Van's Air Force
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ELT Choice
- Thread starter Wolf
- Start date
Sparky
Well Known Member
Check out the ACK E-04
Have you looked at the new ACK Technologies Model E-04 406 MHZ ELT? It is very competitively priced ($599 MSRP) and includes the GPS interface. It should be shipping within the next couple of months.
http://www.ackavionics.com/
Have you looked at the new ACK Technologies Model E-04 406 MHZ ELT? It is very competitively priced ($599 MSRP) and includes the GPS interface. It should be shipping within the next couple of months.
http://www.ackavionics.com/
craigvince
Well Known Member
I have an Aertex 406 ELT, ehhh. It makes me feel good that I have a 406 in my plane that's it.
First, they don't have a GPS, then they offer a WHIP antenna, but they say it has to be mounted vertically and on top to be approved. Few people want to install an ugly antenna on top, right? and the WHIP antenna has speed limit (I think it is 200 mph) and plus in case of a crash, less likely that the plane would be in an upright condition.
First, they don't have a GPS, then they offer a WHIP antenna, but they say it has to be mounted vertically and on top to be approved. Few people want to install an ugly antenna on top, right? and the WHIP antenna has speed limit (I think it is 200 mph) and plus in case of a crash, less likely that the plane would be in an upright condition.
[email protected]
Well Known Member
elt... not convinced that they are worthwhile
i know we are required to have one... and the newer 406 system is better than the goose chase cluster of the older 121.5 units that are far more apt to sound a regional alarm from a ramped plane that had a hard landing before being tied down... but for real value in 'rescue' nothing beats ready voice contact with somebody when traveling across long stretches of empty. one of my favorite features of aviation gps units is the ready access to the closest center frequency. in a real emergency it is all about radio contact with somebody to mobilize rescue services...
i know we are required to have one... and the newer 406 system is better than the goose chase cluster of the older 121.5 units that are far more apt to sound a regional alarm from a ramped plane that had a hard landing before being tied down... but for real value in 'rescue' nothing beats ready voice contact with somebody when traveling across long stretches of empty. one of my favorite features of aviation gps units is the ready access to the closest center frequency. in a real emergency it is all about radio contact with somebody to mobilize rescue services...
Canadian_JOY
Well Known Member
Stephen - I would encourage you to read the recent thread entitled "Andrew Phillips". He was a local RV7A pilot and was flying along with two other local RV pilots from the same point of origin to the same destination. He went down for reasons yet to be determined. There was not one peep on the radio from him - his flying buddies were close enough that they would have heard him keying the mic even if he didn't have time to transmit any voice. As it was, there was nothing on the radio. Nothing. He just disappeared without providing any alert to his flying companions.
Your idea of being in radio contact is great, but it does nothing to help you in the event of some of the most common aviation incidents: pilot incapacitation, CFIT, mid-air collision etc. The idea behind an ELT is that it transmits even when you can't. You're personally not sold on ELT's - I hope you don't have to have a bad experience occur to you or a loved one before you change your mind.
By the way - there have been quite a few posts on here about trying to hide the ugly ELT antenna under the aft empennage fairing. This idea, from a Search and Rescue standpoint, is an absolute non-starter. The aircraft mentioned above had its ELT antenna mounted under the fairing and it couldn't be heard by SAR until the search aircraft was directly over the wreckage. As a result the ELT was of very limited use in the SAR effort. Compromising the installation makes poor ELT operation a foregone conclusion. The mounting requirements for ELT antennas on the exterior of the fuselage aren't recommended idly by the TSO - there's a darned good reason for these installation requirements.
Oh, one other point... Everybody talks about SPOT being a saviour. This incident aircraft also had SPOT on board and the two RV buddies flew back to its last reported SPOT breadcrumb. The incident happened mid-afternoon and the wreckage wasn't found until after 10:00pm. So much for a SPOT being able to help you get rescued in short order.
Bottom line is ELT's are a required piece of equipment in our airplanes for very, very good reasons. You're building an airplane that'll be worth at least $50K, and your backside might even be worth something, too, even if it means only that your body is found so your spouse can get an insurance cheque in a timely manner. As the old saying goes, if ya got a 10 dollar head, wear a 10 dollar hat. If you figure you're worth something, whether dead or alive, the investment in an ELT is worth every penny.
