Rudder Pedal Touching Front Cabin Cover??

[RudiGreyling]

Hi Guys,

I am busy fitting the cabin forward centre cover and noticed both my inner rudder pedals are catching and stopping on top of the forward cover. My rudder pedals is in the most forward position hole of the 3 hole position. It was cut to the correct length, AND cut on the correct side as per the plans.

Please see the attached 2 photos to see where it is catching and the angle of the pedals when they stop.

I have asked Van's, but their plane is configured with the rudder pedals most probably in the centre position, and does not come close to the cover.

Q1) Is this a problem or is there sufficient travel in the pedals when they stop on top of the cover?
Q2) How do you suggest I fix it if I need more travel?

Thank you,
Kind Regards
Rudi

 

[Bob Axsom]

Interesting Photos

In the second photo at the far left side of the cockpit at the plastic support block I see black on the tube for the right rudder pedals and not for the tube for the left rudder pedals. This is an indication that the tubes are displaced latteraly in a manner that favors a conflict of the inner pedals with the cover. First I would loosen the bolts in all three block positions and see if the tubes can be repositioned to eliminate the conflict. Note that even if they can't be repositioned in their current configuration this is a clue as to how the conflict can be eliminated. If the conflict still exists I would hook up the rudder in at least a temporary form with the stops in place and see if the rigging, as you need it, allows the conflict to occur (only one pedal will be forward at a time of course and pressing on the other pedal will free any rubbing friction hangup). If it does still conflict then the mod I would make is to remove enough material from the left end of the right crossover support tube and the right end of the left pedal crossover support tube to allow repositioning to clear the structure. However, the exposed black "bearing surface" on the crossover support tubes that are visible at both the left and middle plastic blocks in the photograph indicate that the latteral displacement is incorrect and should be fixable in assembly without the tube mod.

Bob Axsom

 

[robertahegy]

Hey Rudi,

Looking at the angle that the pedals are canted forward, it seems that you may be more forward than needed. The pedals don't swing very far for full deflection of the rudder. Have you hooked up the rudder yet? You might only need to shorten the link to keep the pedals from hitting the cover. Another way to get extra legroom is to leave out the seat wedge and just use a thinner pad under the seat cushion.

Roberta

 

[RudiGreyling]

Hi Guys,

Thanks Bob & Roberta for your feedback.

I have tried to push it over a little more to hide the black, markings deepering into the block, but it is at its end. I re-checked the measurements and it IS right.

I went back to the drawings and check where I cut it, It IS according to the drawing, see below. One thing I did notice, is that we are cutting away from the tube end that Promotes interference with the center cabin cover.

Look at the sippet from drawing #37. If we cut the ends like the drawing suggests then the inner paddels move closer to center to the cabin cover.

I think I will connect the rudder and see how much travel I need. 2 additional Questions:
Q1) Is the rudder pedals best positioned perfect vertically in neutral rudder??
Q2) I am just over 6 feet tall (1.85meter), Is the most forward position the right position for me. Or should I rather fit it in the center position and eliminate the interference?

If you are flying your 7 I'd appreciate some feedback on the positioning.

Thank you in advance,
Kind Regards
Rudi

 

[pierre smith]

More holes

Hi Rudy,
We drilled additional holes in the two links that connect the rudder cables to the pedals to allow fore/aft adjustment. Vertical pedal is a close start. We also added one inch plastic spacer blocks under the rudder bars at the longerons to raise the pedals another inch for our big feet (size 12).

Secondly, we tilted our pedals rearward 3/4" by sliding a 3 foot ruler in front of the pedals but behind the tubing, then drilled new holes in order to not accidentally apply brake when we only need to steer with the pedals. This will need a new hole in the brake cylinder post.
Regards,

 

[robertahegy]

My Hubby, Rich, is 6 ft tall and has plenty of room for his legs (right seat). I have the pedals in the midrange position per Vans. I have the rudder pedals vertical and the brake pedals tipped forward.

Hear is a shot of where I mounted mine and the orientation. I used the full seat back position with no wedge cushion under the seat. I'm 5' 11" and I need to skooch up a bit to reach the pedals.

It's really best to get that rudder on and get the seats in and test fit.

Hope this helps.

