Order Processing - Why is Van's not honoring FIFO on order queue?

[Walt D]

So I have to say, this is the 1st time I've become aware of an apparent issue with how Van's is sequencing the delivery of kits. In my case, I ordered a finish kit for my RV-14A in April of 2022, almost 2 years ago. I am now becoming aware of folks who ordered their finish kits some 6 months later, in August of 2022, receiving notices that their kit is ready and final payment is due, while I have heard nothing regarding my kit.

I responded immediately, upon the day of notification of the revised pricing and terms, and responded immediately with a positive acceptance of the new terms, following the web procedure. I don't understand why my position in the order queue would be altered. I have responded promptly in the past with regard to other kits and payment and do not understand why my order is apparently of lesser importance to those who have placed orders much later than I.

I've been patient and understanding of Van's situation until now, but I find this sort of shenanigans to be quite offensive. Not sure why my money is different than those who have apparently jumped the line in front of me, or why that would happen. It's not like I have posted all sorts of negative comments, indeed, quite the contrary.

Has anyone else experienced similar issues, and, if so, what is the explanation?

 

[PaulvS]

It is explained in the chapter 11 reorg announcement on Van's website, viz-

Van’s expects to resume shipping in-stock kit orders within the next 7 to 10 days. We will do our best to prioritize those who have waited longest, but our kit fulfillment schedule must be financially acceptable to the court, based substantially on cash flow rather than the traditional and historical method of order fulfillment that Van’s customers have experienced in the past. We will be constrained by – and will make prioritization decisions based on – the rate and timing of order renewal, availability of in-stock parts, and our need to ship kits that generate positive cash flow. Where we are able to do so, we will also consider the age of the original customer order.

 

[Walt D]

It is explained in the chapter 11 reorg announcement on Van's website, viz-

Well, my reorder and acceptance of the new terms was done on a near immediate basis, upon waking up in SoCal (yes we are 3 hours behind the rest of the country), so I'm still looking for a differentiator.

Thank you for the reply.

 

[gotyoke]

One thing to consider, which you may already have, is that -14 kits may be shipping before -14A kits due to part availability, e.g. engine mounts and landing gear. For example, a youtuber recently announced their finish kit, ordered in August '22, is being shipped, but perhaps it's a taildragger.

I ordered my -14A finish kit in August '22, and have not received word about crating yet. I fully expect you will get yours before I get mine. The worry I have is Van's has made it clear they could increase prices again in that time, if it becomes financially necessary to do so. I don't like the idea that my costs could creep up while I wait for Van's to fulfill an order I already re-agreed to pay a certain amount for.

 

[squeakersc063]

It sounds like crickets for us with backorder items from 2022 orders. I took delivery of my finish kit summer 23 and am still waiting on a nose gear leg and other hardware.

 

[Pskluz]

I ordered prior to OSH 2022 so sometime in July. Have not heard a peep since I accepted the terms.

 

[noahhl]

Even pre-bankruptcy Van's wasn't exactly FIFO. I ordered a 9A/tip-up/IO-320 finish kit in February 2022 and it was shipped (partially) in September 2023. I know of a builder with the same combo who ordered 6 months later and received their finish kit a month before me (and with fewer backorders).

 

[Walt D]

One thing to consider, which you may already have, is that -14 kits may be shipping before -14A kits due to part availability, e.g. engine mounts and landing gear. For example, a youtuber recently announced their finish kit, ordered in August '22, is being shipped, but perhaps it's a taildragger.

I ordered my -14A finish kit in August '22, and have not received word about crating yet. I fully expect you will get yours before I get mine. The worry I have is Van's has made it clear they could increase prices again in that time, if it becomes financially necessary to do so. I don't like the idea that my costs could creep up while I wait for Van's to fulfill an order I already re-agreed to pay a certain amount for.

Both your points are valid. At this point all we can do is speculate. To be fair, I did receive an email from Greg at Van's. He offered to check into the situation.

 

[Walt D]

It sounds like crickets for us with backorder items from 2022 orders. I took delivery of my finish kit summer 23 and am still waiting on a nose gear leg and other hardware.

