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Alternator troubleshooting

alcladrv

Well Known Member
I cut short my most recent cross country flight in my -7A because of voltage variations I wasn't comfortable with. The voltage is read at the input to the GSU that's part of my G3X system.

The alternator has about 600 hours on it after my original Vans 60A failed at about 200 hours. I had it rebuilt with more durable components at the time and it has functioned without issues since I installed it 6 years ago.

Any thoughts and ideas on its general state of operation would be appreciated. Here's what I saw:

After start, it read a stable 14.1 volts. As the power came up for takeoff, it read 13.7. During the climb to 11,500 at full power, it varied between 13.4 to 13.9. At cruise altitude, it began to vary between 13.7 and 12.9, with occasional dips to 12.5.

After 20 minutes of flight and more readings at 12.5 than I felt comfortable with, I elected to return to home base rather comtinue another 2.5 hours to destination. It never ready below 12.5 volts.

As I continued back to home base and descended with reduced power, the voltage came up and never got below 12.9. In the final 10 minures of the descent at idle power, it read a solid 14.1 and held that all the way to touchdown.

After landing, I did a full power runup and it held steady at 14.1 until nearly full static rpm, about 2350, where it dipped to 13.9. After shutdown, the battery read 13.7 initially and slowly came down to 12.9 before I shut the master off.

My mechanic's opinion is that there's nothing wrong with it on the theory that, as the battery climbed closer to being full charged, the regulator sensed less and less voltage needed to be allowed into the battery, a PC680 that is 3 months old.

A 3 hour cross-country flight a week prior didn't show readings as low, as the voltage never got out of the 13 volt range

What do any of you think?
Also, what voltage alarm parameters do you have set on your setup?
Where do you read the voltage?

Thanks in advance,

Mike
 
After start, it read a stable 14.1 volts. As the power came up for takeoff, it read 13.7. During the climb to 11,500 at full power, it varied between 13.4 to 13.9. At cruise altitude, it began to vary between 13.7 and 12.9, with occasional dips to 12.5.

After 20 minutes of flight and more readings at 12.5 than I felt comfortable with, I elected to return to home base rather comtinue another 2.5 hours to destination. It never ready below 12.5 volts.

My mechanic's opinion is that there's nothing wrong with it on the theory that, as the battery climbed closer to being full charged, the regulator sensed less and less voltage needed to be allowed into the battery, a PC680 that is 3 months old.

A 3 hour cross-country flight a week prior didn't show readings as low, as the voltage never got out of the 13 volt range

What do any of you think?
Also, what voltage alarm parameters do you have set on your setup?
Where do you read the voltage?

Thanks in advance,

Mike

At 12.5 volts, your alternator is off line, and you are reading battery voltage. Check for a field line failure. But at 600 hours, it wouldn't hurt to take it in for a bench check.
 
No it's not "OK", your mechanics "theory" does not hold water...

Voltage ideally should be 14.1 to 14.7, when you get into the 13.5 range you will not be charging the battery, at 12.5 - 12.9 you are running off the battery with the alt dead.

Check the wiring but chances are that "high quality" alternator is on it's way out.
 
Alternator problems

Make sure to verfy that the alternator is well grounded before you test anything else. Then if the problem is still there tear it apart and have a look. I found one of the brushes were sticking in the brush pocket and all I had to do was work it some and them put my alternator back together and it ran good again.
 
Check the battery connection is tight (other connections as well). I had a loose battery connection and it behaved similarly.

Greg
 
I had very similar symptoms. I finally found a loose connection at the firewall ground screw terminal. My engine ground and battery negative connection come to this firewall terminal. The other side of the terminal is the "forest of tabs" B&C sells. I had neglected to put a star washer under the nut and it had vibrated loose. Both the battery ground and the engine ground wires could be rotated by hand. You might also make sure that the terminals are clean.

Good luck. These intermittent problems can be very frustrating.
 
Followup:

A rebuilt alternator from NAPA corrected the erratic voltage indications.

Just my datapoint. My first 60A alternator came with my FWF kit from Vans. It lasted 182 hours. I would turn it on after the engine was started.

I had a local shop rebuild it and changed my procedure to turn it on with the Master switch prior to engine start. it lasted 660 hours. We'll see if I get as good or better service with this NAPA rebuilt unit.

Mike
 
I asked for one for an 87 Suzuki, which they had in stock. The part number on my NAPA receipt is 213-8331 and the net price was 91.49. I think the warranty is 3 years, but I can't find that written anywhere.

The unit was identical to the one I removed and mounted without any issues.

Mike
 
Brushes

wear much faster on a plane due to vibration and if you fly at higher altitude. I like to fly above 8k on trips and my new brushes only lasted about 450 hours. My symptoms were similar or identical to yours. I put in new brushes, problem solved. My new plan is to replace brushes every 2 years or 250 hours. Hope this helps someone,
 
wear much faster on a plane due to vibration and if you fly at higher altitude. I like to fly above 8k on trips and my new brushes only lasted about 450 hours. My symptoms were similar or identical to yours. I put in new brushes, problem solved. My new plan is to replace brushes every 2 years or 250 hours. Hope this helps someone,

I also fly all of my cross-countries above 8000'. I've learned a lot building and operating my plane, but didn't even consider just changing the brushes on the alternator. Sounds like a good preventive maintenance procedure with good upside (less chance of surprise alternator failure) and little downside (hopefully the cost and time involved is minimal. So, please share anwers to the following questions:
How do you do it?
What do you look for?
How do I identify the part number or type of brushes?
Where can I get the brushes and at what cost?

Thanks,

Mike
 
How to replace

How do you do it?
What do you look for?
How do I identify the part number or type of brushes?
Where can I get the brushes and at what cost?

Thanks,

Mike

Get new brushes at most local alternator shops for $10-20. After you get alternator off plane, remove the screws or stud nuts that hold diode cover on. Most alternators use quite common brush assembly. If the regulator is on the alternator remove it and the brush assembly is obvious and the wires are connected internally to the metal mounting ears. Expect that the slip rings which are on the main shaft will need cleaning with medium grit sandpaper by hand. Smooth up with a couple finer grades in steps, to finish with 600 grit. Does not take long. Once you have brushes off just get matching type at the alternator shop. When brushes get half worn out they become intermittent and can kill the regulator or diodes. Nippondenso uses the same brush assembly on all their smaller alternators - 95% of the alternators found on our RVs.
 
Get new brushes at most local alternator shops for $10-20. After you get alternator off plane, remove the screws or stud nuts that hold diode cover on. Most alternators use quite common brush assembly. snipped

If you can remove the sheet steel cover off the rear of the alternator without removing it [the alternator], replacement of the brushes can be done in 15 -30 minutes. The voltage regulator and the brush pack [brushes/springs and holder] are both accessible without taking the alternator completely apart. Very easy job. I can supply photos of how this is done. Contact me via email or PM for photos.
The brush pack can also be purchased from any quality auto parts store, providing you can tell them the year, make and model of the car your alternator came off of. Actually, you are simply telling them info about a car that uses the same alternator you have on your airplane.
Charlie
 
cooling

I have a temp probe mounted on the alternator by the diodes. No cooling tube; my temps run 120 - 135 F in cruise (RV6a for those who don't read bottom section of postings). However in short taxi the slower airflow puts a lot of hot air from above cyl on that area and warms up the outside of alternator to 180f in 5 minutes or less. As has been said before, do not add blast tube if you do not have rain water trap or some hose loop type protection. The water will create more problems than the heat.
 
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