 

[Bob Axsom]

Just a thought

The fact that they are telling you to trim at all tells you that there are lateral readjustment by material removal expected. You are being very cautious as you should be but if cutting off one end makes the problem worse you have to consider what would happen if you remover material from the other end. Maybe there is a problem with cotting off materil as I suggested, I simply do not know. I would not want the pedals hitting the structure and if I had that condition I would be inclined to find a way of eliminating it. Tube end shims have not been mentioned but "big washers" to control latteral position is something to keep in the option list.

Bob Axsom

Hi Guys,

I went back to the drawings and check where I cut it, It IS according to the drawing, see below. One thing I did notice, is that we are cutting away from the tube end that Promotes interference with the center cabin cover.

Look at the sippet from drawing #37. If we cut the ends like the drawing suggests then the inner paddels move closer to center to the cabin cover.

 

[RudiGreyling]

HI Guys,

Thanks Bob and Roberta for your feedback.

Agree will have to fit the rudder and seats and check out, if I'm not happy will have to cut more from the pedal sides and shim with big washer to clear the sides of the front cover.

Last night I measured, from the pedals being straight vertical down to the front of the cover is +/- 2". If Vans is correct on the 5 1/2" pedal travel it means I have will have a problem, I need at least half of the 5 1/2" travel so let us say 3" clearance to be safe.

But then some pilots said they preferred the bottom of their rudder pedals at a slight angle towards them, like car pedals, for a more natural feet position. If I angle the bottom of my pedals 1" closer to the pilot it means I will have 2+1" clearance giving me 3" which theoretically will work.

I really want to leave the pedals in the forward most position; it is easier to adjust the seats, than the pedals. Heard stories about people having to redo their seat cushions, because it was to thick and the seatback was in the rear position and they were to close to the pedals.

Any case, thanks for all the feedback, I will connect the rudder before commiting a solution. When done I'll come back and report here what I have found for others to be able to use it as a reference.

Regards
Rudi

Shamefully borrowed from Vans Aircraft . com

 

[Pmerems]

Interference with rudder pedals

Rudi,

My rudder pedals are just like yours. They will interfere with the firewall as yours do. Every RV-7 built to print will have this as well.

Your are asking all the right questions. Once I establish the rudder travel I will move my pedals to the final position.

In addition I have the same concerns as few expressed about riding the brake pedal while applying the rudder. I wear a size 12 shoe so it is definitely an issue for me. Most likely will add a spacer under the rudder pedal pivot blocks, replace the rudder pedal center support and relocate (re-weld) the rudder cable mounting ears on the rudder tube to keep the cable alignment proper.

Paul

 

[RudiGreyling]

Hi Guys,

I wanted to come back and update this thread. I sorted out my potential rudder pedal interference problem.

Here is what I did:

I connected my rudder, remade the rudder stops, like everyone else (it needed to be +/- 1/8? longer to the back), to get the right rudder deflection. Then I tied the rudder cable to the pedals with some temporary wire to check the deflection, and check the rudder cable link lengths.

I just had to unsure I angle the pedal bottoms slightly towards the pilot in order to clear the front cover.

Here are my dimensions:
1) From the front cover to the bottom inside edge of the pedals it should have a 2 3/4 inch clearance when they are in neutral. This will give you between ? and ? inch clearance on full rudder defection from the cover.
2) My rudder cable to pedal links turned out to be 3 5/8? from the center to center connection holes.

I hope this helps you if you are going to fit your pedals in the most forward position of your RV7.

Kind Regards
Rudi

 

[RV7Guy]

Other possibilities

Hey Rudi,

Just a couple of thoughts. The front cover is not absolutely necessary. I have a dual battery box on the floor up front and didn't use the cover. The heater box works great without.

My neighbor is building a 7A and is tall. He wears size 12 shoes. When I told him I thought my pedals were too low I suggested he move the entire assembly up.

He did this by buying additional Delrin blocks for the sides and center support to be used as spacers. The center support had to be removed and raised as well. The next thing that had to be done was to remove and lower the rudder cable tab. A neighbor took care of this.

Now he has lots of clearance for this feet.

Finally, as someone noted, be sure the pedals are canted forward (toward the pilot). This will give some space and keep you from inadvertent brake interaction.

 

[thallock]

Same issue, but should not be a problem.

Rudi,

After seeing this thread, I installed my rudder pedal assembly last week, and found that my pedals hit the cover in the same spot. However, after playing around with the pedals, I decided this was not a problem, since I don't think you want the rudder pedal to go any more forward than the cover anyway. If you push your rudder pedals all the way to the firewall, then you do not have any room for the brake pedals to travel. This would be an unwelcome surprise when you absolutely needed to push the right brake while stepping on full right rudder.

