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Proseal on elevator.....

mototopo

mototopo

Well Known Member
Proseal/RTV on elevator.....

I was in my car going back home thinking to my project: right elevator riveted and perfectly done (waiting for some spares to complete the left one)...the next task is proseal the rudder trailing edge.... proseal.... proseal.....mhmmm.... PROSEAL?!?!??!?!

AAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!! :eek:

I forgot to add the proseal to the tip of the stiffeners before closing the elevator!!! :(

I think a lot of rivet drilling is waiting for me..... sigh!
 
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I don't remember any Proseal on the elevator? Is this the new and improved way to help with trailing edge cracking? We used to use RTV. If you forgot that then don't worry about it. Replacing all those rivets will likely cause you more problems than the lack of RTV (err Proseal).
 
Birkelbach said:
...Is this the new and improved way to help with trailing edge cracking? ...
Click to expand...

Right, I don't know if leaving the elevator without Proseal will cause any problem in the future

Transporter said:
---You might consider the thin version of proseal described in this thread...
Click to expand...

Thanks Mike. Maybe I can squeeze this kind of thinner "proseal" thru the holes in the spar using some kind of large syringe and a tube long enough to reach the trailing edge...

...mhmmm..... :confused:
 
I am getting ready to build my elevators and have not read to directions yet but since you are talking about this I thought I would ask where the pro seal is suppose to go? Does anybody have any pictures of where the pro seal is suppose to go? That always helps me out. Thank you
 
RTV / Proseal in Empennage

The idea is to put a small dab of RTV or Proseal in the folded edge of the elevators (and in the case of the RV8, the rudder) to reduce vibration and the chance of cracking in these components. The stiffeners almost touch in these folded edges and I put a blob about the size a quarter at each stiffener location.

Dan Checkoway has a good photo at:

http://www.rvproject.com/20011015.html

Mike
 
Ok... after long thinking I managed to solve the problem without success.

First I tried to squeeze the RTV through a small tube: mission impossible!

My last chance was to drill out a good number of rivets to open the elevator and put the #@@#!!! RTV where it was supposed to be, but I ended up with some slightly enlarged/elongated holes on the skin. I have 4 of them in a row along the spar and I don't think that using oops rivets there is a good idea.
Perhaps it would be better to leave everything as it was!! (Phil, you were right!!)

My final decision: I'll build a new elevator!! :( (I hope I can save at least the understructure!!)
 
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I did the same thing, well I remembered on one side and forgot on the other,

I forgot which side it even was to be honest with you and I don't recall putting RTV in the rudder :eek:

I sent an Email to Vans and here is the reply I received :


Just keep an eye on the last rivet in the stiffeners near the trailing edge. If you see a crack, stop drill it. Our RV-4 has several and stop drilling keep the crack from getting any longer. You will do more harm by trying to unrivet the skin.
 
No Proseal, No Problem...

I built my elevators 1989 with no proseal, RTV, or anything else. Still flying today with no cracks or any other problems.
If the trailing edge is properly bent, you should not have a problem.
 
Another idea:

Drill out the aft most rivet, bottom side on each stiffener you want to "fix". It will need to be replaced with a flush Cherry pop rivet. With the rivet out, use a caulking gun to squeeze standard silicone seal through the rivet hole. Drill a hole in the tip of the cartridge, it should fit the dimple well. Plenty of squeeze force available this way.

Disclaimer: I bet this works, but I haven't tried it. :eek:
 
Thanks for your feedback.

Today I'm a little less concerned and, before ordering new parts and re-build the elevator, I'll evaluate if the old one can be fixed (maybe is not so bad as I think).

I'll post a few pictures of the elongated holes to hear from you if they can be fixed some way.
 
I forgot to do it in one of mine, we'll see in the future if it causes a problem. If they start cracking, i'll build a new elevator then. If not, no harm, no foul.
 
Still no pictures, but I measured the holes to have an idea of the damage. Well, I drilled out a total of 13 rivets on the lower side of the elevator and 5 of them are slightly elongated (but only on the skin, the spar looks good). The max elongated hole measure 7/64". Maybe I can use on these holes mk-139-bs pop rivets that need a 7/64" hole. Just don't know if the mk-139-bs rivets are strong enough to be a good solution. Sent an e-mail to Van's and waiting for an answer....
 
mototopo said:
Still no pictures, but I measured the holes to have an idea of the damage. Well, I drilled out a total of 13 rivets on the lower side of the elevator and 5 of them are slightly elongated (but only on the skin, the spar looks good). The max elongated hole measure 7/64". Maybe I can use on these holes mk-139-bs pop rivets that need a 7/64" hole. Just don't know if the mk-139-bs rivets are strong enough to be a good solution. Sent an e-mail to Van's and waiting for an answer....
Click to expand...
MK-319-BS rivets may be substituted without a problem.
 
You know, we did the same thing when building my neighbor's RV-8. I forget if it was the first or the second elevator that we forgot to put the stuff in (except instead of proseal, we used a silicone caulk, I believe).

We cobbled together an 'adapter' for the caulking tube, a sort of metal tube that attached to a long, fairly stiff rubber tube, and "squoze" the caulking into the right spots after carefully maneuvering the tube into position. It was a pain in the ***, but we got 'er done. Blew up a tube of caulk in the process, too. Messiest process on the whole plane, I think :).
 
I just received an e-mail from Gus Funnel @ Vans and he confirmed it is ok to use MK-319 rivets or NAS 1097 (oops rivets).

Steve, I tried the same solution as you but the tube I used was too small and I was unable to squeeze the RTV through it (the RTV is too thick). The only access holes available to reach the right locations were the two small opening aft the upper and lower ribs but a 3 mm O.D. tube was the max dimension possible, otherwise the tube will not pass through. Other options are the two holes for the bearing or the hole in the lower portion of the spar, but this way I'm unable to reach all the stiffeners.

How do you did??
 
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