Looking for modern-looking breaker switches...

[KatieB]

I like the idea of breaker switches. We've used them in our production LSAs for many years and they work great, and they're simpler, weigh less and take up less space than having a separate switch and breaker. However, the ones we use (Tyco W31 series) look like they're out of a B-52 or something. We used the Aveo RockRack a few years back and they were OK but I thought they were just way too big, and judging by a previous thread update today those are out of the question anyway now. I'm looking for something small and sleek for the -3, preferably a rocker-style breaker switch. LED lighting would be cool. Any ideas?

 

[Mike S]

Hey there, good to see you posting again

Google "Mooney Switch" that may help.

Chief used to carry them----------warning, they cost a bunch of $$$

They are under the radio stack here. These are E T A, but I understand Klixon also makes/made? them.

 

[dutchroll]

The Mooney ones are the Klixon 20TC series switch-breakers.

They look very sharp and I'm sure they're excellent quality, but please be sitting down when you get the price!

 

[aerhed]

ETA makes led lit breaker switches with colored rockers or black rocker with led dot. A little under 3/4" wide bezels. Nice switch feel.

 

[DaleB]

I took a look at Digikey, and there are quite a few decent looking examples. You might want to look at Potter & Brumfield W33 and W51 series. The Schurter TA series looks nice as well. Digikey also lists ETA rocker breakers, translucent green actuators with green LED illumination. Some are non-stock, but they'll order them for you or you can shop the part numbers around and see who has them.

 

[Walt]

The age old of question of "Form vs Function", when it comes to aircraft I'm a big believer that function should take priority. From what I see out there the quality of most rocker switches can't compete with the good ole toggle switch/breaker (Honeywell TL/Klixon) combo used in both commercial and military aircraft alike. Call me old fashioned

Even the space shuttle uses them...

 

[N941WR]

Walt, do you mean like this quality breaker/switch?

While I agree with you, I'm not so sure about the quality of some of the breaker / switches.

This is the third fuel pump breaker/switch I have had in 575 hours. The first two wouldn't stay on after the plane had been sitting out in the sun. This one just snapped off while turning the fuel pump on in flight.

 

[Snowflake]

Bill, I see the problem with that switch. It's riveted closed, and has the word "China" on the side. Made cheap, and made to be disposed of rather than maintained (unless it's just a fuzzy photo and those are socket-head screws...).

 

[N941WR]

Bill, I see the problem with that switch. It's riveted closed, and has the word "China" on the side. Made cheap, and made to be disposed of rather than maintained (unless it's just a fuzzy photo and those are socket-head screws...).

Unfortunately, you are correct on all counts.

 

[Walt]

Walt, do you mean like this quality breaker/switch?

While I agree with you, I'm not so sure about the quality of some of the breaker / switches.

This is the third fuel pump breaker/switch I have had in 575 hours. The first two wouldn't stay on after the plane had been sitting out in the sun. This one just snapped off while turning the fuel pump on in flight.

The Tyco are not very good (being politically correct here), the Klixon are expensive but the old axiom you get what you pay for is true in this case also.
I prefer seperate breakers switches but if you must use a combo try one of these.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/7270_5_15.php?clickkey=4055

 

[DaleB]

Holy Toledo. It's devices like that that could quickly cost-justify a VPX.

Fuses and decent quality $10 toggles are looking better all the time.

 

[RVDan]

The Tyco are not very good (being politically correct here), the Klixon are expensive but the old axiom you get what you pay for is true in this case also.
I prefer seperate breakers switches but if you must use a combo try one of these.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/7270_5_15.php?clickkey=4055

Actually the MTBF on the Klixon breaker/switch is substantially lower than the Klixon 7277 or 7274 series CB's. In an application where the Klixon switch breaker was used regulalry, we used to see this component replaced on a regular basis. Nothing like a toggle per Mil-S-3950- like the MS24523 series. This is the same as the Honeywell switches that Walt likes. That's all I use on my panel That and the Klixon CB's. Might look utilitarian but they never fail.

 

[TylerII]

Switchable breakers FAA SAIB

You might want to refer to FAA Special Airworthiness Information Bulletin CE-13-22 about these type switches.
Tyler
A&P

 

[Canadian_JOY]

Actually the MTBF on the Klixon breaker/switch is substantially lower than the Klixon 7277 or 7274 series CB's. In an application where the Klixon switch breaker was used regulalry, we used to see this component replaced on a regular basis. Nothing like a toggle per Mil-S-3950- like the MS24523 series. This is the same as the Honeywell switches that Walt likes. That's all I use on my panel That and the Klixon CB's. Might look utilitarian but they never fail.

I'll second this observation. These Klixon breaker/switches are what I consider to be the best on the market, but they still are a low MTBF item as compared to the MS toggle switch and Klixon breaker.

One particular helicopter fleet I used to maintain had a combination of the Klixon breaker/switch on some circuits and the more traditional MS toggle/Klixon CB on other circuits. Replacement of any of these components was a royal pain in the keester; it often took more than an hour to change a single switch, CB or breaker/switch.

