Can you reply again why builders don't prefer to use the door seals supplied with the kit. It seems to me building up the cabin lip till it nearly touches the door then following the plans by placing the Van's seal on the door not the cabin, where it will not be subject to damage swinging your foot over the door sill or grabbing onto the cabin frame to get into the cabin will supply protection from the wind, rain and noise as well as protect the seal from physical damage.
Van's Air Force
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Door Seals
- Thread starter dspender
- Start date
rleffler
Well Known Member
Personal preference. There is no question that there are many RV-10's out there that were built exactly to plans and the owners are quite happy with the results.
My personal opinion was that I didn't like the way the original door seals looked. I thought they were a little cheesy.
I did install the McMater Carr seals and yes it was a pain to modify the cabin cover to accomodate, but I like the look better. The factory will tell you that cutting off the curve in the rain gutter will impact the structure of the cabin cover. That is one reason why I chose to build up the door area with fiberglass strips and not just use filler.
It's been two years and the door seals look like they were just installed. I've not had any problems with them at all.
Like most modifications that are made, there is no clear right or wrong answer. Your opinion is the only one that counts! (well maybe your spouse too)
bob
Last edited:
"...The factory will tell you that cutting off the curve in the rain gutter will impact the structure of the cabin cover..."
Yeah, and removing the lip from the cabin cover so it will fit in the fuselage opening does the same. It would have worked SO much better if the door opening in the cabin top was 1/4" smaller. Then you could sand the LIP to fit instead of removing it...
Yeah, and removing the lip from the cabin cover so it will fit in the fuselage opening does the same. It would have worked SO much better if the door opening in the cabin top was 1/4" smaller. Then you could sand the LIP to fit instead of removing it...
rleffler
Well Known Member
Yeah, and removing the lip from the cabin cover so it will fit in the fuselage opening does the same. It would have worked SO much better if the door opening in the cabin top was 1/4" smaller. Then you could sand the LIP to fit instead of removing it...[/quote]
Please elobrate. Which lip are you refering to?
I've helped with many RV-10s and this is not something I've had heard previously. Most people just sand the door frame to fit the fuselage opening. This is the first I've heard of anyone having to remove it. I would be interested in seeing a photo.
bob
Please elobrate. Which lip are you refering to?
I've helped with many RV-10s and this is not something I've had heard previously. Most people just sand the door frame to fit the fuselage opening. This is the first I've heard of anyone having to remove it. I would be interested in seeing a photo.
bob
JackinMichigan
Well Known Member
It's a personal preference...
I chose to go with the McMaster-Carr seals... Right now, I can't tell you the reason why... BUT.. I will tell you, it is a lot of work. First I cut off the lip... which I would have done differently if I had to do it again... write me on the details if interested.
I had to extend the lip back wider (only with out the curl)... I put small steel pins in and fiberglassed over them. The bottom lip had to be moved (I think outboard) about 3/8 inch.. I spent over a month working on it daily doing just this job. A lot of the time spent was waiting for the last layer of fiberglass/epoxy to cure.. sand it down.. re-apply.. sand it down.. re-apply..
OH.. also.. the little brackets for the door air cylinder doesn't fit anymore with the new lip. Ya gotta buy some from "Planearound"..
I do like the final results...
I chose to go with the McMaster-Carr seals... Right now, I can't tell you the reason why... BUT.. I will tell you, it is a lot of work. First I cut off the lip... which I would have done differently if I had to do it again... write me on the details if interested.
I had to extend the lip back wider (only with out the curl)... I put small steel pins in and fiberglassed over them. The bottom lip had to be moved (I think outboard) about 3/8 inch.. I spent over a month working on it daily doing just this job. A lot of the time spent was waiting for the last layer of fiberglass/epoxy to cure.. sand it down.. re-apply.. sand it down.. re-apply..
OH.. also.. the little brackets for the door air cylinder doesn't fit anymore with the new lip. Ya gotta buy some from "Planearound"..
I do like the final results...
chazking
Well Known Member
Seals
I used the McMaster seals after trying the bulb seals & the weather stripping seals. The cabin is water tight (I would have occasional leaks from the weather stripping - counter intuitive) and air tight (no sounds [if you can hear above the engine noise] & no air leaks). The 3/8" works well and takes about three weeks to relax & seal without Hans & Franz effort to close.
The result far outweighs the installation effort.
I used the McMaster seals after trying the bulb seals & the weather stripping seals. The cabin is water tight (I would have occasional leaks from the weather stripping - counter intuitive) and air tight (no sounds [if you can hear above the engine noise] & no air leaks). The 3/8" works well and takes about three weeks to relax & seal without Hans & Franz effort to close.
The result far outweighs the installation effort.
Bob
I should clarify my statement. I had to remove the lip on the vertical cabin top door channels where the top fits into the fuselage. I have the QB fuselage, the distance between the F-1042 and the F-1005 is 37". In order to get the cabin top to fit the 37" opening, the lip needed to be sanded flush with the bag side of the cabin top door channels.
I also found that they had used AN470 rivets in the F-1042 and F-1005 where there were supposed to be AN426 flush rivets. Had to fix that before trying to fit the cabin top...
The good news is that the cabin top now fits...build on!
I should clarify my statement. I had to remove the lip on the vertical cabin top door channels where the top fits into the fuselage. I have the QB fuselage, the distance between the F-1042 and the F-1005 is 37". In order to get the cabin top to fit the 37" opening, the lip needed to be sanded flush with the bag side of the cabin top door channels.
I also found that they had used AN470 rivets in the F-1042 and F-1005 where there were supposed to be AN426 flush rivets. Had to fix that before trying to fit the cabin top...
The good news is that the cabin top now fits...build on!
I trimmed back the cabin door opening to the scribe line as per the instructions. After doing this I had a gap of 1/8 to 3/8 of an inch, larger around the bottom as you step into the plane. I placed 7/8 wood dowel along the bottom edge to provide a form to rebuild the lip. That lip now curves out toward the door. Around the sides I placed duct tape on the door, waxed the tape and closed the door. I then forced epoxy mixture between the gap in the cabin and the taped door surface. After curing and opening the door the epoxy buildup on the cabin matches the contour of the door perfectly. Some sanding and minor filling finished out the buildup. However one application a day, this has taken about one week. I plan to attach seals (Van's or otherwise) to the door and as the door closes the seal will compress against the cabin and inside of that the cabin lip which has been rebuilt will nearly touch the door. I think the seal attached to the door rather than to the cabin, keeps the seal away from damage as I enter and leave the cabin. I think the next project I will hang the door by the hinges and trim the cabin lip progressively to fit the door contour. Trimming to the scribe lines and then building up is difficult.
