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Who uses screws, camlocs to secure top cowl ?
- Thread starter petersb
- Start date
B Cunningham
Well Known Member
I used #8 screws and nutplates and if I had to do it over, I would spend the money and get camlocs. The screws and nutplates will wear out with repeated use fairly quickly. Its tedious to handle all the screws and washers. The stainless will look good and no one will tell the difference unless they're really looking close, but what the heck, its just money and not that much in the overall scheme of things.
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camlocs
Use camlocs. Screws will be a PITA and you'll convince yourself to remove the cowling less often. Hinges and pins are still ok along the side since removal is fairly easy.
Also I recommend 3 inch spacing along the top of the cowling especially if you do not use a plenum chamber. I used 4 inch spacing on my 7A and during high speed decents (>200 kts) I would get very noticable puckering between the camlocs (regular baffles). On my next RV the 3 inch spacing solved it.
Use camlocs. Screws will be a PITA and you'll convince yourself to remove the cowling less often. Hinges and pins are still ok along the side since removal is fairly easy.
Also I recommend 3 inch spacing along the top of the cowling especially if you do not use a plenum chamber. I used 4 inch spacing on my 7A and during high speed decents (>200 kts) I would get very noticable puckering between the camlocs (regular baffles). On my next RV the 3 inch spacing solved it.
bpattonsoa
Well Known Member
I initially used camlocks on the top and hinges everywhere else on my -6A. The short hinges at the air inlet failed twice within 50 hours until replaced with plates and nutplates. Used .063 and 10/32 screws and have been no issue since.
The long outside hinges started losing eylets after some time and I had to replace the first six inches of hinge at about 100 hours. Been fine since.
Bottom cowl bottom hinges failed and were replaced with larger steel hinges.
My -10 will have plates with nutplates at the air inlets and bottom. Still undecided about the top, but most likely will go with hinges.
The long outside hinges started losing eylets after some time and I had to replace the first six inches of hinge at about 100 hours. Been fine since.
Bottom cowl bottom hinges failed and were replaced with larger steel hinges.
My -10 will have plates with nutplates at the air inlets and bottom. Still undecided about the top, but most likely will go with hinges.
Milspec on the firewall, piano wire between the top and bottom - works well.
apkp777
Well Known Member
I have screws and nutplates except for cowl halves. Cost about $40 compared to $600 for the MilSpec. $$ was my primary consideration. It still only takes me 2 minutes to pull the cowling. I would probably do the same if I did it all over. If money was no object then the fancy Milspec might be a better option, but overall, the screws are a reasonable choice. IMO!
Hinges on the horizontal cowl joint and on the vertical firewall on the lower cowl. #10 SS screws, tinnermans and floating nutplates on an .063" flange along the firewall top and bottom. I did lay on one layer of glass on the inside of the cowl to thicken the cowl flange where screwed.
With a decent electric screwdriver the top cowl is off is 5 - 8 minutes, no issues. I have spare screws in case I round one out. Have replaced maybe 6 in 220 hrs.
3" spacing is probably good. Highest stress point for me is on the bottoms. Have replaced some rivets there with #6 screws and nuts to hold on the .063 mounting flange.
Would do it again that way in a heartbeat. Couldn't justify any advantage vs. the $$$ for camlocks.
With a decent electric screwdriver the top cowl is off is 5 - 8 minutes, no issues. I have spare screws in case I round one out. Have replaced maybe 6 in 220 hrs.
3" spacing is probably good. Highest stress point for me is on the bottoms. Have replaced some rivets there with #6 screws and nuts to hold on the .063 mounting flange.
Would do it again that way in a heartbeat. Couldn't justify any advantage vs. the $$$ for camlocks.
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Pat Stewart
Well Known Member
Skybolts (camlocs) on the upper cowl, I have done this on all 3 RV's I have built. Would not use screws and nutplates.
My 2 cents.
My 2 cents.
All I know is the piano hinge is a pain
Our 7a is all piano hinge, easy to take off, true pain to put back on. Actually dread and avoid taking the cowl off unless absolutely necessary. Our friend has camlocks and they are so much easier. Screws or camlocks, either one much easier that hinge set-up.
