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Old 11-08-2018, 08:03 AM
marked marked is offline
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Atlanta, ga
Posts: 5
Default Moving a plane into a Mode C Veil, cheapest solution for Transponder and ADS-B

I'm buying my first plane and I have found a plane I like, but it is located in an area where it has never needed a transponder. Full disclosure it is experimental, but not an RV. I am just posting here because 90% of the valuable information Google finds me on experimentals (especially avionics) is from this forum.

My question is, if I do the install, what is the cheapest solution for a transponder and ADS-B on a plane that never had either?
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Old 11-08-2018, 08:06 AM
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bkervaski bkervaski is offline
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Birmingham, Alabama
Posts: 1,867

Congrats on your purchase! Pics?

Be cautious of going "cheap".

There's a lot of spin ups trying to take advantage of the ADS-B deadline creating a lot of competition. A lot of these companies will go out of business or stop selling their ADS-B solution because all the competition will make it impossible for some to profit.

It's already happened to a few, search for "NAVWORX".

You don't want to find yourself buying another transponder, buying two is certainly not the cheapest solution.
RV-14A #140376
N196 (Flying)
2019 Bronze Lindy

Last edited by bkervaski : 11-08-2018 at 08:15 AM.
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Old 11-08-2018, 08:26 AM
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Mel Mel is offline
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dallas area
Posts: 11,223

I agree with bkervaski. Cheap is not always economical. Do your research.

I went with Trig. I've had Trig in 2 airplanes over quite a few years and very happy with their system.

Complete ADS-B out including TT22 (Mode S transponder), TN72 (ADS-B compliant GPS), and TA70 (GPS antenna). All for about $2400.
Mel Asberry, DAR since the last century. Over 1,000 certifications accomplished. Discount for Veterans, Law Enforcement, Fire Fighters.
EAA Flight Advisor/Tech Counselor, Friend of the RV-1
Recipient of Tony Bingelis Award and Wright Brothers Master Pilot Award
USAF Vet, High School E-LSA Project Mentor.
RV-6 Flying since 1993 (sold)

Last edited by Mel : 11-08-2018 at 08:33 AM.
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Old 11-08-2018, 08:36 AM
marked marked is offline
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Atlanta, ga
Posts: 5

Originally Posted by bkervaski View Post
Congrats on your purchase! Pics?

Be cautious of going "cheap".

It's already happened to a few, search for "NAVWORX".

You don't want to find yourself buying another transponder, buying two is certainly not the cheapest solution.
Generally, I am but I am looking at a sub $15k plane, and I don't want to put $5k in avionics in it just to be able to fly.

Not having to do this twice is exactly why I am asking, part of me wants to just install a $250 used transponder and encoder to last a year, and then add a UAT next year. But I want to know that there are not better options. You RV guys tend to find the best mix of budget and quality that I have seen, so I presumed that this has been discussed a bit. I did find some good information in searches but some references to the Trig T22 (which I had not heard about) in a thread about the echoUAT lead me to create my own thread. I want to make sure that I haven't overlooked an option because I don't know what to ask.
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Old 11-08-2018, 08:54 AM
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GalinHdz GalinHdz is offline
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: KSGJ / TJBQ
Posts: 2,279

In the long run "Cheap" will wind up being very expensive. That being said, your best option will depend on what you currently have installed in your panel and what your eventual "mission" will be with the airplane. IOW more information is needed before options can be discussed but it sounds like you will require a transponder at the bare minimum.

Something like this transponder with ADS-B OUT and built in GPS.

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Last edited by GalinHdz : 11-08-2018 at 09:00 AM.
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Old 11-08-2018, 08:56 AM
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10builder 10builder is offline
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Location: Nashville, TN
Posts: 147
Default Economical vs. Cheap

Without knowing the rest of your panel setup it's challenging to present all of the numerous options, and thinking short term rather than what you want your panel to look like in 5 years could end up costing you more. FWIW, I'm going simple VFR (Mini-X) and chose to control a remote Sandia transponder (STX-165R) and using the uAvionix Echo UAT/GRT Safe-fly GPS package. My goal was a simple, uncluttered panel - but your goal may be totally different.
Brian S.
Arrington, TN
SPA Panther N87XP
RV-10 N104BS (Sold)
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Old 11-08-2018, 09:07 AM
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rocketbob rocketbob is offline
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 8I3
Posts: 3,763

In my opinion the Trig TT22 ADS-B bundle is the best, least costly 1090ES option.

I've done a few 978-out installs and find traffic with those devices spotty at low altitude, well away from a ground station. I've seen too many mode-C targets fly right past me and nothing show on ADS-B, but an old Zaon picks it up.

1090ES does not have this issue since its an extended squitter mode-S transmission so dual-band ADSB receivers will pick up the traffic, without relying on a rebroadcast from a ground station. Assuming the traffic near you is also 1090ES. At least maybe they'd see you and you not see them, if properly equipped.

You can get ADS-B in with an inexpensive receiver, such as a Stratux, which also gets you a perfectly usable backup AHRS to display attitude on an iPad.

If you can accept the drawbacks of UAT and are ok with spotty traffic due to drawbacks of the system design, then you go with a cheap used transponder now and add a uAvionix EchoUAT, and also get ADSB-IN traffic/wx and not have to get an external IN box.

The other option is a cheap transponder then add a GDL-82. I consider the GDL-82 simply as a compliance box.

Please don't PM me! Email only!

Bob Japundza CFI A&PIA
N9187P PA-24-260B Comanche, flying
N678X F1 Rocket, under const.
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Old 11-08-2018, 09:11 AM
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RV6_flyer RV6_flyer is offline
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: NC25
Posts: 3,763

Others have mentioned the Trig and I agree it is a good value.

I am planning on using the Appareo-Stratus as I feel it is the BEST for my RV-6. Everything in ONE box. Easier for me to retrofit into a flying airplane. I will either buy from Stein or RST sometime in the next few months.

I plan to abandon my Grey Code encoder and use the serial port from my Garmin G5 as my altitude source.
Gary A. Sobek
NC25 RV-6
3,400+ hours
Where is N157GS
Building RV-8 S/N: 80012

To most people, the sky is the limit.
To those who love aviation, the sky is home.
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Old 11-08-2018, 09:14 AM
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Mike S Mike S is offline
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Location: Dayton Airpark, NV A34
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Default Welcome to VAF, and Congratulations

Originally Posted by marked View Post
I'm buying my first plane
Mark, welcome aboard the good ship VAF

Congrats on the plane-----enjoy it.
Mike Starkey
VAF 909

Rv-10, N210LM.

Flying as of 12/4/2010

Phase 1 done, 2/4/2011

Sold after 240+ wonderful hours of flight.

"Flying the airplane is more important than radioing your plight to a person on the ground incapable of understanding or doing anything about it."
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Old 11-08-2018, 09:32 AM
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Toobuilder Toobuilder is offline
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Location: Mojave
Posts: 4,841

I understand that using 1090ES (vs UAT) takes the "anonymous" option off the table. That's a consideration for some of us.
WARNING! Incorrect design and/or fabrication of aircraft and/or components may result in injury or death. Information presented in this post is based on my own experience - Reader has sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for use.

Michael Robinson
Harmon Rocket II -SDS EFI
1940 Taylorcraft BL-65
1984 L39C
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