Van's Air Force
The definitive Van's Aircraft support community! Buying, building or flying an RV? Join our exclusive family of mentors and enthusiasts!
Parking Brakes
- Thread starter Moura
- Start date
ScottSchmidt
Well Known Member
Yup
They become a one way valve. So when it is engaged you just push on the brakes and it holds the pressure between the valve and piston in the caliper.
I added a Parking Brake Light to my panel that is on when the arm that controls the valve is in any position other than full open.
http://www.matcomfg.com/PARKINGBRAKEVALVE-idv-2606-8.html
They become a one way valve. So when it is engaged you just push on the brakes and it holds the pressure between the valve and piston in the caliper.
I added a Parking Brake Light to my panel that is on when the arm that controls the valve is in any position other than full open.
http://www.matcomfg.com/PARKINGBRAKEVALVE-idv-2606-8.html
ScottSchmidt
Well Known Member
Install?
In almost 700 hours of flying I have use it one time.
If I built again I may not install it.
I get into such a habit of choking the wheels as soon as I get out I never use it. The one time I did use it I was on a slope and could not keep the plane from moving and I was alone, it was great to have that one time.
In almost 700 hours of flying I have use it one time.
If I built again I may not install it.
I get into such a habit of choking the wheels as soon as I get out I never use it. The one time I did use it I was on a slope and could not keep the plane from moving and I was alone, it was great to have that one time.
Neither the RV-8A or the RV-10
that I fly have a parking brake --- many times I have wished I had one. Many parking ramps are sloped and it is a real race to exit the plane and get a chock in place ----- and, the chocks at most airports are too large for the RVs and will damage the fairings, so the line folks are not much help, except to hold the plane in place. A parking brake is a nice feature.
that I fly have a parking brake --- many times I have wished I had one. Many parking ramps are sloped and it is a real race to exit the plane and get a chock in place ----- and, the chocks at most airports are too large for the RVs and will damage the fairings, so the line folks are not much help, except to hold the plane in place. A parking brake is a nice feature.
ScottSchmidt
Well Known Member
Do it!
On many things that I was not sure on I probably went the direction that cost more or took more time. Who knows how many planes you will build in your life, you might as well have everything on it that you can dream of.
If you can picture yourself at the Lukla Airport in Nepal you will want that parking brake.
On many things that I was not sure on I probably went the direction that cost more or took more time. Who knows how many planes you will build in your life, you might as well have everything on it that you can dream of.
If you can picture yourself at the Lukla Airport in Nepal you will want that parking brake.
az_gila
Well Known Member
If you are solo...
...and at a self-service pump on a ramp with no-one around and a 25 kt wind blowing (like in the Mojave desert......) -- then you discover why they were put there...
...and at a self-service pump on a ramp with no-one around and a 25 kt wind blowing (like in the Mojave desert...
...) -- then you discover why they were put there...
tc1234c
Well Known Member
when you need it you will be glad that you have it.
Totally agree with the previous four post. In my 700+ hrs flying 9A I used my parking brake only a few times (sloped ramp and/or strong wind). However, those times I was really glad that I spent the time to put it in. I ordered the valve and the cable and in a few weeks I will put one in my 10 project. This is a small investment of money and time and one of the options worth doing.
Ted
Totally agree with the previous four post. In my 700+ hrs flying 9A I used my parking brake only a few times (sloped ramp and/or strong wind). However, those times I was really glad that I spent the time to put it in. I ordered the valve and the cable and in a few weeks I will put one in my 10 project. This is a small investment of money and time and one of the options worth doing.
Ted
Geico266
Well Known Member
...and at a self-service pump on a ramp with no-one around and a 25 kt wind blowing (like in the Mojave desert...