I kept most of the "dead" components in a scrap/quarantine container, primarily so I could scavenge from them the screws, lock washers, nuts etc that so frequently get lost. When I look at that scrap container now it contains about 15 breaker/switches, a couple of CB's (one of which had its shaft broken off by sheer clumsiness), and no MS24523-series switches. This bone pile tells the real-life story of comparative reliability of these devices.

(This thread has proven very useful to me. Now that I look in that scrap bin I realize there's very little hardware left to scavenge from these parts so it's time to chuck 'em out and make some more space in the shop!)

 

[flightlogic]

I pulled up pricing on the Klixon 20TC series... list is about 150 bucks each.
Ouch...

 

[KatieB]

The age old of question of "Form vs Function", when it comes to aircraft I'm a big believer that function should take priority. From what I see out there the quality of most rocker switches can't compete with the good ole toggle switch/breaker (Honeywell/Klixon) combo used in both commercial and military aircraft alike. Call me old fashioned

Walt, that's a good point. *sigh* I suppose it's just like carburetors and magnetos, they're "old" because they work!

I damnear fell off my chair when I saw the price for the Klixon 20TC. It's not pretty, either. Thanks for all the suggestions! I will dig around online and investigate the types suggested here, but will probably stick with B-52/space shuttle switches for the important stuff.

 

[KatieB]

Hey there, good to see you posting again

Thanks Mike! I feel like I'm crawling out of hibernation. *yawn*

 

[Mike S]

I damnear fell off my chair when I saw the price for the Klixon 20TC.

Well, I did warn you..................

 

[rvisnext]

All latching pushbuttons. The led light can come on when circuit is made, or like I did all the lights are wired to a dimmer. When "on" the button is in about an 1/8", when "off"button is flush. I still used regular toggles for a few functions, e-buss, starter etc.

 

[Ironflight]

If anyone ever finds a source for the triangular-bat toggle switches with which my hands are oh-so-familiar, I'd love to know it Walt. I couldn't find them even when I was in the program - the flight quality ones cost as much as an RV (almost).

And we never used breaker switches in the big glider - separate breakers and switches for NASA.

 

[Yazaman]

Warning..Caution...

While Were on the subject.... Thought I could add some info for you...

Military Tech order 1-1a-14 Par 028 00


44. AS A SWITCH. Normally, a circuit breaker should
not be used as a switch. Most circuit breakers have a
life expectancy of 1/10 or less of the life of a switch.
They are not usually snap-action devices and should
not be considered as substitutes for switches, unless
defined as such in the particular specification. Devices
which are designed as circuit breaker / switches include
MIL-C-27588 and MS25004. Thermal C/B cycling should
be reduced as much as possible. When required should
be done with the circuit de-energized. Energized circuit
cycling should be reduced for safety applications,
required operational checks and flight crew training.

49. Periodic Cycling. During the yearly cycling (or
annual flight hour equivalent) inspection maintenance
interval, all circuit breakers should be mechanically
cycled. This cycling must be controlled by applicable
Maintenance Requirement Cards (MRC) and scheduled
with other aircraft inspections. If MRC's do not exist
for this requirement, contact cognizant engineering
authority to determine the correct interval for this action.
Once per year, pull the button out and push the cycle
circuit breaker in and out three times with no electrical
power applied. This helps clean possible corrosion from
the contacts. Opening circuit breakers a few times a year
does not lower their service life; however, the manual
operation of the circuit breaker should be limited in order
to avoid excessive dynamic wear of the trip mechanism.

 

[pazmanyflyer]

All latching push buttons. The led light can come on when circuit is made, or like I did all the lights are wired to a dimmer. When "on" the button is in about an 1/8", when "off"button is flush. I still used regular toggles for a few functions, e-buss, starter etc.

Where did you find these? Do you have part numbers? These are the types of push buttons I want to use with my VP-X Pro.

 

[YellowJacket RV9]

I am mostly sticking with Van's KISS ideals, so used the Tyco SCBs. But I found that the colored toggled switch covers (I got mine from ACS) make things a lot neater and professional looking.

Chris

 

[rvisnext]

Where did you find these? Do you have part numbers? These are the types of push buttons I want to use with my VP-X Pro.

Search "plasmaglow switch" on amazon. U can also find them cheaper on eBay. I think I paid about $10 per switch when I bought in quantity

 

[rmartingt]

Personally , I'd love to find a cheaper equivalent of the Korry pushbutton switches you find on large aircraft, especially if I could get the switch lighting working the way I want. Honeywell's AML ones come close, but their current ratings aren't quite high enough for everything Iwwant to use them for.

 

[Mike S]

Honeywell's AML ones come close, but their current ratings aren't quite high enough for everything Iwwant to use them for.

I used the AML switch for a high current on/off application by "Y"ing the two sides of a DPST switch so it shared the current between a pair of contacts, from a functional standpoint it became a SPDT.

So far, 4 1/2 years and 220 hours and doing just fine.