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RV-12 D180

T

todehnal

Well Known Member
Yes, our D180 is different. As most have discovered, the RV-12 version of the D180 has been de-featured, for whatever reason. I'm not sure of exactly what features we have lost, but I know that we have lost some of the great features that Dynon had built into their system. So, if you are building EAB and would like to have those features back, be aware, it will be expensive. Although, the reason certainly escapes me. It can't be hardware! It is probably firmware and some software components. Whether Van's did the detuning, or Dynon, I'm not sure. Nor, do I know all of the features that we lost. What a shame, to take a great product and remove features. The rationale escapes me. Excuse my ranting, but one EFIS feature that I was really looking forward to, is a lubber line on the HSI. If you have ever flown with one, you too would enjoy it. It really helps you start your decent to pattern altitude at the right time. My understanding is that this feature is gone when you have an RV-12 D180. Can that be true?? Also, it would be nice to know all of the features that we are loosing, so that we can make an informed decision about another EFIS choice for us EAB builders.

Please chime in if you have any thoughts are info on the subject.

Tom
 
My two cents are....if the Dynon D180 is listed on the Van's Website as standard equipment for the RV-12, (and it is!) then it should have all the features which all D180s have. If Van's website gives it a different model number....D180a for example, then having less capability would be acceptable.
If this is all true, then I feel I've been mislead somewhat. :mad:
Where did you and others learn that the RV12's version of the D180 has been dumbed down? :confused:
 
Dumber D180

Paris12Man said:
My two cents are....if the Dynon D180 is listed on the Van's Website as standard equipment for the RV-12, (and it is!) then it should have all the features which all D180s have. If Van's website gives it a different model number....D180a for example, then having less capability would be acceptable.
If this is all true, then I feel I've been mislead somewhat. :mad:
Where did you and others learn that the RV12's version of the D180 has been dumbed down? :confused:
Click to expand...

The standard D180 is listed in Van's catalog. The only place that I have seen a number for the dumber version that is included in the
RV-12 kit, is in the inventory sheets for the RV-12, where it is designated as an RV-12 D180. As far as the sources for the fact that it does have reduced functionality, it's been tough to get a straight answer. Some information has come from other posts here. Some has come from a reputable avionics shop, and some has even come from Van's own staff. I'm still not sure that we have all of the fact, even now, which I am still searching for, but it's the why that escapes me!!

I can tell you this; if you decide to delete the RV-12 D180 from the RV-12 avionics kit, and add the standard D180, it will cost you $800 extra. This might be a good time for us EAB builders to consider Trutrak's EFIS package.

Tom
 
I don't know what feature you think your missing but I doubt that Van's took any of them out. All of the normal features are listed here.....

Seems you are refering to the GS needle portion of the HSI...Correct?

If so and if you only have a 496 gps feeding the HSI, the only time you will see this GS indicator on the HSI is when you have VNAV enabled and correctly configured on the 496 and you are intercepting the VNAV profile. And the 496 must be communicating correctly to the Dynon.

If you are not, it will not show up. Works that way on all of em.

If your not talking about the GS needle, fill me in on what a lubber line is and I will see if I can help. Most likely the features you think you are missing are just configuration errors.
 
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D180

HSI use on the RV12. Make sure the Aviation/NMEA setting on your 496 is set to "normal", not "fast". Mine was set on fast and it wouldn't work on HSI till I changed the setting on the 496.
 
Before You Start Slamming Vans or Dynon...

"As most discovered..."
I'm not sure..."
It is probably..."
Nor do I know..."
It would be nice to know..."
I've been mislead..."

Both of these companies have solid reputations that have been built over time. If there is a problem or issue, please be specific. Better yet, start with a question, rather than a broadside. The approach you've chosen to take reminds me of a similar situation some months ago with PS Engineering. Seems an overseas customer couldn't get an intercom to work properly in spite of an inordinate amount of input from PS. Turns out the problem was a 20+ year old non-aviation headset. No apology for unkind words or wasted effort.
There's a lot of talent reading these posts. ASK. Even Dynon contributes information when requested - probably in an effort to squelch rumors. You'll notice that Vans rarely (or never) participates. I don't blame them.
In any event, if you have facts, state them. If you have questions, ask them. From my point, that's the beauty of forums. If you "heard" something, please state your source, otherwise, it's just a rumor.
Terry, CFI
RV-9A N323TP
 
Peterk said:
HSI use on the RV12. Make sure the Aviation/NMEA setting on your 496 is set to "normal", not "fast". Mine was set on fast and it wouldn't work on HSI till I changed the setting on the 496.
Click to expand...

Pete's solution will INDEED restore the "lubber line". I had the same problem!!!!
 
Vans does indeed ship customized firmware on their FlightDEK-D180 and EFIS-D100 units, but it doesn't remove features. The hardware inside and all of the software features are the same as in units bought from Dynon or any other dealer.

What those customizations do enable are presetting of many of the RV-12 airframe and configuration parameters. A subset of those are also unable to be adjusted from the setup menu. This includes things like IAS colors, where the OAT is connected, how the serial altitude encoder should transmit altitude to the transponder, the IAS/altitude units, and other things of that nature.

While one of the main motivations for these pre-sets is for your setup convenience, the main one is safety. It's not hard to imagine scenarios where incorrectly set EFIS parameters could cause a pilot to make decisions that adversely impacts safety.

As we understand it, if you are going E-AB, you can opt to build any panel you want, with Dynon bought through Vans (customized unit), Dynon not bought through Vans (off-the shelf unit), or any other brand of glass or even <GASP!> steam gauges :). If you're going E-LSA, you must use the Van's-provided kit in order to meet the E-LSA build requirements.
 
I Stand Corrected!!

I apologize for starting this post and stating that the RV-12 D180 was a reduced featured EFIS. I was going by hearsay, and not direct, hands-on experience. I did get a call from a fellow RV-12 builder in my area and he confirmed that, indeed, the lubber line (HSI glide slope line) is indeed there. I also appreciate the responses from other informed readers. So, if, truly, we don't lose any functionality with the RV-12 D180, that will be my choice, even though I am building EAB.

Sorry for the confusion and thanks for the real scoop.

One question though: Why is the standard D180 $800 more expensive??

Tom
 
a guess...but if Van's buys 300 and you buy one, I would suspect they have a contractual situation involved.
 
Quantity Buy

If that is the answer, I sure am glad I am building an RV-12, where a quantity buy savings really pays off, and is passed on to us builders!!

Tom
 
Tom,

One of Van's true virtues as a businessman is that he has bred a culture of passing savings/cost reductions/whatever to his customers....a genuine decision to forego total greed in favor of return business. What a concept!
 
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