Throttle Position

[smg767]

I have a lot of time in fighters and flying right seat in Boeings. I'd like to keep the stick in right hand and run the engine controls with the left. One option is to design a panel for the right seat with the passenger sitting on the left. Any ideas on place to put a second set of engine controls on the left side of the cockpit? If anyone has done it, I'd appreciate a picture.

Thanks,

Shawn

 

[Sid Lambert]

It's not my aircraft so I can't speak for how comfortable it is to use but....

http://rvproject.com/djm.html

 

[Vern]

Right seat

There's no law about which seat you fly from. I fly mine from either side. CFI's, examiners,FO's, and helicopter pilots usually are in the right seat.

I've also flown a 6A with the throttle on the left. If you do that, just make sure all other switches are logical. This one required some hand swapping.

 

[Mike S]

Welcome!!!!!!

Shawn, welcome to VAF.

There is a guy here where I live, flying a -6 from the right seat. Keeps him in the same mode as his Saia Marchetti.

No big deal.

 

[minute2]

It is the only logical thing

I personally have been surprised that few build their RV's for right seat primary. The Sia Marchetti, refenced above, is to me a good example of logically thinking the problem through. The typical jet pilot will have left side engine controls, why teach them in the left seat of a side-by-side with essentually right side engine controls. ? I believe that the left seat pilot is a hangover from the "its not a plane, its a car" days.

For myself, I am left handed and find it natural to fly left seat in a side-by-side. However, try as I might, I have never felt comfortable with the left side throttle on tandems and so I am building my RV8 with a right side throttle.

Kerry Stevens

 

[smg767]

Right seat makes sense to me

I am a LONG way from the panel layout at this point. I will probably go for ergonomics and apply the F-16/4th generation fighter design philosophy of HOTA(Hands On Stick & Throttle). I tend to agree that the left seat being the 'pilot's seat' in a side x side cockpit is ancestor worship. Thanks to those who responded.

Shawn

 

[RV7Guy]

Not a big deal

Shawn,

I thought about that as well. I have over 2300 hours of helicopter time and fly them for a living now. I was worried about having the stick in my left hand. Many people told me it would be no big deal to make the transition. They were right. About 1 hour into the transition and you won't know why you were even concerned. In fact, I will occasionally fly with my right hand and that doesn't feel right!!!

I fly my RV to work. Recently, I arrived at work and got a call right a way. Jumped in the helicopter and proceeded to call the tower with using my airplane tail number. Whoops.

One of my neighbors was an F16 instructor and now flies for SW airlines. He has a Glasair he flies from the Left seat. I asked him if he had any transition issues. He said he didn't even think about it.

One thing to think about is potential resale.

 

[Kyle Boatright]

I have a lot of time in fighters and flying right seat in Boeings. I'd like to keep the stick in right hand and run the engine controls with the left. One option is to design a panel for the right seat with the passenger sitting on the left. Any ideas on place to put a second set of engine controls on the left side of the cockpit? If anyone has done it, I'd appreciate a picture.

Thanks,

Shawn

I have left hand engine controls in my RV-6. Tracey Saylor used to sell both two and three lever versions. I'm pushing 600 hours on my RV-6, and am very pleased with the setup. It was easy to install and falls to hand easily for me. I don't have a picture handy right now, and probably won't be near the airport for a couple of weeks. BUT, I'll be glad to take a picture or three the next time I'm there.

 

[Mel]

Not A Problem!

Many people told me it would be no big deal to make the transition. They were right. About 1 hour into the transition and you won't know why you were even concerned.

I had pretty much the same experience. While I was building, a friend suggested I fly his Mustang II for a while and see if it really was a problem. It wasn't. Took me maybe 20 minutes max to get used to it.

 

[Gsuit]

Shawn,

I thought about that as well. I have over 2300 hours of helicopter time and fly them for a living now. I was worried about having the stick in my left hand. Many people told me it would be no big deal to make the transition. They were right. About 1 hour into the transition and you won't know why you were even concerned. In fact, I will occasionally fly with my right hand and that doesn't feel right!!!

I fly my RV to work. Recently, I arrived at work and got a call right a way. Jumped in the helicopter and proceeded to call the tower with using my airplane tail number. Whoops.

One of my neighbors was an F16 instructor and now flies for SW airlines. He has a Glasair he flies from the Left seat. I asked him if he had any transition issues. He said he didn't even think about it.

One thing to think about is potential resale.

Shawn, it sounds like you've got your mind made up, but for what it's worth... my experience was like Darwin's. I flew 18's until 2001 and vacillated the whole time I was building my -7. I just could NOT wrap my mind around flying with the stick in my left hand. When it came time to make the decision which way to build the stick, panel, and interior I went and got some no-kidding dual in a side-by-side RV (RV-6). Not just a ride or two, but seriously getting some transition training... touch-and-gos, slow flight... the works. It was a little early in the build process for transition training, but I had to know. Turns out, after my first hour of dual, we were walking across the tarmac to get some coffee and the instructor asked, "so what did you think about flying left handed?" WOW! I had forgotten all about it! Not even an issue.

 

[n5lp]

...Many people told me it would be no big deal to make the transition. They were right...

