EAA Technical Counselor

[KatanaPilot]

I have not been an EAA Technical Counselor for very long. Some other Tech Counselors that I have talked with have been for many years. Some of them indicate they have never been contacted by a builder.

This is surprising to me. This resource exists, yet new builders don't take advantage of it. We volunteered to do this, hate to see people make (sometimes very expensive) mistakes and would enjoy helping out others as we were helped. We have some experience that could be valuable to people just starting out or needing a little motivation to move past a challenge.

Why isn't this resource being utilized more?

 

[Mel]

I have not been an EAA Technical Counselor for very long. Some other Tech Counselors that I have talked with have been for many years. Some of them indicate they have never been contacted by a builder.
This is surprising to me. This resource exists, yet new builders don't take advantage of it. We volunteered to do this, hate to see people make (sometimes very expensive) mistakes and would enjoy helping out others as we were helped. We have some experience that could be valuable to people just starting out or needing a little motivation to move past a challenge.
Why isn't this resource being utilized more?

It depends a lot on the area. In the Dallas metroplex area we get quite a few calls. On the other side of the coin, the "Flight Advisor" program is much worse.

I get maybe one call a year or less on that program.

 

[DanH]

The program was created pre-internet, when assistance was harder to find. Today a builder can get advice in an hour or two. As a result, quite a few builders think they have access to all they need. They're wrong (see below), but it's understandable. Why call Old Bob from your EAA chapter when you can watch a YouTube star with his own channel?

There's a flip side. The Old Bobs and the YouTube personalities have one thing in common...the quality of their advice varies widely. The TC program is not necessarily better in that regard. Different media, same folks.

So, neither is perfect. That said, here's why you want to call in a TC, or two, or three, or your whole Chapter.

Hands on instruction: Reading a description, or watching someone do something in a video, is not nearly as educational as picking up the tools while someone watches you.

Eyeballs on errors. This is The Big One. No video or forum can substitute for an eyeball inspection. And trust me, errors are always a surprise. I've yet to meet a builder who wasn't flabbergasted when his attention was drawn to a screwup which, in retrospect, was obvious as sunshine.

True story: I once built an airplane, flew off 40 hours, flew it to OSH and regional fly-ins, won prizes, and got on magazine covers...then at the first annual, discovered a nut missing where the aileron pushrods met the stick.

I had flown it the whole time with nothing holding the bolt through the rod ends. It was a humbling lesson, and to this day, you're all invited to come take a look before I do a first flight. Please. You'll be doing me a favor.

 

[Mel]

The program was created pre-internet, when assistance was harder to find. Today a builder can get advice in an hour or two. As a result, quite a few builders think they have access to all they need. They're wrong (see below), but it's understandable. Why call Old Bob from your EAA chapter when you can watch a YouTube star with his own channel?
There's a flip side. The Old Bobs and the YouTube personalities have one thing in common...the quality of their advice varies widely. The TC program is not necessarily better in that regard. Different media, same folks.
So, neither is perfect. That said, here's why you want to call in a TC, or two, or three, or your whole Chapter.
Hands on instruction: Reading a description, or watching someone do something in a video, is not nearly as educational as picking up the tools while someone watches you.
Eyeballs on errors. This is The Big One. No video or forum can substitute for an eyeball inspection. And trust me, errors are always a surprise. I've yet to meet a builder who wasn't flabbergasted when his attention was drawn to a screwup which, in retrospect, was obvious as sunshine.
True story: I once built an airplane, flew off 40 hours, flew it to OSH and regional fly-ins, won prizes, and got on magazine covers...then at the first annual, discovered a nut missing where the aileron pushrods met the stick.
I had flown it the whole time with nothing holding the bolt through the rod ends. It was a humbling lesson, and to this day, you're all invited to come take a look before I do a first flight. Please. You'll be doing me a favor.

Just to add to Dan's comments; When you are so close to a project and look at it every day, you see what you expect to see, and it's VERY easy to overlook things that will stand out to another set of eyes.

 

[MacCool]

It depends a lot on the area.

It depends almost entirely on the area. A common response to questions posed in these forums is "ask a tech counselor", or "join an EAA chapter".... usually from someone who lives in a a more urban area. In this rural area, I'm a member of two local EAA chapters and there are three other chapters within a 70 mile radius. Locally, I am one of two EAA members who owns or has any experience with an Experimental airplane. The other one is an ELSA (not an RV-12), and he didn't build his either. The closest source of E-AB help of any kind is 120 miles away, and the nearest EAA "tech counselor" is 150 miles away. "Old Bob" in either of our local chapters is long dead.