Maybe the nose gear leg is the problem! Mine is an A as well. I'd assume Van's is trying to avoid partial shipments now.

 

[Niels3n]

Well, my reorder and acceptance of the new terms was done on a near immediate basis, upon waking up in SoCal (yes we are 3 hours behind the rest of the country), so I'm still looking for a differentiator.

Thank you for the reply.

I had paid in full for my RV10 QB Fuse & Finishing Kit as they were apparently ready to ship - unfortunately the new priorities to raise the most funds puts me to the back of the queue and my kits sold to others !

 

[QuixoteAg]

One thing to consider is their historical lack of an ERP system which typically includes and inventory and shipping management component that would drive packaging and shipping picklists, etc.. without that, my assumption is they were operating on excel spreadsheets, homegrown picking system, etc. which are inherently inefficient and prone to errors

 

[RV6_flyer]

I am not a lawyer and I did not stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Chapter 11 was a RESET.
EVERYTHING was reset back to nothing.

Once Chapter 11 started, it is all about CASH flow and what will generate the most cash flowing in (with court approval) will get done first.

 

[frankd]

I am in the same boat. Ordered the 14A finish kit Feb 2022, was supposed to be completed several times prior to the BK filing. Now I am somewhere in the order abyss. I called Vans, and they would not even give me a ballpark of where I am in the queue. I am tolerant of the significant price increase, but I have been at a stand still for 2 years now - with no clue on when I can expect my finish kit. Frustrating.

 

[Walt D]

I am in the same boat. Ordered the 14A finish kit Feb 2022, was supposed to be completed several times prior to the BK filing. Now I am somewhere in the order abyss. I called Vans, and they would not even give me a ballpark of where I am in the queue. I am tolerant of the significant price increase, but I have been at a stand still for 2 years now - with no clue on when I can expect my finish kit. Frustrating.

Wow, looks like you've built a lot of airplanes. A repeat customer several times over. Not likely I'll get the chance to do that. But after seeing all the comments here, I guess my situation isn't the worst by any means. Nevertheless, my prospects for completing even one airplane seem to be dimming by the day. I'm old enough to wonder..

Wrapping up the SB fuselage now. It's a beautiful thing, a few LCP and all. Per the Van's Engineering reports, I could frankly not care less about the LCP in my kits. More worried about running out of gas mid flight like an idiot.

I shouldn't have vented so much. But yes, this is frustrating, at minimum. Good luck to us all!!

 

[BigBadBob]

A data point if anyone cares: ordered RV14A finish kit April 4 2022 and truck just dropped it off today Feb 28, 2024. I had received updates from the old kit portal saying the kit was ready for crating before the BK, but never got a request for payment. I re-ordered it and payed the extra price. I'm told the crate contains all the LCP I asked to be replaced, along with all the parts needed to rebuild structure that had LCP; both were gratis. I'll know for sure after I inventory the crate.

Since I have to start pretty much start from the beginning due to LCP, I now have a garage full of crates (wing, fuse, finish) along with the emp kit on racks and and a prop on top of a crate. No space to build anymore.... I'll figure something out.

I'm still owed back-ordered parts and the engine. Plenty of mixed emotions about Van's.

 

[chris0177]

I placed my 14A QB Fuse and wing kit order in 2021,accepted new terms with one of the highest increases I've seen on the forum (since I put the min down this creates a large Cash flow for Vans) After many calls and a promise from Greg to look into it and give me some guidance several weeks ago, I have heard nothing to date. I have also heard of others who placed their orders long after mine receiving their kits already. Very disheartening and a huge damper on a life long dream. I am sticking with it for now but the opportunity cost is getting quite expensive

 

[Walt D]

A data point if anyone cares: ordered RV14A finish kit April 4 2022 and truck just dropped it off today Feb 28, 2024. I had received updates from the old kit portal saying the kit was ready for crating before the BK, but never got a request for payment. I re-ordered it and payed the extra price. I'm told the crate contains all the LCP I asked to be replaced, along with all the parts needed to rebuild structure that had LCP; both were gratis. I'll know for sure after I inventory the crate.