Our 7a is all piano hinge, easy to take off, true pain to put back on. Actually dread and avoid taking the cowl off unless absolutely necessary. Our friend has camlocks and they are so much easier. Screws or camlocks, either one much easier that hinge set-up.
easy inspection
One of the things I do not like about the RV's is how difficult it is to take the cowl off for an inspection. Maybe I am used to the heavy latch down on the 140 I used to fly. I have always felt it was necessary to open the cowl as part of the pre-flight. I have tried to figure out how to have a better way to inspect the 9 I am building. When I get that far, I may go and look at some certified planes and see how they did it.
Anything that makes it easier to inspect the engine, I am all for. Maybe I will think the camlocks are ok when I get to that point in the build, or try and figure out something then.
One of the things I do not like about the RV's is how difficult it is to take the cowl off for an inspection. Maybe I am used to the heavy latch down on the 140 I used to fly. I have always felt it was necessary to open the cowl as part of the pre-flight. I have tried to figure out how to have a better way to inspect the 9 I am building. When I get that far, I may go and look at some certified planes and see how they did it.
Anything that makes it easier to inspect the engine, I am all for. Maybe I will think the camlocks are ok when I get to that point in the build, or try and figure out something then.
is one stye air intake easier to remove cowl?
my rv-4 is all hinges and I want something different for all the threads already posted but what engine settup is easiest for cowling removal? the snorkel? My carberated rv-4 bottom cowl is a pain because of all the places to watch. I'm builing a rv-7 and the most important consideration is ease of cowling attachment because I don't remove the cowl as often as I should be cause its a pain on the rv-4 and want to correct this on the 7
my rv-4 is all hinges and I want something different for all the threads already posted but what engine settup is easiest for cowling removal? the snorkel? My carberated rv-4 bottom cowl is a pain because of all the places to watch. I'm builing a rv-7 and the most important consideration is ease of cowling attachment because I don't remove the cowl as often as I should be cause its a pain on the rv-4 and want to correct this on the 7
flyboy1963
Well Known Member
my least favourite part of the aircraft.....
The hinges look nice & clean...for the most part. Totally hate not being able to see all of the engine for preflight. ...the Piper style double hinge top would be my objective if re-doing it.
Top/ firewall might be the only place I think it's good.
Bottom at firewall would be the worst.
If you don't like the look of the camlocs or washers & screws, try to design your paint to be silver in these areas so they aren't noticeable!
The hinges look nice & clean...for the most part. Totally hate not being able to see all of the engine for preflight. ...the Piper style double hinge top would be my objective if re-doing it.
Top/ firewall might be the only place I think it's good.
Bottom at firewall would be the worst.
If you don't like the look of the camlocs or washers & screws, try to design your paint to be silver in these areas so they aren't noticeable!
I have the same and I would do it again. Taking 3-5 minutes to remove top cowl vs 1-2 minutes for camlocs is in the noise of aircraft maintenence work. Also SS #10 screws looks way better then the big clunky camlocs.
oil door
Jim, I looked at the large oil door and it is exactly what I am looking for. It gives a great view of the engine Thanks for the link.
Jim, I looked at the large oil door and it is exactly what I am looking for. It gives a great view of the engine Thanks for the link.
RV7Guy
Well Known Member
Skybolts!!!!
Skybolts all the way. Ned Bowers has incredible customer service and excellent instructions for the install.
Skybolt now has pre-made the mounting tabs which take much of the pain away in the install process.
Are they more? Absolutely!! There are some things that are just worth spending the money. When it comes to the cowl you definitely want security with ease of removal and of course, great appearance.
Skybolts all the way. Ned Bowers has incredible customer service and excellent instructions for the install.
Skybolt now has pre-made the mounting tabs which take much of the pain away in the install process.
Are they more? Absolutely!! There are some things that are just worth spending the money. When it comes to the cowl you definitely want security with ease of removal and of course, great appearance.
N363RV
Well Known Member
#6 screws and floating nut plates
I used #6 screws and floating nutplates every 2.5 to 3 inches. The floating nutplates work, but sometimes don't align themselves as easily as I thought they would. Most days they are fine. But on a bad day we use a poker to lineup the floating nutplate with the hole. It was inexpensive and easy to install. We used a piece of narrow aluminum .040 thick... to attach the floating nutplates. We used flush rivits. Then we bonded the aluminum to the cowling. For the other half, we used a hole finder and drilled. We do use screw cups when the screws are installed.