Point being, in my experience and in my area...the EAA and "tech counselor" isn't necessarily the universal answer to questions about Experimental aviation and aircraft. For a large part of the country, forums like VAF fulfill the bulk of that role. I'm grateful for that but that only ameliorates occasional frustration, rarely solves it.

Don't mean to whine, just felt the urge to toss in a dose of reality common to those of us who try to own these airplanes in "less-that-urban" areas. I've been a pilot more than 50 years but never even considered Experimental aviation until 3 years ago when the "revelation" came to me. I love it, but there are certainly times when the inevitable problems and frustrations supervene, and in those cases, it's rare that the EAA or its programs are of much convenient help to me out here in the hinterlands.

 

[bkervaski]

My experience so far is you have to get yourself out there, locally, involved with whatever chapters survived Covid (ours did not). And online, with the various forums and Facebook groups. VAF is by far the most active, but I've been helping with some Carbon Cub projects too.

I get about two calls per week from around 5 projects that I'm helping with. Only 1 of them is local.

 

[rmarshall234]

Just to add to Dan's comments; When you are so close to a project and look at it every day, you see what you expect to see, and it's VERY easy to overlook things that will stand out to another set of eyes.

Adding to Mel’s comments; heard a friend was doing his first flight so hurried out to the airport and just before engine start, and from 40 ft away, my greeting was…”is anybody going to bend the cotter pin down on that wheel?”. The DAR, builder and test pilot had all done their inspections but you see things from 40 ft that you will miss up close.

 

[mfleming]

The reason I didn’t use a tech councillor is none of the TCs contacted would travel to my location. Granted, I live in eastern Oregon and it’s a long drive from anywhere

The the online resources are great but personally, I’d really have liked an TC to have looked at my work. I can’t imagine not using one if one was available.

 

[wirejock]

Siri & Alexa

I agree with the comments. Information is so easy to find. It's not always quality information.
Expertise is another animal altogether.
I learned long ago, I can research how to do something and Siri or Alexa usually give me the big picture. However, no internet website can give the information people get through experience. I always find someone with knowledge and learn. I credit my Mentor, Dave for my aviation knowledge. And there's always more to learn.

My fear is an entire generation of knowledge is going away because they don't make You Tube videos.
I Woke someone recently. He was working on a lawnmower and the carb gasket fell apart. I said, "Do you have a cereal box?" Then I took the carb, rubbed some waste oil on it and pressed it onto the cardboard. I handed it to him and said, "Cut that." One intake gasket. I said, "I bet Siri and Alexa don't know that trick!"

Of course, that would never be done on an airplane so don't get your tighty whiteys in a wad. It's just an example. My point is the Internet is not the place to go for knowledge. Find someone like Dan, Mel or Dave and learn.

FYI, I had four TC visits by three different advisors. I encourage others to do the same. More eyes.
Last one warned me. He said he almost always gives bad news. He couldn't find any problems. All four forms read "Excellent Workmanship". And yet, I still welcome eyes on my project.

 

[N8DAV8R]

I tried to get a tech counselor to visit during my build. It was early 2020. There was only one local resource listed with sheet metal aircraft experience. When I reached out he was busy with his seasonal aviation job, but he would come take a look in a few months when things slowed down. He passed away from COVID before the end of that season.

Luckily I kind of had a built-in substitute. My dad was taught airframe work by the USAF long ago, and had stayed active enough with aircraft to retain the important parts. He helped establish a standard early in the build, so I just pressed on and completed the airplane before anyone else had a look.

The DAR had lots of nice things to say. I'm proud of what we did. Like others have mentioned, I welcome anyone who wants to look over the plane. I'll even get out the tools and pull panels and fairings. I like almost anything to do with airplanes and that includes looking at them. Beside that, if anyone sees anything that's really bad I can just blame it on my dad.

 

[Biggiesauls]

The reason I didn’t use a tech councilor is none of the TCs contacted would travel to my location. Granted, I live in eastern Oregon and it’s a long drive from anywhere

The the online resources are great but personally, I’d really have liked an TC to have looked at my work. I can’t imagine not using one if one was available.

This is my exact experience here in North East Texas/South West Arkansas. Even tried to re-start an EAA chapter but the acting "pres" only saw personal income dollar signs to his non-profit for Young Eagle flights.