Until my transition training with Mike Seager, I had no left-hand stick time and hundreds of hours of right stick time. I was a little worried about it. It didn't take a half-hour to adjust, I really think I adjusted before takeoff. It just seems like any modifications as to the PIC seat or controls are orders of magnitude more difficult than just making the easy mental adjustment and once you have made that adjustment you are comfortable flying a lot more different kinds of airplanes.

I still find it a bit awkward to fly with the off hand in certain aircraft but the off hand is just the one I'm not used to in that particular aircraft. I'm not crazy about flying with the left hand in a Citabria or a Cub (just the idea of flying a cub with the left hand is repugnant) or the right hand in an RV but I can do it.

 

[Jim P]

Chalk up another "me too". About 90% of my total time is right hand stick and was wondering how long it would take to adapt. After flying with Mike Seager for a day, I wandered back to the B&B room and finally remembered that I'd been flying with left hand stick. I didn't give it one thought while we were flying. For the additional work in either a left hand throttle, or right side primary, I'd stay with the stock arrangement. it's just not worth the trouble.

Jim

 

[Jon Clements]

The benefits of symmetry....

I have a lot of time in fighters and flying right seat in Boeings. I'd like to keep the stick in right hand and run the engine controls with the left. One option is to design a panel for the right seat with the passenger sitting on the left. Any ideas on place to put a second set of engine controls on the left side of the cockpit? If anyone has done it, I'd appreciate a picture.

Thanks,

Shawn

Hi Shawn -

My head was where yours is....

I fly gliders and did my Aero endorsement in a Decathlon. All right hand stick. I learnt to fly in a C172 and I am completely OK flying left hand yoke it's just that I feel far more naturally connected with three axis aircraft when I have a joystick (rather than a yoke) in my right hand.

So I have set my 7 up so it can be flown PIC from RHS or LHS.

The following photos shows you where I am heading....throttle quadrant in center console. I have installed Dual GRT's (screens can display independent info on either side). AVMAP as my VFR GPS is in centre with TT VSGV autopilot over the top (alonside AOA). Back ups - ASI, VSI, TT ADI, ALT are in the centre on either side of the AVMAP. I also have a Card Compass on the far LHS and a G-Meter on the far RHS. The right side has the G-meter, ASI and ALT (conventional guages) so that Aerobatic flying is better catered for in the RH seat. EIS for GRT is also on the RHS. The LHS has the Card Compass and a Garmin GNS 430W under the GRT. Also has the TTADI and VSI on that side which results in the LH seat being better suited to X-country and IFR flying.

For my purposes this is great. You can read everything comfortably from either seat. I will happily fly X-country from the right seat and I will really enjoy flying Aero's on that side.

You get a couple of bonuses with this set-up:
1. During transition training the Instructor gets to sit on the LHS.
2. When you sell your plane the buyer won't be put off by the panel layout being focused on the RHS PIC aspect.

Downside:
1. When you pull up at an air show in your pride and joy everyone will think your passenger is the pilot and owner!!!

Ticks all the boxes for my requirements. Photo follows (without instruments, apologies).

Regards

JON

 

[larrynew]

Dual Throttle

Shawn,

I have a similar background with right hand stick and left hand throttle. I'm planning on something like this. The link is in the Builder Modifications section here on VAF. Many of the questions I've had have already been asked and answered on VAF.

 

[rswalden]

Right Hand Left Hand or Both?

Clayton Henderson said it best:
"Turns out, after my first hour of dual, we were walking across the tarmac to get some coffee and the instructor asked, "so what did you think about flying left handed?" WOW! I had forgotten all about it! Not even an issue."

I agree. Case in point: Many of us learned to fly in Cessna/Piper aircraft from the left seat and essentially flew with the left hand on the left part of the yoke & right hand on the throttle (opposite reflexes as using a stick). Conversely, copilots in large aircraft easily transition to the left seat controls without even thinking about which hands they're using.

Having flown just about every configuration of throttle/stick/yoke combination in commercial & military aircraft (from F-111 side-by-side stick to "HOTAS" sidestick controllers to conventional-yoke Boeings, I've never even given the left-hand right-hand factor a thought. The brain adapts very quickly.

One thing I would NOT do, however, would be to put a left-hand throttle quadrant on the left side of a side-by-side aircraft (sorry, Dan C.), thereby depriving your right-seater of flying the airplane with throttle control.

On a humorous note here: When I test flew an RV-6 with Van at his plant a few years ago, he flew from the left seat with his right hand on the stick, and his left arm crossed over his right arm to control the center throttle with his left hand. Some habits are hard to break!

 

[ao.frog]

Right side for me too.

Shawn:

I wanted the same as you: the stick in the right hand and the throttle in the left. Therefore I decided to use the right seat as pilot seat.

Then I didn't have to install a second throttle, mix and prop control.

I also put all the switches, instruments and radiostack in the center so both pilots can reach them easily.

The only things I've put directly in front of the pilot is the starter and P-mag switches. I figured the other pilot won't need them so much.

 

[Mel]

Don't change throttle/mixture arrangement from standard!

It's fine to set up the airplane to fly primarily from either seat, but PLEASE don't reverse the order of the engine controls from standard. This can really get one in trouble when switching from your "special" aircraft to a normal setup.
You'll notice that even on a standard left hand quadrant such as the RV-8, the throttle is still on the far left. with the prop next and then the mixture.