As for the 406ELT's themselves, I have an ME406 in my aircraft, and have installed several Kannad units in certified airplanes. Artex now offers a relatively cheap GPS interface for the ME406 which will allow our handheld GPS units to transmit position data to the ELT. That's a real game changer. On the other hand I've installed several Kannad units. They are easier to install and offer a little more intuitive user interface.
Your idea of being in radio contact is great, but it does nothing to help you in the event of some of the most common aviation incidents: pilot incapacitation, CFIT, mid-air collision etc. The idea behind an ELT is that it transmits even when you can't. You're personally not sold on ELT's - I hope you don't have to have a bad experience occur to you or a loved one before you change your mind.
By the way - there have been quite a few posts on here about trying to hide the ugly ELT antenna under the aft empennage fairing. This idea, from a Search and Rescue standpoint, is an absolute non-starter. The aircraft mentioned above had its ELT antenna mounted under the fairing and it couldn't be heard by SAR until the search aircraft was directly over the wreckage. As a result the ELT was of very limited use in the SAR effort. Compromising the installation makes poor ELT operation a foregone conclusion. The mounting requirements for ELT antennas on the exterior of the fuselage aren't recommended idly by the TSO - there's a darned good reason for these installation requirements.
Oh, one other point... Everybody talks about SPOT being a saviour. This incident aircraft also had SPOT on board and the two RV buddies flew back to its last reported SPOT breadcrumb. The incident happened mid-afternoon and the wreckage wasn't found until after 10:00pm. So much for a SPOT being able to help you get rescued in short order.
Bottom line is ELT's are a required piece of equipment in our airplanes for very, very good reasons. You're building an airplane that'll be worth at least $50K, and your backside might even be worth something, too, even if it means only that your body is found so your spouse can get an insurance cheque in a timely manner. As the old saying goes, if ya got a 10 dollar head, wear a 10 dollar hat. If you figure you're worth something, whether dead or alive, the investment in an ELT is worth every penny.
As for the 406ELT's themselves, I have an ME406 in my aircraft, and have installed several Kannad units in certified airplanes. Artex now offers a relatively cheap GPS interface for the ME406 which will allow our handheld GPS units to transmit position data to the ELT. That's a real game changer. On the other hand I've installed several Kannad units. They are easier to install and offer a little more intuitive user interface.
Canadian_JOY
Well Known Member
Updated information here in the form of a correction. While Andy Phillips and I had several detailed discussions concerning his ELT installation, it would appear that when it came time to do the actual installation he put the antenna on the outside of the fuselage rather than under the fairing. I stand corrected on this point. Somewhere along the line he made the decision to mount it atop the fuselage, where it likely was sheered off in the crash. Despite the antenna having been incapable of radiating properly the ELT did activate and did emit a signal which allowed confirmation of the crash site during a night search, something that wouldn't have been available if relying solely on pilot-activated equipment like a PLB or VHF communications with ATC.
Canadian_JOY
Well Known Member
One ELT that's definitely worthy of consideration is the Emergency Beacon Corporation EBC-406.
http://www.emergencybeaconcorp.com/productDetail.asp?prodid=17
Small, lightweight, simplest installation of them all.
http://www.emergencybeaconcorp.com/productDetail.asp?prodid=17
Small, lightweight, simplest installation of them all.
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
Thank you for the update to this tragic accident.
Would be interesting to know how much better an intact ELT antenna mounted in the emp fairing would have performed..............
I don't want to belabor the point, and we will never reach consensus on this issue, but your correction reaffirms a major reason why many don't mount the ELT antenna on top of the airframe.
flyboy1963
Well Known Member
cabin mount
I'd long since forgotten about these. Even in our previous all-wood aircraft, we mounted the ELT antenna behind the cabin on the aft turtledeck.
I see the cabin mount type still use a remote antenna as standard......why not mount it with the 'portable/survival antenna' attached at all times, & installed on the aft bulkhead?