IMHO it should be "manditory". I wished my -10 had one. I pulled up to a side of an FBO to get out of the wind on a long CC. I could not turn around and shut the engine down. Then I found out I was on an incline and could only roll backwards. I could not get out of the plane for fear the nose wheel would come around and damage the stops and nose wheel pants. Luckily, a couple of local RV drivers saw my perdicament and came to hold the plane. I was stuck until someone came, not one of my smarter moves. A parking brake is a good add on. You might not use it all the time, but when you need it you'll be glad it is there.
Last edited:
Mike S
Senior Curmudgeon
Important reminder about parking brake.
I have also put one in my 10, but there is one thing I have not seen mentioned in this thread yet.
This unit is not for long term use, set it to hold the plane, get out and set a chock, then release the brake.
They are known to bleed off if left on too long.
I have also put one in my 10, but there is one thing I have not seen mentioned in this thread yet.
This unit is not for long term use, set it to hold the plane, get out and set a chock, then release the brake.
They are known to bleed off if left on too long.
Peeve
Always bugged me when guys set the brake on a little plane, then tie down. Never gets tied tight and one drop of fluid ooze in the brake systems eliminates the brake holding. Sean has put a brake valve in my ten and I'm glad. I too have been stuck on an incline. Once I had to back a 206 into my driveway to turn around. Felt weird.
Always bugged me when guys set the brake on a little plane, then tie down. Never gets tied tight and one drop of fluid ooze in the brake systems eliminates the brake holding. Sean has put a brake valve in my ten and I'm glad. I too have been stuck on an incline. Once I had to back a 206 into my driveway to turn around. Felt weird.
Engine start and run-up?
Please excuse my ignorance...
I follow the checklists for the Diamond DA20 I currently fly, and it has me set the parking brake during engine start and during run-up. I do not set the brake when parking. Is this not standard practice with an RV? I notice the RV-12 POH says "Brakes - HOLD" during engine start and run-up. I guess if you have no parking brake that's what you do.
Please excuse my ignorance...
I follow the checklists for the Diamond DA20 I currently fly, and it has me set the parking brake during engine start and during run-up. I do not set the brake when parking. Is this not standard practice with an RV? I notice the RV-12 POH says "Brakes - HOLD" during engine start and run-up. I guess if you have no parking brake that's what you do.
Last edited:
rleffler
Well Known Member
The parking brake is typically used when you initially shutdown and are getting out of the aircraft until you can properly place chocks. You don't want to have the brake engaged for long periods of time.
As for starting and run ups, most folks just keep their feet on the brake.
bob
flion
Well Known Member
I don't think I'd trust a parking brake for engine start and run up, especially if it leads the pilot to not have his feet on the brakes before and during. Part of my pre-start procedure has always been to test the brake pedals; if a pedal mushed I wouldn't try to start. That's no guarantee the brakes operate but I think it's better than relying on a parking brake.
tc1234c
Well Known Member
release parking brake
I don't know what experience you guys have with your parking brake. To set the parking brake you press on the brake paddles before closing the parking brake valve. To release it, I always have to open the valve and tap on the brake paddles. Otherwise, the brakes are still locked.
I don't know what experience you guys have with your parking brake. To set the parking brake you press on the brake paddles before closing the parking brake valve. To release it, I always have to open the valve and tap on the brake paddles. Otherwise, the brakes are still locked.
Phil
Well Known Member
Whatcha-ma-call-it
On the topic (but also slightly off), I ordered the Matco PVPV-D parking brake.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/lgpages/matcoPBVALVE.php
I also ordered the push-pull cable to operate it. But what I forgot to order was the adapter that attaches the push-pull cable to the valve arm. I don't know the name of it, so I don't know what to look for or buy.
I'm guessing it's a device that's made to rotate in the .193" hole. But also has a smaller hole that you can run the push-pull cable through and tighten it down with a set screw....
What's the name of it? I need to get one in the inventory before I get to the brakes.....
