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Countersink too deep

Raving Nomad

Raving Nomad

Member
Hi All,

This is my first post here. I am building the Vertical stab now and countersunk one of the holes in the VS-803PP too deep. Is this a very bad issue in that should I do this again?

Thanks in advance for your suggestions.

-NC
 
If it's a -3 rivet, drill it out to a -4 and put that in. If it's a -4, just put it in and continue. One rivet in a row of many won't have any structural implications that you could measure. Keep poundin...
 
Common mistake. If you search on 'countersink + deep' you'll probably find lots of opinions expressed before. Depending on how bad and where, your options run from using a larger rivet to filling and re-countersinking, with many ideas in between. To get the best solution for your particular issue, I'd recommend posting a picture or getting a builder or A&P local to you to have a look.
 
Fixing loose rivets in over-countersunk holes

I had a couple of loose rivet in my QB fuse due to slight over-countersinking at the factory. They were in the main spar flange where they join with a seat rib flange. Obviously you cannot fix this by simply squeezing them in the conventional manner as the set does not contact the rivet head.

My solution was to take an short CS rivet of the same size, squeeze it a bit (just the rivet on its own) in the hand squeezers to make a "stubby rivet", place the stubby rivet inverted (head-to-head) on top of the loose rivet in the over-countersunk hole then squeeze the two rivets together. The stubby rivet transfers the pressure to the loose rivet. Worked a treat.

Obviously, this solution is only good for minor over-countersunk holes where the excess countersinking has not compromised the base material.

Hope this may be of use to someone.
 
Thanks

Folks,

Thanks for the encouragement and advice. I'll get some pictures tonight and post them on the thread. I think it is not so deep that a bigger rivet won't do the job but then again, I'm not too sure.

Thanks again!

NC
 
Threw the towel in

OK...I gave up. I thought long and hard. The VS is the first major subsection I'm building and I want to it to be done right. So I caved in and ordered a replacement part from Van's. ~ $20 for peace of mind + pride isn't a bad deal

Thanks again all for all the help.
 
It comes down to what keeps you awake at night. Some things, I sleep just fine. Some, keep me awake, I replace/rework them. But. . . after a while, you learn what is important, what is not. It never hurts to ask.
 
Buy enough parts for two planes

If you buy a new part every time you over countersink one hole or make some other minor mistake you will end up with enough scrap material to make another airplane. Remember RV's are over built, you could leave out every third rivet and leave an open hole and it would fly fine. As for cosmetics, one slightly countersunk hole will be unrecognizable once painted and if not no one will notice as they see the whole great plane when it's finished. Go look at any RV that looks great, then ask the builder what the building flaws are. He'll rattle off a list and point them out, because he knows every one by heart. I'm sure you would have never noticed them. You'll walk away understanding that no average flying RV is perfect but it is still better constructed than most factory airplanes and they still fly great.

Set the rivet and get back to work.
 
What about using the "Oops Rivets" from avery?

They're just a -3 head with a -4 body (I think thats the right numbers; its late night while I'm typing this).

I did the same thing on one hole on the fuel tank skin. I plan to use one of these rivets in place.

Hey Avery, do I get a commission check for this?

-jt
 
Frank Smidler said:
If you buy a new part every time you over countersink one hole or make some other minor mistake you will end up with enough scrap material to make another airplane. Remember RV's are over built, you could leave out every third rivet and leave an open hole and it would fly fine. As for cosmetics, one slightly countersunk hole will be unrecognizable once painted and if not no one will notice as they see the whole great plane when it's finished. Go look at any RV that looks great, then ask the builder what the building flaws are. He'll rattle off a list and point them out, because he knows every one by heart. I'm sure you would have never noticed them. You'll walk away understanding that no average flying RV is perfect but it is still better constructed than most factory airplanes and they still fly great.

Set the rivet and get back to work.
Click to expand...

- Leave out every 3rd rivet and the plane will fly fine? No thank you.

- Ask a 'good' builder what the flaws are and he/she will NOT have a long list, rather no list at all.

Raving Nomad said:
OK...I gave up. I thought long and hard. The VS is the first major subsection I'm building and I want to it to be done right. So I caved in and ordered a replacement part from Van's. ~ $20 for peace of mind + pride isn't a bad deal

Thanks again all for all the help.
Click to expand...

Too many folks tell people to 'build on' when they make a mistake. Hats off to you for purchasing a new part and wanting to do it right.
 
Update...

In reading all the responses, I guess one thing is clear. There is average work, excellent work and perfection. I try and aim for perfection so that I can hope to get excellent results. If I get excellent work results, I'll be happy - it doesn't need to be perfect. The effort curve to go from excellent to perfect is just way too steep.

Also, I checked the hole again (BTW its VS 808PP and not VS 803PP as I posted earlier). It is designed for a 4 rivet. I had some 5 rivets and I tried them out but they "sunk too deep" in the countersink hole. I now use the piece of scrap to fine tune the countersink depth before countersinking "real parts".

In addition to the replacement parts, I did also order some assorted "oops rivets" from Van's.

Again, thanks all for the advice and incredible support.

Cheers!

NC
 
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