Since I have to start pretty much start from the beginning due to LCP, I now have a garage full of crates (wing, fuse, finish) along with the emp kit on racks and and a prop on top of a crate. No space to build anymore.... I'll figure something out.

I'm still owed back-ordered parts and the engine. Plenty of mixed emotions about Van's.

Thank you for the update. I'm glad you've received your finish kit. That is a great sign! I ordered mine (originally) on April 14 2022 so I have hope here. I reordered instantly upon receiving the invite from Van's as well.

Have fun!

 

[Walt D]

I placed my 14A QB Fuse and wing kit order in 2021,accepted new terms with one of the highest increases I've seen on the forum (since I put the min down this creates a large Cash flow for Vans) After many calls and a promise from Greg to look into it and give me some guidance several weeks ago, I have heard nothing to date. I have also heard of others who placed their orders long after mine receiving their kits already. Very disheartening and a huge damper on a life long dream. I am sticking with it for now but the opportunity cost is getting quite expensive

Yes, I've been in a similar situation. I just hope this is due to business necessity in a way that isn't obvious. It does seem that Van's is doing better now based on comments on this site.

Good luck Sir!

 

[Jayhox88]

It would be really helpful to at least get some date ranges in the relatively near future. I'm missing QB fuselage, wings, finish kits, along with the prop and engine. I get the order they choose to assign kits will be based on cash flow, but at some point we have to get some projections? My frustration is growing (no idea on a real timeline), but not much I can do about it. On a positive note, my Emp. is mostly done.

 

[Cholley6]

I would think the QB kits will be delayed more than SB. I had a 10 fuse SB delivered. I’ve not heard of any QB reported delivered.

 

[squeakersc063]

I would just like a response to an email saying something to that effect. "Hey, we are tracking your backorder parts but (insert reason I'm at the back of the line now)." Being completely ignored is so much worse.

 

[Jayhox88]

I would think the QB kits will be delayed more than SB. I had a 10 fuse SB delivered. I’ve not heard of any QB reported delivered.

Nor have I and that's one of several things that has me concerned. Again, even if they're projecting 12+ months, it would help for planning purposes. I'm reluctant to get much further in with say avionics, until I have a bit better timeline.

 

[dhills]

Thank you for the update. I'm glad you've received your finish kit. That is a great sign! I ordered mine (originally) on April 14 2022 so I have hope here. I reordered instantly upon receiving the invite from Van's as well.

Have fun!

I Learned from talking with Vans that at first a few kits got sent out of sequence of the order they were placed. That has been fixed and now original order dates are what each kits crating date will be based on.

 

[Walt D]

I am in the same boat. Ordered the 14A finish kit Feb 2022, was supposed to be completed several times prior to the BK filing. Now I am somewhere in the order abyss. I called Vans, and they would not even give me a ballpark of where I am in the queue. I am tolerant of the significant price increase, but I have been at a stand still for 2 years now - with no clue on when I can expect my finish kit. Frustrating.

Yes, the kitstatus emails Van's was sending out were quite helpful in that regard. I suppose resources aren't around to staff such an effort, but it would go a long way...

 

[rv12iS-builder]

I Learned from talking with Vans that at first a few kits got sent out of sequence of the order they were placed. That has been fixed and now original order dates are what each kits crating date will be based on.

Interesting...When I spoke to Van's at the end of 2023, I was told that kits would be crated in the order we agreed to the new pricing, not the original order date.

 

[BigBadBob]

I'm told the crate contains all the LCP I asked to be replaced, along with all the parts needed to rebuild structure that had LCP; both were gratis. I'll know for sure after I inventory the crate.

[I've gotten to the state where I'm quoting myself!]

FWIW, I did indeed get all of the LCP replacements and all the other parts I requested exactly as Van's promised, along with the finish kit. That takes a big load off. The only weird part is there was no packing slip for that stuff, so I just used the spreadsheets I sent them in my LCP request. The LCP portion was complete down to the last rivet, which is a first.