Our decision was influence because we had a lot of these #6 floating nutplates already in our possession.... so they were essentially already bought and paid for. They came with the project when we bought it.
We have about 155 hours on our plane and we are satisfied. My wife and I have decowled the airplane more times than I can count. It is quick to decowl it. To take off the top is about 5 mins... to take off the bottom is another 5 mins or so. I like to get my creeper out to take off the intersection stuff... so it might take an extra minute or so. Putting it back together is a breeze. We have done this with a hot engine and is not a factor. I watched a guy remove a piano hinge with a hot engine once.. and it was not problem to get it off. I asked him to put it back on right away and it was a problem.
You are wise to choose camlocs or screws. You will look at your engine more often.
This is a big deal. If it is a PITA to decowl and recowl the engine, you just will not do it as often and safety will be sacrificed.
Good luck.
I used #6 screws and floating nutplates every 2.5 to 3 inches. The floating nutplates work, but sometimes don't align themselves as easily as I thought they would. Most days they are fine. But on a bad day we use a poker to lineup the floating nutplate with the hole. It was inexpensive and easy to install. We used a piece of narrow aluminum .040 thick... to attach the floating nutplates. We used flush rivits. Then we bonded the aluminum to the cowling. For the other half, we used a hole finder and drilled. We do use screw cups when the screws are installed.
Our decision was influence because we had a lot of these #6 floating nutplates already in our possession.... so they were essentially already bought and paid for. They came with the project when we bought it.
We have about 155 hours on our plane and we are satisfied. My wife and I have decowled the airplane more times than I can count. It is quick to decowl it. To take off the top is about 5 mins... to take off the bottom is another 5 mins or so. I like to get my creeper out to take off the intersection stuff... so it might take an extra minute or so. Putting it back together is a breeze. We have done this with a hot engine and is not a factor. I watched a guy remove a piano hinge with a hot engine once.. and it was not problem to get it off. I asked him to put it back on right away and it was a problem.
You are wise to choose camlocs or screws. You will look at your engine more often.
This is a big deal. If it is a PITA to decowl and recowl the engine, you just will not do it as often and safety will be sacrificed.
Good luck.
Camlocs installation
Hello All
This is something I've been thinking of doing for a long time but just haven't made the move yet..
How hard of a job will it be on a completed aircraft ( RV-4 in this case ) and what Camlocs and other devices should I be looking at to simplified the job..?
Thanks
Bruno
[email protected]
Hello All
This is something I've been thinking of doing for a long time but just haven't made the move yet..
How hard of a job will it be on a completed aircraft ( RV-4 in this case ) and what Camlocs and other devices should I be looking at to simplified the job..?
Thanks
Bruno
[email protected]
LifeofReiley
Well Known Member
Simple, easy and light weight #8 SS torx screws and nutplates @ the firewall and hidden hinge with pin top and bottom split... on or off in less than 2 minutes
jay.pearlman
Well Known Member
screwed
screws will cause the cowl to wear from vibration. Camlocs are spring loaded.
screws will cause the cowl to wear from vibration. Camlocs are spring loaded.
NeilMcLeod
Active Member
Skybolts everywhere except inlets, no complaints
LifeofReiley
Well Known Member
You're doing something wrong if your screws wear from vibration, you might want to balance something or drill and dimple correctly.
NickAir
Well Known Member
Camlocks or Screws
My -6 had screws.
My -7 has Camlocs on top and screws on lower.
Both were fine. It only takes minutes to remove the cowl.
Do what ever you like most. The removal difference is only a few minutes.
Somthing to consider is with screws you may want a charged cordless driver in your onboard tool kit if you travel. I used mine once, away from home. It always went with me.
My -6 had screws.
My -7 has Camlocs on top and screws on lower.
Both were fine. It only takes minutes to remove the cowl.
Do what ever you like most. The removal difference is only a few minutes.
Somthing to consider is with screws you may want a charged cordless driver in your onboard tool kit if you travel. I used mine once, away from home. It always went with me.