Surely a decent signal would project thru the canopy, especially if the fixed antenna were torn off. ( or are 2 antennas on the same device a no-no?).
I like the simplicity; if you're conscious, you can hear it, or activate it, or grab it and egress the cabin, (rather than one strapped to the floor under the seat and piles of debris post-crash)...or am I inverted underwater.?
Hmmmmm.
I'd long since forgotten about these. Even in our previous all-wood aircraft, we mounted the ELT antenna behind the cabin on the aft turtledeck.
I see the cabin mount type still use a remote antenna as standard......why not mount it with the 'portable/survival antenna' attached at all times, & installed on the aft bulkhead?
Surely a decent signal would project thru the canopy, especially if the fixed antenna were torn off. ( or are 2 antennas on the same device a no-no?).
I like the simplicity; if you're conscious, you can hear it, or activate it, or grab it and egress the cabin, (rather than one strapped to the floor under the seat and piles of debris post-crash)...or am I inverted underwater.?
Hmmmmm.
ELT
Right now I'm leaning to the Kannad. A little more money but light and uses all 3 frequencies. When I built my 6A I mounted the antenna under the fairing and it seemed to work well. It may have had a little less effectiveness there but overall seems better than getting it sheared off in a crash.
Jay 7A UT47 Grassy Meadows Skyranch
Right now I'm leaning to the Kannad. A little more money but light and uses all 3 frequencies. When I built my 6A I mounted the antenna under the fairing and it seemed to work well. It may have had a little less effectiveness there but overall seems better than getting it sheared off in a crash.
Jay 7A UT47 Grassy Meadows Skyranch
Get one that uses regular batteries. They are easier to procure. Put your ELT under the fiberglass empanage fairing. It is easy to get to. I got the ME 406 cause I thought it would be cheaper in the long run. I just finished installing a AK-451 in a PA 32. The differance is the price and the batteries.
flyboy1963
Well Known Member
elt batteries
a note; certification of ELT's generally requires the batteries to perform for a period of time at various temperatures.
If you do go for the 6 - D-cell unit, check the performance of the best Lithium batteries, ($60 per annual change?) Vs the more exotic $200 ones .....that are certified good for 5 years.
You may find the price vs change interval makes the choice for you.
Re: frequencies; I believe most if not all will send the 121.5 homing signal AND the 406 burst needed for satellite detection.
I think the GPS capability can be expensive, but you gotta ask how much faster would you be found with this option?
a note; certification of ELT's generally requires the batteries to perform for a period of time at various temperatures.
If you do go for the 6 - D-cell unit, check the performance of the best Lithium batteries, ($60 per annual change?) Vs the more exotic $200 ones .....that are certified good for 5 years.
You may find the price vs change interval makes the choice for you.
Re: frequencies; I believe most if not all will send the 121.5 homing signal AND the 406 burst needed for satellite detection.
I think the GPS capability can be expensive, but you gotta ask how much faster would you be found with this option?
Artex ELT Triggering
Back on saturday Jan 24th, we had one of our Artex ME406's triggered by a member's 2.5 yr old son while on the taxiway. He reset it, notified ATC, and thought nothing more of it.
Minutes later, I get a call from the Air Force in Florida, "do you know where your plane is"? A few quick calls and it was resolved, but the system worked perfectly.
They were friendly, professional, and helpful despite it being a false alarm. Go with one of the 406 MHz units, they jumped on it FAST!!!
Ed
RV-8 - Empennage
Aircraft Factory - Under Construction
Maintenance Officer - 150th Aero Flying Club - KMMU
Back on saturday Jan 24th, we had one of our Artex ME406's triggered by a member's 2.5 yr old son while on the taxiway. He reset it, notified ATC, and thought nothing more of it.
Minutes later, I get a call from the Air Force in Florida, "do you know where your plane is"? A few quick calls and it was resolved, but the system worked perfectly.
They were friendly, professional, and helpful despite it being a false alarm. Go with one of the 406 MHz units, they jumped on it FAST!!!
Ed
RV-8 - Empennage
Aircraft Factory - Under Construction
Maintenance Officer - 150th Aero Flying Club - KMMU
