious how long your delivery took? I ordered a few weeks and haven't heard a peep - just trying to calibrate my delivery expectations.
I couldn’t find a C4 housing listed on their website. Would another housing fit?
Their S15 filter kit includes all the parts you listed, except it has a C3 housing, and is less expensive than buying individual parts.
What I like the most about the K&P filter is that I no longer have to cut open the filter can and cut out the paper element to inspect the filter. Just a bit of diesel fuel or some brake cleaner to see what's trapped in the element. I bought two of the filter elements so that I can take my time inspecting and cleaning the "dirty" one.
Couple of pictures here: http://www.rv8.ch/first-oil-change-with-kp-cleanable-filter/
View attachment 26015
all correct on the latest posts, and major thread drift here, but since you insist
The S15 is also used on many different automobile equipment, hence I ordered mine from ECS Tuning... and there are more providers out there.
However, for experimental use, which we are talking about, a Lycoming engine will use the C4 housing, the element is FE-15, the spring is FE-RS1 and the o-ring is QR2. These components together will form a non-PMA filter that mirrors the Challenger CP48109.
Further clarification -
K&P only sells via distributors. usaoilfilters.com is their distributor sister-company that you should order through. Do not mention anything "airplane", else K&P will cut the conversation very short and point you to Challenger. .
If you need the nut, It will co$t you. It is not needed. Don't purchase in parts, just order the S-15 and the thread adapter.
Skip that post that you referenced and read through the others again. Everything is explained.
Can't blame them - they have apparently transferred the risk of selling aviation products to Challenger. You will get a similar response from just about any clued-in vendor of stuff that might be used in aviation.How very true. I spoke with them briefly over the phone about C4 housing versus C3 and safety wiring a C3.
Then went to their website (USAOilfilters). I ordered a S15 and a 3/4-16 nipple.
Two hours later I get an email that they have canceled my order due to the fact that they suspect, from my phone call, that this might go on an airplane.
David
I definitely appreciate all the input people have made to this thread, but I can't seem to figure out what K&P option would replace the 48110. 48109 and 48110 have some different dimensions, although it looks like the mounting dimensions are the same. The ACS descriptions (shown in the screenshot) are also different. It is clear that CP-48110C is the Challenger part, but I don't know how to translate that to the K&P housing, filter, spring and o-ring part numbers with any level of confidence.
Do you know if the S15 (or the C3 or C4 housings) works to replace the 48110 too?
Also, does the C4 housing come with the hex "nut" shown in the picture? That alone would make it desirable over the C3.
Thanks,
John
Yes, the C4 housing has the 1" nut on the end. It is the same in volume as the C3 housing. The direct answer to your question is that you can replace a 48110 with a S15, along with the 3/4-116 Thread Fitting. The 48110-1 filter does not have a bypass, but you can buy the S15 without one as well if desired. Noting DCBrown198's issue, maybe don't call them after all and instead just buy the S15 and nipple online USA Oilfilters, otherwise buy the S15 and then buy the 3/4-16 nipple from somewhere else, such as this one from Summit Racing.
I've had no issue ordering the C4 housing in the past. I've bought two filters from Challenger for my certified airplanes and then the C4 on three different occasions for experimental aircraft, once via the USA Oil Filters website and twice over the phone, clearly stating it was for my experimental aircraft; I worked with Dave Fisher if that helps. Others have reportedly had issues doing so, noted on this thread and few others on the forum. I agree with, and have said before that I believe their apprehension is related to protecting their PMA supplier agreement with Challenger, which is entirely understandable.
Assuming that you are not able to purchase the C4 housing and desire the 1" nut, the CP-48110C filter is available as a certified part for $279 from Knots 2U. In the big scheme of all things aviation, it's not that much more than a machined finish S15 with the adapter, but also already has the "nut" and is drilled for safetying.
Yet another alternative is to buy the filter through a local dealer. My local KTM motorcycle dealer is also a K&P dealer will be happy to sell me whatever is available from K&P in his dealer catalog.
Even if you buy the filter from Challenger, you can still buy and use the QR2 quad rings directly from USA Oil Filters as needed. I get about 2-3 oil changes per side of the quad-ring based on wear or nicks in the rubber.
After thinking more about the aluminum nut, I feel like it might get marred up with the way I handle wrenches sometimes, but I may still get the PMA version.
Thanks again.