AP Recommendations for 10

[ppilotmike]

I am at the point now where I need to install my AP bracket/servos in the wing for roll control. I know there have been changes recently with EFIS manufacturers creating their own AP servo setups (i.e. Dynon, Garmin).

Can I get some recommendations from the group about pros/cons with going with Trutrack vs. the EFIS company's AP?

It seems that most 10s have been built with Trutracks (or at least they all seem to look like Truetracks)

 

[Mike S]

I suggest you talk to Stein about this, he is on top of the current information heap, and he has some good thoughts on the matter.

He and I had the same basic conversation last week.

 

[DFlyer]

Mike,

We (Dynon) created a custom pitch servo for the RV-10 with the help of RV-10 owners. The RV-10 roll servo is common to the 7/8/10. Contact us if you would like to learn more.

-Robert
Dynon Avionics

 

[rleffler]

There is only one major differentiator that I'm aware and not everyone agrees, that it is critical. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Many of the poplular EFIS manufacturers have developed an integrated autopilot.

Trutrak (and Trio) can integrate with many of these same EFIS vendors' products. Trutrak has specific integrations for AFS and Garmin.

The question to ask each vendor is: "Your flying in IMC. The EFIS dies. What happens to the autopilot?"

With the Trutrak, you can still manually control the AP head, and if the GPS is directly wired, it will follow the course. The benefit of the AP being independent and keeping the wings level, is that it buys you think time. In IMC, this is priceless.

My concern would be that if the EFIS should die with an integrated AP, there would be no mechanism in place to control the servos.

Granted, this is a very low probability of becoming a real risk and it's only pertinent in IMC.

There are multiple reasons you see more Trutraks in RV-10s.

1. They were the first to have a product for the RV-10
2. AFS, GRT, Garmin, Chelton, and Trutrak all recommended Trutrak APs (at least initially)
3. There was no competition from the integrated offerings until this past year.
4. Many RV-10 builders spend more on their panels.
5. Many builder's copy what's know to work well from previous builders.

 

[ppilotmike]

Bob,

Thanks. I saw you went with a TT setup, from looking at your builder's log. I definitely want functionality of the AP if the EFIS dies. My understanding is that Garmin's AP still works in this manner (i.e. G3X is down), but I'll investigate further.

Mike,

I will talk to Stein of course. It's great having someone who knows a lot about all the various systems and can still be somewhat objective with advice.

Looks like my plan to wait until the very end to decide on avionics may be harder to execute than I thought. I'd like to close the wings, but I probably need my AP in first. I can install my pitot mast, but probably want to have access to install things like heat controllers, etc. Tough choices... And here I spent all that time in forums at OSH this year. I should have spent more time in the ABCD hangars!

 

[Mike S]

I'd like to close the wings, but I probably need my AP in first.

No, the True Track aileron servo and mounting bracket are easy to install after the wing is closed. Ditto for the elevator.

Pretty sure other brands are also designed to be installed in a finished wing.

Have you run a wiring chase for the AP wires?? I would run a separate one just for the AP. Easier to access later and only ounces of weight and minimum $$.

 

[BobTurner]

Can I get some recommendations from the group about pros/cons with going with Trutrack vs. the EFIS company's AP?

Disclaimer: everyone loves their own choices!

Don't overlook Trio. If the EFIS dies the Trio can couple into the 420W and fly an LPV approach. Coupled to the GRT HX, it can do heading and a full ILS. But imho a great feature - unique to Trio as far as I know - is that I use it for pitch trim when hand flying. It is speed sensitive, driving the trim slower as the airspeed increases. I personally like the design philosophy, with having the servos out of the loop when the autopilot is off.

As Bob said above, for vfr use you cannot beat the efis autopilots. But if you want the same level of redundancy, compare a stand alone autopilot to an EFIS one plus a second air data computer. I think you'll see either option is about the same cost.

 

[ppilotmike]

Conduit for AP

Mike,

I've got holes for the conduit runs, but haven't pulled the black stuff through yet. I'm thinking I can get by with (2) conduit runs. (Strobes, navs, landing lights, heated pitot) in one, and (Auto Pilot, COM/NAV antennas) in the other. Thoughts?

 

[ppilotmike]

AP Independence

Bob,

I agree. AP independence is very important to me as well. I was reading through the very long (like 25 pages or so) thread on Garmin's G3X announcements, regarding their AP cans & can'ts. I think it will act stand alone, but I'm not sure if it will fly GPS from a back-up EFIS product unless it's a garmin. As I said, I need to learn more. It would be great to know that I could install the AP later (after closing the wings). If that's the case, I'll bide my time. My build is moving slower than anticipated anyway.

 

[Mike S]

Don't overlook Trio.

I rode with a buddy some years back, and IIRC he had a Trio in his 9.

One feature that impressed me was that the AP could do a 180* reverse course with a single button push-----and it maintained level flight while doing so.

Seems like it was a good safety option if the weather "closed in" around you.

 

[rleffler]

Mike,

I've got holes for the conduit runs, but haven't pulled the black stuff through yet. I'm thinking I can get by with (2) conduit runs. (Strobes, navs, landing lights, heated pitot) in one, and (Auto Pilot, COM/NAV antennas) in the other. Thoughts?

You've got power, RF, data, and audio lines. You want to keep the RF lines and noisy power lines (i.e strobes) away from the data and audio lines.

I've got only one conduit in the wing, but I also don't have any antenna in the wing either.

I actually have six conduits going to the back to different locations (three down each side) Basically a power, RF, and data conduit for each side. Two of the conduits got to the rear seat, the other four terminate aft of the baggage bulkhead. The plan was to keep the right and left conduits faily balanced, but that plan didn't last long.

 

[Jesse]

Both pitch and roll servo brackets and servos can be installed after the wing is closed up. I don't know if this applies to the Garmin. Wait until you are ready for avionics to decide on the AP. there will likely be new options by that time and things may appear more clear then as well. I hear of more people selling servos they never used than people complaining because they waited too long to buy the servos or make the decision.

The only avionics choice I can think of that could have been made too late would be to purchase theVP-200 before it was discontinued. Marc, I hope you're listening! we want automatic mode switching back!!!

 

[dmaib]

I suggest you talk to Stein about this, he is on top of the current information heap, and he has some good thoughts on the matter.

He and I had the same basic conversation last week.

+1 on talking to Stein.

FWIW, Bob Turner is right, everyone loves their own choice! That includes me, I love my TruTrak AP and I agree with Jesse about the VP-200. It would really bum me to build another airplane and not be able to install the VP-200!