Nearing completion and would welcome another set of eyes before I make the call for Mel to come do his thing... next month-ish?

 

[Ralph Inkster]

I recently got a notice from EAA asking whether I wanted to continue being a Tech Councilor as they hadn't received any visit reports lately. Actually, I have only made maybe 5 project visits in the last 15 years. So don't feel bad if you are not getting any requests for visits.

What I do experience is that when I show up at meetings, I usually spend the first 15 minutes at least answering questions from builders & owners in attendance. Also while walking down any ramp at what ever airport I happen to be at, be asked to view a project or again answer questions. So there still seems to be a need for folks to step up & be available in a support function like this. And than there is the phone calls, I would hazard a guess that I field 2 or so calls per month with questions.

Another area that seems to be changing is demand for builder instruction courses. I see that the Sportair Workshop Series dates are much reduced from what it was pre-Covid. Maybe that might be a facility availability issue, or alternate courses out there, or just more online knowledge out there now.
Times are changing-

 

[jcarne]

It depends almost entirely on the area. A common response to questions posed in these forums is "ask a tech counselor", or "join an EAA chapter".... usually from someone who lives in a a more urban area. In this rural area, I'm a member of two local EAA chapters and there are three other chapters within a 70 mile radius. Locally, I am one of two EAA members who owns or has any experience with an Experimental airplane. The other one is an ELSA (not an RV-12), and he didn't build his either. The closest source of E-AB help of any kind is 120 miles away, and the nearest EAA "tech counselor" is 150 miles away. "Old Bob" in either of our local chapters is long dead.

Point being, in my experience and in my area...the EAA and "tech counselor" isn't necessarily the universal answer to questions about Experimental aviation and aircraft. For a large part of the country, forums like VAF fulfill the bulk of that role. I'm grateful for that but that only ameliorates occasional frustration, rarely solves it.

Don't mean to whine, just felt the urge to toss in a dose of reality common to those of us who try to own these airplanes in "less-that-urban" areas. I've been a pilot more than 50 years but never even considered Experimental aviation until 3 years ago when the "revelation" came to me. I love it, but there are certainly times when the inevitable problems and frustrations supervene, and in those cases, it's rare that the EAA or its programs are of much convenient help to me out here in the hinterlands.

Same experience here. I was lucky to get one that drove 2 hours one way to come visit me. I often envied people building in bigger areas and not being the only RV on the field. VAF helped a lot!

 

[airguy]

The reason I didn’t use a tech councilor is none of the TCs contacted would travel to my location. Granted, I live in eastern Oregon and it’s a long drive from anywhere

The the online resources are great but personally, I’d really have liked an TC to have looked at my work. I can’t imagine not using one if one was available.

I had a bad experience early on with a TC who turned out to be about 98% worthless and only interested in playing with warbirds, so I bailed on that program and relied on other builders and heavy research online. I still believe I got the better end of that deal.

I'll bet a hunnert-dollah bill I'm not the only one with that experience.

 

[rvbuilder2002]

I had a bad experience early on with a TC who turned out to be about 98% worthless and only interested in playing with warbirds, so I bailed on that program and relied on other builders and heavy research online. I still believe I got the better end of that deal.

I'll bet a hunnert-dollah bill I'm not the only one with that experience.

I think Technical counselors are kind of like restaurants...

One bad restaurant experience doesn't usually warrant giving up on eating out for the rest of our lives (I don't know of anyone that has ever done that).

There are a lot of good technical counselors... it just might take trying more than one to find one...

 

[bertschb]

As a new EAA member and new builder, I wasn't aware of the Technical Counselor program. Of course, I haven't attended any EAA meetings at our local chapter so that's part of the reason.

I'd love to have somebody check out my work once I actually get something built. Still waiting for my Empennage kit so I can start and I suspect with the laser cut parts issue, my wait will be MUCH longer now :-(

 

[wirejock]

TC

As a new EAA member and new builder, I wasn't aware of the Technical Counselor program. Of course, I haven't attended any EAA meetings at our local chapter so that's part of the reason.

I'd love to have somebody check out my work once I actually get something built. Still waiting for my Empennage kit so I can start and I suspect with the laser cut parts issue, my wait will be MUCH longer now :-(

Now is a great time to grab some scrap, find a local mentor and pound rivets. Perfect the craft on scrap.

 

[bertschb]

Now is a great time to grab some scrap, find a local mentor and pound rivets.