Phil
On the topic (but also slightly off), I ordered the Matco PVPV-D parking brake.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/lgpages/matcoPBVALVE.php
I also ordered the push-pull cable to operate it. But what I forgot to order was the adapter that attaches the push-pull cable to the valve arm. I don't know the name of it, so I don't know what to look for or buy.
I'm guessing it's a device that's made to rotate in the .193" hole. But also has a smaller hole that you can run the push-pull cable through and tighten it down with a set screw....
What's the name of it? I need to get one in the inventory before I get to the brakes.....
Phil
David Shelton
Well Known Member
I use the parking brake all the time for short stops (fueling, picking up passengers, etc.) However, I don't trust the brake for longer stops because a hydraulic leak could allow the airplane to roll away.
There was only one time that I didn't appreciate the parking brake and that was on an old rental airplane. I was picking up a date and decided to set the parking brake. A few minutes later, the engine was running... and I couldn't get the brakes off. After kicking the pedals a few times, one wheel started rolling and we began pivoting around the other. At this point, my date began to get nervous and suggested we do the flight another time.
There was only one time that I didn't appreciate the parking brake and that was on an old rental airplane. I was picking up a date and decided to set the parking brake. A few minutes later, the engine was running... and I couldn't get the brakes off. After kicking the pedals a few times, one wheel started rolling and we began pivoting around the other. At this point, my date began to get nervous and suggested we do the flight another time.
ColoCardinal
Well Known Member
parking brake valve
The parking brake valve has an arrow embossed on it and the word "flow". I'm assuming that the flow would be towards the pedals. IE: The flow when the brakes are set would be back towards the pedals. Is that correct?
The parking brake valve has an arrow embossed on it and the word "flow". I'm assuming that the flow would be towards the pedals. IE: The flow when the brakes are set would be back towards the pedals. Is that correct?
ColoCardinal
Well Known Member
I believe the flow is from the master cylinder to the brake caliper, thus from the pedals to the parking brake valve to the wheels. When you press the pedals the fluid flow through the valve and you close the valve to hold the pressure.
Thanks Ted. Here's what I had been thinking: when you close the valve and take your feet off of the pedals, the flow is now in the opposite direction, back towards the pedals. Isn't that the flow which you are now holding?
Thanks Ted. Here's what I had been thinking: when you close the valve and take your feet off of the pedals, the flow is now in the opposite direction, back towards the pedals. Isn't that the flow which you are now holding?
I am at a decision point of which brake should I add to my finishing kit. Grove and Beringer are my options. Beringer have a park brakes option, however Grove does not as far as I know. My question is can a parking brakes valve (or whatever it takes) be installed with Grove brakes?
Good info, thanks.
Auburntsts
Well Known Member
I too have the MATCO parking brake with Grove brakes. I’ve used it exactly once in 8 years and that was a test.
When you close the valve and remove your feet there is no flow. Pressure is equal in both directions.
vinzer
Well Known Member
I installed parking brake during my airplane built and have only used it once since then (<100hours).
At the very beginning I decided to test it and left it pulled (brake ON) overnight. In the morning I found that my parking brake bleed overnight. So this is definitely not a long term solution for me. I use wheel chokes since then
At the very beginning I decided to test it and left it pulled (brake ON) overnight. In the morning I found that my parking brake bleed overnight. So this is definitely not a long term solution for me. I use wheel chokes since then
Parking brake available
I have one of these available if you want. 100 bucks shipping included CONUS.
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/lgpages/matcoPBVALVE.php
I will PM you
I have one of these available if you want. 100 bucks shipping included CONUS.
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/lgpages/matcoPBVALVE.php
I will PM you
I have installed one in each of my airplanes - and did one for my -10, although I haven't used it yet (not quite yet done building...).
The issue posted earlier where the brake fluid leaked could occur if you set your parking brake in the cool morning and then it got hot in the afternoon as the brake system is a locked hydraulic system with the parking brake set (valve shut) and something's going to give as the fluid heats up. However, that would be take a significant temperature transition to make happen.
