Garmin 430/530 vs 196/296

I would appreciate comments from pilots who have used both panel mount and portable units in their RVs to comment on the everyday practical features and usefulness of the Garmin 430/530 vs 196/296 as well as cost -effectiveness for your typical RV mission profile.

Obviously the cost is the first huge difference; legal IFR usage another; hard install vs. simple install another.

Finally, for those who went with the 430/530: would you do it again after seeing the 196/296?
Thanks!

I use the 430 and the 295 in a C-182 that we use for crosscountry from time to time. This aircraft was certified for IFR with the 430. The 430 is great since it also has a NAV/COM in it as well. The ground mapping is not much but the control zone/restricted area depiction is great.

The 295/296 is a whole other deal and cannot really be compared to the 430. I have heard of some pilots being able to run an A/P from the 296 but our tech guy says we cannot hook up the 295 or 296 to the S-Tech A/P in the Cessna. The 430 has the capability of running the A/P.

Sorry I cannot be of more help to you. My main focus has been more VFR with this aircraft although I can do basic stuff with the 430. We will have something like the 296 in our "8" when the time comes, but we would also like something that could feed into the A/P and EFIS for wind and drift info that would be permanent.

If you are not that close to doing your panel, wait a bit, because the technology is changing so fast that there could be something better in less than 6 months down the road. Garmin just released the iQue3600 for instance, a palm type computer with Garmin GPS on board. It has a nice screen orientation also, opposite to the 296 but with most of the same bells and whistles. Once again, it is a Palm Pilot and will not tolerate sub zero temps, so not suitable for permanent installation.
Cheers, Pete

There's other options as well if you haven't made any hardcore decisions on the rest of your panel.
One way I'm leaning a lot is to go with the Grand Rapids EFIS (dual) and feed the Garmin GNC 300XL certified GPS into it as well as an SL-30 for VOR/Nav input.

That way, you get the internal moving map in the EFIS driven by a certified GPS signal. As a bonus, you get a teeny little moving map on the 300 itself as another reference.

Too many options; too little money.

Matt
RV7-A

Grand Rapids EFIS / 300XL Combo

Vern (Highflight),
I am in San Antonio. I am about to do the same thing with my father's instrument panel. Would you mind calling me so we can discuss what each has learned with respect to this setup? I would appreciate it.
Thanks, Steve
(830)734-3000

Well, if you are looking for Legal IFR useage you can forget the 296. I purchased one several months ago (and absolutely love it), and every time you start it up you have to acknowledge a warning that it is a VFR instrument only and agree to Garmin Legaleze to not use it any other way.
I'm not in the air yet, but use it for turn-by-turn directions in the truck and rental cars (I do alot of traveling for work, so I get to write most of it off!). It will also occupy the panel of my -7 when the time comes.

Kai Schumann

Baja_Traveler said:

Well, if you are looking for Legal IFR useage you can forget the 296. I purchased one several months ago (and absolutely love it), and every time you start it up you have to acknowledge a warning that it is a VFR instrument only and agree to Garmin Legaleze to not use it any other way.
I'm not in the air yet, but use it for turn-by-turn directions in the truck and rental cars (I do alot of traveling for work, so I get to write most of it off!). It will also occupy the panel of my -7 when the time comes.

Kai Schumann

Click to expand...

How are the turn-by-turn directions? I bought a bluetooth GPS and a program for my iPAQ and so far I'm pretty amazed (I guess I was stuck in the stone age). The problem is that I have to preload the states where I'll be because it's 3.4GB for the whole country. How's the detail, nav algorithm (too many turns? common sense routing), etc for the 296?

Blue skies,

Turn by turn is really fantastic. The unit has only let me down once - last sunday in Borrego Springs I had it find me a place to eat, and it sent me about 500 yards past the actual address on a side turnoff. Usually it sends me directly to the doorstep of the address I enter - even telling me which side of the street to look. I have the 128 meg card for it, and have California up to San Francisco, 395 up to Reno/Tahoe, the I15 route up to Park City Utah, and I8 out to Tuscon AZ - which maxs' the card out. If I had the 256 mb card I could get most all of the west coast this side of the rockies on it up to Canada. As for the nav algorithm, you can choose fastest route or shortest route - I've used both, and found either to be useful depending on traffic. There is also the option of avoiding highways which is great to avoid gridlock. And of course - put it in the plane, push one button and you have all the aviation charts built right in. (they are updated by plugging into the computer and uploading the latest Jeppsen maps direct from Garmin)

Kai

Brian130 said:

How are the turn-by-turn directions? I bought a bluetooth GPS and a program for my iPAQ and so far I'm pretty amazed (I guess I was stuck in the stone age). The problem is that I have to preload the states where I'll be because it's 3.4GB for the whole country. How's the detail, nav algorithm (too many turns? common sense routing), etc for the 296?