I've built two of the practice toolboxes. I'm not too worried about the basics. But, I would like to have an expert (EAA TC) review my work once I get to something like the wings or fuselage.

We just moved to an airpark and there are many builders here. There are actually three other -14 builders right now. Maybe one of them is an EAA TC??? Time to go to the EAA website and do a search...

UPDATE: Just did a search for the nearest EAA Technical Counselor.... he's 950 miles away!

 

[Bcone1381]

What experience level is required to become a Tech Counselor? I've been building for 7 years. I've never seen any training/mentoring program or request for volunteers.

If you are an experienced TC and enjoy mentoring others and may want to mentor me, PM me.

 

[rleffler]

I've built two of the practice toolboxes. I'm not too worried about the basics. But, I would like to have an expert (EAA TC) review my work once I get to something like the wings or fuselage.

We just moved to an airpark and there are many builders here. There are actually three other -14 builders right now. Maybe one of them is an EAA TC??? Time to go to the EAA website and do a search...

UPDATE: Just did a search for the nearest EAA Technical Counselor.... he's 950 miles away!

Interesting……..

If you look at the post a couple above this one, you’ll find one that’s about 160 miles away. You’ll also be hard pressed to find anyone more knowledgeable of Van’s products.

 

[gasman]

As a new EAA member and new builder, I wasn't aware of the Technical Counselor program. Of course, I haven't attended any EAA meetings at our local chapter so that's part of the reason.

I'd love to have somebody check out my work once I actually get something built. Still waiting for my Empennage kit so I can start and I suspect with the laser cut parts issue, my wait will be MUCH longer now :-(

Now might be a good time to go back and read page one of your builders manual, and also section one...... good information printed there.

 

[Ironflight]

What experience level is required to become a Tech Counselor? I've been building for 7 years. I've never seen any training/mentoring program or request for volunteers.

If you are an experienced TC and enjoy mentoring others and may want to mentor me, PM me.

You can learn all about the EAA Tech Counselor program (as a user or a volunteer) if you Google “EAA Tech Counselor Program”. The requirements to be a TC are listed as :

First, one must be an EAA member. We have other qualifications, which are listed below.

Have built an amateur-built aircraft or ultralight, or
Have restored an antique/classic aircraft, or
Be an A&P (other countries equivalents of these ratings are also acceptable), with hands-on experience with any amateur-built aircraft, warbird, or vintage aircraft.

When I was on the Homebuilt Council, we were always discussing ways to make the TC program more visible, more user friendly, and “more utilized”. One of the problems we had was the fact that TC’s frequently made visits, but didn’t file the paperwork because it was a actual paper that required mailing, We were able to get an iPad App built that automates the process, and sends the report to HQ as well as to the builder so they can print and file it in their log.

I think there are a number of reasons builders don;t use it:

1) They don’t have a TC nearby (yes, the west is a big place, and very spread out)
2) They don’t know about it.
3) They think they have to be in a chapter to use a TC (They don’t)
4) Many folks don’t want to have their work looked at critically. Believe me - when I visit, I try to be very upbeat and positive - and sometimes, that means positively helping a builder learn proper techniques and methods. I want folks to have the best airplane they can build, and that means “building the builder”.

Get to know a Tech Counselor - the internet isn’t always the best place to learn….

Paul

 

[bertschb]

Interesting……..

If you look at the post a couple above this one, you’ll find one that’s about 160 miles away.

If you're referring to Scott (just looked at his signature and saw he's a TC), the EAA search didn't return his name. He's 3.5 hours away.

 

[bertschb]

Now might be a good time to go back and read page one of your builders manual, and also section one...... good information printed there.

Thanks. Yeah, I've read that (and many others parts of the manual as well as multiple pages of the empennage and wing plans) multiple times while I wait for the empennage kit to arrive. Hundreds of hours here. Hundreds of hours watching YT videos. Just wasn't aware that there were free EAA Technical Counselors who would come out and review work. It's a great idea! I'm pretty sure when the times comes I'll be able to get one of my neighbors to check my work. Most of them have built multiple airplanes. At least one of them has built five!

 

[rvbuilder2002]

If you're referring to Scott (just looked at his signature and saw he's a TC), the EAA search didn't return his name. He's 3.5 hours away.

40 minute flight in my airplane

 

[bertschb]

40 minute flight in my airplane

Hah! You could taxi right to my house!

 

[MacCool]

Now is a great time to grab some scrap, find a local mentor and pound rivets. Perfect the craft on scrap.

The "local mentor" concept is not universal.