At my home airport, it's not uncommon to have winds 25G35 and the airplane will roll if you just get out prior to setting chocks. It effectively acts as a second person to hold the brakes while set chocks.
I find it invaluable for stopping on a ramp that has some angle to it, fuel stops or loading passengers where setting chocks to keep the aircraft from rolling is an avoided hassle.
However, I only use mine for short periods. Even so, it's a low cost feature I recommend installing during the build, that would be more difficult to retrofit later.
The issue posted earlier where the brake fluid leaked could occur if you set your parking brake in the cool morning and then it got hot in the afternoon as the brake system is a locked hydraulic system with the parking brake set (valve shut) and something's going to give as the fluid heats up. However, that would be take a significant temperature transition to make happen.
At my home airport, it's not uncommon to have winds 25G35 and the airplane will roll if you just get out prior to setting chocks. It effectively acts as a second person to hold the brakes while set chocks.
I find it invaluable for stopping on a ramp that has some angle to it, fuel stops or loading passengers where setting chocks to keep the aircraft from rolling is an avoided hassle.
However, I only use mine for short periods. Even so, it's a low cost feature I recommend installing during the build, that would be more difficult to retrofit later.
I bought my -10 about 15 months ago and it was built with no parking brake. I generally don't miss it but there was one incident (on my solo ferry flight right after I bought it) where I had to park at 90 degrees to a 22G29 wind at Lancaster (KWJF) to refuel where it would have been extremely helpful. I landed up having to call someone from airport ops to help hold the plane from pivoting into the fuel station while I got the tow bar out and pulled it into the wind.
I realized that was a rookie mistake by someone new to a plane with a free castering nose wheel. I now generally try very hard to park with the nose into the wind or at least park in a fashion that a wind-induced pivot won't cause damage!
That having been said, as a NBO with a plane with no parking brake, I would strongly agree with @rongawer that you should install it during the build (for the reasons he mentions) if it is relatively low cost from a $, effort and weight perspective.
I realized that was a rookie mistake by someone new to a plane with a free castering nose wheel. I now generally try very hard to park with the nose into the wind or at least park in a fashion that a wind-induced pivot won't cause damage!
That having been said, as a NBO with a plane with no parking brake, I would strongly agree with @rongawer that you should install it during the build (for the reasons he mentions) if it is relatively low cost from a $, effort and weight perspective.
I would install, easy process, low weight option.
They work by closing the fluid return line, thus holding hyd pressure to brake pucks.
But... after landing I would set the parking park brake, then climb out of aircraft and chock the main wheels (2x) and climb back in to release PB pressure.
Two reasons, temp changes can affect total P in that short hyd line; it may increase P or decrease P; but more so if line service needs to move your aircraft they cannot without interior access. (that will cost ya a beer)
Pre-flight - Climb in, set P brake, climb out remove chocks during walk around, do all engine start, pre taxi items, then release PB for taxi.
If you think you would look silly chasing a slow rolling 2500# aircraft across the ramp, imaging a 40,700# bird headed toward something not very forgiving.
My hangar has an inclined ramp, I use my parking brake almost every flight.
Make sure you have a checklist item to release the parking brake on startup.
If you forget to release the brake after startup, if it has been a few hours, the brake holding pressure will have bled down.......until.....you press the brakes again for taxi and they will lock up, or in my case pressing only one brake pedal, lock up on one tire and around and around you go....
Make sure you have a checklist item to release the parking brake on startup.
If you forget to release the brake after startup, if it has been a few hours, the brake holding pressure will have bled down.......until.....you press the brakes again for taxi and they will lock up, or in my case pressing only one brake pedal, lock up on one tire and around and around you go....
Hey! Sorry to resurrect this old thread but I think it might be rather fitting. I was looking into the kit prices and I see that the Parking brake upgrade is around 700$ when configuring the RV-10 brakes. Does anyone know whats the content of this option? It surely cant be the parking brake valve as shown in post #34?