Blue skies,

Click to expand...

garmin 196

I like the 196 because of its great battery life compared to the color units. In time I am sure color will take less power then it does now but for now I get several more hours off the battery then the color units do. The 196 does not have terrain avoidance though...I use my sectional for that.

flyerfly said:

I like the 196 because of its great battery life compared to the color units. In time I am sure color will take less power then it does now but for now I get several more hours off the battery then the color units do. The 196 does not have terrain avoidance though...I use my sectional for that.

Click to expand...

Garmin quotes 15 hours battery life, 8 hours with the back illumination on. I have found this to be pretty close. used it in a rental car all day cruizing around denver and the ski resorts - never turned it off till I got back to the hotel. Must have been close to 8 hours operation and it wasnt close to running out of gas. Of course we are talking new battery here - as it ages battery life may change somewhat, dont know with lithium-ion batteries. As long as you bring the charging cable with you, I can't see batteries being an issue unless you happen to be Steve Fossett...

Kai Schumann

I just finished flush mounting my 196 in the panel. Don't have pictures yet.

I built a small panel that fit above the radio stack. Took the GPS case apart by pulling the 5 screws on the back. Then took the front half of the case and used it as a template on some paper. That gave me a perfect outline cutout to work with. Transfered that to my panel plate and cut with a dremel tool.

Then to hold it in place I made 2 u shaped clips out of some .063 that plugged into the 2 finger holes on each side of the 196. I put a couple of small model airplane screws through the face frame into these clips which hold the GPS firmly in the cutout of the frame. The frame is held into the radio rack with 4 screws so I simply remove the frame and GPS together to pull it out to go home for database upgrades etc. I didn't decide to make it a quick release setup like some have.

Hi guys,

I didn't flush mount my 196. I used one of the clip on type mounts that came in the box. I drilled a couple of large holes to allow the antenna and power/serial cables to come through and used nutplates to attach the clip on mount directly to the panel.

See http://rv8bldr.tripod.com/the_panel.html

The beauty of this arrangement is that I can take the GPS home with me after every flight and download its info into FlightBook. I can also download flight plans from Jepessen FlightStar into it. And when we are a trip to some place that we are unfamiliar with, we just take the GPS with the MapSource info in it and we are good to go.

I don't find it an issue that it is not flush mounted. In fact, I would probably be annoyed if I couldn't take it out for updating whenever I want.

Your mileage may vary,

Go to http://www.steinair.com, Click on "Panels", then scroll to the bottom of the page. I've got several photos of my panel mount 196.

Cheers,
Stein.

Stein,

That's a nice looking mount. Do you have to reach behind the panel to release the GPS?

Also, (this is a bit off topic) the rocker switches on the Rocket panel are cool. Where did those come from? I don't see them listed on your site.

Dave

Actually, it pops out quite nicely from the front of the panel. If you look closely at my cutou, you'll see a small "notch" on the left side of the cutout. This allows me to insert a small flat object (such as the ignition key) or something like that and the thing will just pop out!

The rocker switches came from the customer. I may start carrying them at some point.

Cheers,
Stein.

Garmon 296

Am building an RV-8 which will have a GNS430 and also a 296. I've used the 296 a lot in X-C in my Lance and locally in the Pitts. This unit is so impressive I can't believe all it does. It's only legal VFR as has been pointed out in the forums. It does great flight planning, is small and light, has super battery life, and does a fair job at TAWS. We've (at least two of us) found the pseudo panel can really be flown IFR and serves as an emergency back up totally independent of the aircraft and antennae. My friend Russ, a 5000 hour Navy pilot, found the 196 not useable as a primary IFR Attitute and altitude reference. We both can fly the 296 due to its rapid update (5x/sec) while under the hood, simulating IFR. What a great defense against total failure of your electrical system - which shouldn't happen if you build it according to R. Nuckolls, but I still worry. The display is not as bright as the 195 but still good. Don't know if I'm right to feel this way, but think Lycomings are so reliable that I look elsewhere for the first failure points. Anyway plan to fly IFR with 430, SL30, GTX 330, Dynon, TruTrak, steam gauges with TC and the 296 plus hand held com (hooked to aircraft antenna) as back up. Seems WAAS upgrade will come along for the 430 and if you have room, the 480 would be outstanding. Two of us have had failure of the power cable to the 296, which comes apart in the body of the connector to the unit (from 12V plug or AC). Garmin replaced them for both of us, but did so as a "customer courtesy" as opposed to warranty. We thought this should be covered under the warranty at less than one year of service. Our avionics guy said we could use the 296 to drive our autopilot, but it hasn't been done yet. It doesn't interface with your fuel flow to calculate endurance and fuel remain at next waypoint, at least ours hasn't. Bill

196 and 430 experience

I fly VFR with the 196 and the 430, since all our club aircraft have the 430. Once airborne, I switch the 430 to the nearest airport screen and leave it there. I use the 196 for situational awareness.

We've got a lot of airspace where I fly, and a lot of little airports with guys jumping out of airplanes, so I need to switch frequencies a lot. The 430 is great for that.

I could never justify the 430 in my own airplane, or rather, the budget my wife gave me for the project won't allow it. I'll be using the icom ic-a200 in my 8, and my 196. Perhaps if I'm good, Santa will bring me a 296.