 

[KatanaPilot]

I've built two of the practice toolboxes. I'm not too worried about the basics. But, I would like to have an expert (EAA TC) review my work once I get to something like the wings or fuselage.

We just moved to an airpark and there are many builders here. There are actually three other -14 builders right now. Maybe one of them is an EAA TC??? Time to go to the EAA website and do a search...

UPDATE: Just did a search for the nearest EAA Technical Counselor.... he's 950 miles away!

That's surprising to me as well. Wally Anderson (Founder of Synergy Air), lives(ed) in Sunriver. He used to hold classes at his home there. Haven't looked to see if he still is a TC, but he is as knowledgeable - especially for a first time builder - as anyone.

When we built a replacement tail for our RV-7A project (bought from a first time builder), Wally came back to Synergy to help out for a week. He helped us build the entire tail in 3 1/2 days, which included a quick trip to Aurora to replace a misdrilled spar. He had built so many RV-7/8 tails, he rarely even needed to look at the plans.

 

[Gnvflyer]

Great idea

Currently finishing my third aircraft, but am no expert. Would love to have a second set of eyes on it at this point in my build.

Anyone willing to come take a look? I live near Gainesville, Florida.

 

[dstates]

UPDATE: Just did a search for the nearest EAA Technical Counselor.... he's 950 miles away!

Make sure you do the search two ways. Once with your aircraft make/model and once without any aircraft make/model. There will be a large difference between the two results.

 

[Jerry Fischer]

Ditto

I was very fortunate building my RV-7 when a member of Chapter 690 in Lawrenceville, GA. Both Dwayne Huff & Larry Bishop were more than willing to drive out to my home in Winder and check my work. And they found thinks that could be done better, so I redid 'em. I was also very fortunate to have Steve Nrecomer (yes, that Steve Newcomer, a Former Delta A&P/IA and FSDO in Atlanta,) come all the way out to my home to do the airworthiness inspection and give me a few items to address prior to signing off.
I wanted to pay it forward so I became a Tech Counselor here in NE Georgia several years ago and belong to Chapter 611 up in Gainesville, GA.
I welcome the chance to look at your project...
Looking forward to seeing the Tech Counselors at the Thursday breakfast up here at AirVenture.

 

[bertschb]

Make sure you do the search two ways. Once with your aircraft make/model and once without any aircraft make/model.

Good catch. I did a search with no aircraft make and a number of technical counselors showed up. None of them are near me but it was good to see there are a bunch available in Oregon.

@KatanaPilot - Wally was one of the names listed in the search results if no aircraft make is selected.

 

[Ironflight]

Remote Counseling

One other thing for builders who live in “remote” areas - develop a relationship with a TC who is willing to help out using the technology tools we now have available. I have been working with an RV-10 builder who lives in a town about two and a half hour drive (or forty-five minute RV flight) away for several years. I visited him up front in person, and after that, we consult using emailed photos or FaceTime when questions arise. Lots of options exist now that everyone has cameras and internet connections.

When I lived in Houston, I routinely traveled in the RV for TC visits as far as a couple hundred miles, asking only for fuel money. I do the same these days out here in the west - helping other builders is important!

 

[bkervaski]

Currently finishing my third aircraft, but am no expert. Would love to have a second set of eyes on it at this point in my build.

Always prudent, even "experts" and "pros" miss stuff.

 

[MechaSteve]

I was very fortunate building my RV-7 when a member of Chapter 690 in Lawrenceville, GA. Both Dwayne Huff & Larry Bishop were more than willing to drive out to my home in Winder and check my work. And they found thinks that could be done better, so I redid 'em. I was also very fortunate to have Steve Nrecomer (yes, that Steve Newcomer, a Former Delta A&P/IA and FSDO in Atlanta,) come all the way out to my home to do the airworthiness inspection and give me a few items to address prior to signing off.
I wanted to pay it forward so I became a Tech Counselor here in NE Georgia several years ago and belong to Chapter 611 up in Gainesville, GA.
I welcome the chance to look at your project...
Looking forward to seeing the Tech Counselors at the Thursday breakfast up here at AirVenture.

I live right by PDK and will need some oversight / adult supervision for my build. I need to make sure I am making the right choice between my natural perfectionism and laziness.

 

[Jerry Fischer]

visit

I live right by PDK and will need some oversight / adult supervision for my build. I need to make sure I am making the right choice between my natural perfectionism and laziness.

I should be on the website for tech visit contact info if not just PM me