I tend to go with the stock (grove brakes) and then add the Matco manual parking brake to it.
I tend to go with the stock (grove brakes) and then add the Matco manual parking brake to it.
All of the posts regarding parking brakes are on Nose wheel models. Do they make them for Tail draggers? There's been a couple of times I wish I had had a parking brake on the RV-8. Often on busy days at my controlled airfield, you're sitting holding short like #7 in line and a parking brake would be nice to not have my calves go into spasms.
There is also one particular field a group of us go for breakfast that has a super inclined ramp. Normally, we get one of the passengers to jump out and chock the planes, but without that one day, I almost had to go running to chase my plane down when I hopped out as it took off rolling.
There is also one particular field a group of us go for breakfast that has a super inclined ramp. Normally, we get one of the passengers to jump out and chock the planes, but without that one day, I almost had to go running to chase my plane down when I hopped out as it took off rolling.
Hey Notso,
I don’t have one on my 8, but am adding it to my 10. I don’t see any reason your tail dragger couldn’t add one, it simply holds pressure to the brakes, same as your aching calves! Be glad to show you the setup sometime, but the 10 is still in my garage, not out at the hangar.
Papa
I installed the Matco parking brake on my RV-8 available from ACS. It was a simple modification, I mounted it between the AN fittings that secure in the F-866D Mounting Plate and the F-8105 Brake Hose. I fabricated a mount for it out of some spare angle stock. The hardest part was deciding where to put the control knob. In my case, I decided to put it on the aft bulkhead of the left LG Box, just ahead of the throttle quadrant.
I put a Matco parking brake in my RV7. I don't use it much, but as others have said, it's invaluable when you park in windy conditions or a ramp with a slope. Personally, I agree that a guy shouldn't tie down a plane and walk away with the parking brake on. I carry my own low profile chocks that fit under my wheel pants for that reason.
Because mine is a taildragger, I also installed a micro switch that throws a CAs message whenever the brake is on.
A work of caution. Somebody a few posts up (and a couple of years ago) mentioned using the parking brake for runup or in a long taxi line like they would do on a certified plane. If you have the common Matco setup you need to at think about the fact that it's a simple on/off ball valve, not a check valve.
When you push on the pedals and then set the brake, it locks fluid flow in the brake lines, but it also prevents you from pushing more in there. If you power up for a runup and the plane starts to creep, pushing harder on the pedals isn't going to do anything unless you first move the brake to off and open up those valves.
Because mine is a taildragger, I also installed a micro switch that throws a CAs message whenever the brake is on.
A work of caution. Somebody a few posts up (and a couple of years ago) mentioned using the parking brake for runup or in a long taxi line like they would do on a certified plane. If you have the common Matco setup you need to at think about the fact that it's a simple on/off ball valve, not a check valve.
When you push on the pedals and then set the brake, it locks fluid flow in the brake lines, but it also prevents you from pushing more in there. If you power up for a runup and the plane starts to creep, pushing harder on the pedals isn't going to do anything unless you first move the brake to off and open up those valves.
Last edited:
I think this is not fully correct as the Matco Valve includes a Check valve. According to their website:
"The PVPV-D works as a dual system resettable check valve. When the lever is moved to the closed position, fluid can flow to the brake but not return. The lever may be positioned prior to pressure being applied or when pressure is applied. "
So you can close the valve, and push the pedals to increase the brake pressure.
Thats great if they've upgraded their valve, but I can tell you with 100% certainly that this is not the case with the older style PV-1 valve which is the one that I have. I know that because I bought it here on VAF and took it apart to put new O-rings in.
Thanks for clarifying.
This is the RV-10 subforum. But nobody seems to pay attention to that.
Papa, yeah - I'd like to see it sometime. Have you been flying the -8 much?
Very Nice! I might copy that exactly. Thanks!