Tracy.

 

[flydjd]

Rudder pedal assembly length ?

Hi Guys,

My rudder pedals is in the most forward position hole of the 3 hole position. It was cut to the correct length, AND cut on the correct side as per the plans.

Hi all from Europe,

I am at the same stage as well now and am trial fitting my rudder pedal bars WITHOUT cutting them down to the dims shown on the plans...they fit OK at the fwd most position (3" from fwd firewall - which seems to be the narrowest position )

Q. Did anyone else fit their rudder pedal assembleys WITHOUT cutting their length down to plans ?
Are there any other problems that I am missing by not cutting them down to plans ?

Also with ref to the F-6118 rudder pedal brace did anyone have to trim the FWD edge DOWN to 5/8" where it fits against the F-601N-L firewall angle ?

 

[captainron]

Hi all from Europe,

I am at the same stage as well now and am trial fitting my rudder pedal bars WITHOUT cutting them down to the dims shown on the plans...they fit OK at the fwd most position (3" from fwd firewall - which seems to be the narrowest position )

Q. Did anyone else fit their rudder pedal assembleys WITHOUT cutting their length down to plans ?
Are there any other problems that I am missing by not cutting them down to plans ?

Also with ref to the F-6118 rudder pedal brace did anyone have to trim the FWD edge DOWN to 5/8" where it fits against the F-601N-L firewall angle ?

I'm at this point on my QB-7, and I didn't have to trim the rudder bar lengths at all, in fact I'll probably have to make washer-type spacers to keep the ends from shifting left/right. Probably just 1/8" or so. As to the F-6118, after setting the rudder bar assembly in place, I just placed the top half of the derlin block over the tubes, and placed the F-6118 in position to determine where it would fit against the firewall angle. Since the edge that fits into the angle wasn't quite parallel, I had to re-cut the forward edge to a slightly different angle.
The drawing at the bottom-center of DWG 37 shows what I believe to be the correct relationship of the rudder pedals, where they form an intersecting angle and should place the shoe contact points in an even position so one leg won't feel shorter than the other! I know that in some of Van's side-view drawings it shows the rudder pedals hanging straight down, but I don't see how this is correct. The angle formed by the pivot point centerlines in the derlin blocks and the horizontal rudder bars centerlines should be equal, or an isosceles tri-angle.This will allow equal travel of both pedals when either is displaced from this neutral position. Only my opinion, BTW.








p.s. Hey Rudi, either include some metal shavings, candy wrappers, soda cans, or some kind of trash in your postings, or we're coming after you!!

 

[RudiGreyling]

Hi Captainron,

Dito that is exactly how mine ended up, the pedal frame "closest" to the pilot pedal's hanging perfectly vertically down, the 'furthust' padels angled towards the pilot to line up the bottoms.

PS: You're welcome to "come after" me here in South Africa, would enjoy the RV company...

 

[jlfernan]

Roberta, how far from the fire wall are your pedals mounted.?. I'm six feet tall so it should be almost the same for me.

 

[robertahegy]

The aft end of the rudder pedal blocks are 5 3/4" in front of the F-902 R&L bulkheads. My pedals appear to be about 7 3/8" from the back of the firewall. I made extra holes to allow adjustment foward. I don't remember how many or how far apart, though. Probably 1-1 1/2" increments. I thought I was in a mid point of adjustment, but it appears I have things aft. I may have only drilled one extra set of holes. I really can't see up there anymore.

Placing the seat back all the way aft with the upper seat back support just left hanging and using no wedge under Van's seat cushions is how I fly. I only have some carpet and 3/4" high density foam under the cushions. I found that with the wedges, our heads were too close to the canopy. The removal of the wedges and adding the foam gave us better leg room and head clearance.

I probably have my pedals mounted more aft than most, but I do have lots of room to move them forward. There are so many variables in getting the correct pedal postion, I highly recommend getting all the seat material and carpet in and test fitting before closing up the front of the fuselage. Seat height, position of the pedal blocks, length of the cable links, pitch of the pedals, and if you have a 7 or 7A will all influence the pedal feel. I changed mine several times before I was happy. It's a lot easier to adjust when the forward top skin is still off.

Hope this helps,

Roberta