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  #1  
Old 11-27-2017, 03:05 PM
byastremski's Avatar
byastremski byastremski is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 3
Default Sub in a cherry for standard rivet?

Hey Guys and Gals,
I am new to building and have a quick question about subbing in a cherry rivet for an standard flush. If this topic has already been in a post let me know and I will have this one removed.

I am about to prime and rivet my HS and a useful trick has been mentioned and I would like to know its validity. Is it common practice to substitute a standard flush rivet for a pulled rivet in these tight spaces where a standard slim bucking bar even has a hard time getting to? I have seen/heard of a few tricks for these locations, but feel a pulled rivet will have the least likelihood of me causing damage. I understand there will be a small amount of filler/sanding required to clean up the head of the pulled rivet to keep my skin looking smooth. I inserted a few pictures of where it might come in handy. Like I said, I am only priming my HS and have not yet even looked too far ahead. Just circled a few parts on the plans that look a tad...snug.

Thought?

Thank you.



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  #2  
Old 11-27-2017, 04:07 PM
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wirejock wirejock is offline
 
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Location: Estes Park, CO
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Default Substitute rivet

okIf memory serves, there is a note somewhere to allow a substitute pull rivet in the last two skin holes on the rudder and elevators where it gets really tight. MK-319-BS
I don't see it needed on the HS and VS.
There are tricks to setting rivets in those tight spots.
1. No hole squeezer hoke.
2. Lay the part down on a back rivet plate. Use a big flat blade screwdriver as the drive by placing the flat blade on the rivet and driving on the screwdriver as close as possible with the gun.
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Estes Park, CO
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Donated 01/01/2021, plus a little extra.
RV-7A #73391, N511RV reserved (2,000+ hours)
Empennage, wings, fuse, finishing kit, now FWF
Disclaimer
I cannot be, nor will I be, held responsible if you try to do the same things I do and it does not work and/or causes you loss, injury, or even death in the process.

Last edited by wirejock : 11-27-2017 at 04:33 PM.
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  #3  
Old 11-27-2017, 04:21 PM
Kyle Boatright Kyle Boatright is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 4,671
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by byastremski View Post
Hey Guys and Gals,
I am new to building and have a quick question about subbing in a cherry rivet for an standard flush. If this topic has already been in a post let me know and I will have this one removed.

Thought?

Thank you.
You don't need a cherry rivet there. A Mk319BS (sold by Van's) will do fine there. You will have to enlarge the hole from 3/32 to 7/64, if I remember.

Simple, easy, fast.

Put a dab of filler in the mandrel hole when you paint and the pop rivet will be invisible.
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  #4  
Old 11-27-2017, 05:15 PM
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byastremski byastremski is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 3
Default

Quote:
2. Lay the part down on a back rivet plate. Use a big flat blade screwdriver as the drive by placing the flat blade on the rivet and driving on the screwdriver as close as possible with the gun.
This is one of the suggestions that I have heard of before. A fellow builder who has a -8 has mentioned having to do something very similar to this. Seems a bit.... sketchy to me (all part of the build process I guess). I feel I would work harden the rivet or some such thing while doing it. Using the MK319BS just feels safer to me

I will see if I can find that note you mentioned.

Thanks for the help.
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  #5  
Old 11-27-2017, 06:04 PM
Aluminum Aluminum is offline
 
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Location: San Jose, CA
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Default

I just went through a similar decision for the four bottom rivets on the -14A rudder horn. I did make a small bucking block to fit inside (cutting tungsten is fun) but couldn't get a decent shop head with the silly thing squirreling sideways no matter how I tried to hold it.

I checked with Van's and the response was it's safe to substitute with Cherry CR-3213-4-? of the proper length in this area.

You should check with mothership for every such situation to make sure it still meets design loads after fastener substitution.
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  #6  
Old 11-27-2017, 06:08 PM
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wirejock wirejock is offline
 
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Default Pull rivet

Quote:
Originally Posted by byastremski View Post
This is one of the suggestions that I have heard of before. A fellow builder who has a -8 has mentioned having to do something very similar to this. Seems a bit.... sketchy to me (all part of the build process I guess). I feel I would work harden the rivet or some such thing while doing it. Using the MK319BS just feels safer to me

I will see if I can find that note you mentioned.

Thanks for the help.
Use the pull rivet. I did. I filled the hole with JB weld then sliced it off clean with a razor.
The tip is for future when you have no other option. I have also taped my tungsten to a flat piece of steel to give it mass. The point is to always ask and think outside the box.
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Estes Park, CO
wirejock at yahoo dot com
Donated 01/01/2021, plus a little extra.
RV-7A #73391, N511RV reserved (2,000+ hours)
Empennage, wings, fuse, finishing kit, now FWF
Disclaimer
I cannot be, nor will I be, held responsible if you try to do the same things I do and it does not work and/or causes you loss, injury, or even death in the process.
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  #7  
Old 11-27-2017, 06:12 PM
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jcarne jcarne is offline
 
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Location: Worland, Wyoming
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Default

I put MK-319-BS rivets on the rudder and elevators. However, the HS and VS needed a no hole yolk in the squeezer. I'm only on the wings right now and have had to use the no hole yolk multiple times, worth buying.
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  #8  
Old 11-27-2017, 06:29 PM
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byastremski byastremski is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcarne View Post
I put MK-319-BS rivets on the rudder and elevators. However, the HS and VS needed a no hole yolk in the squeezer. I'm only on the wings right now and have had to use the no hole yolk multiple times, worth buying.
I picked up a no hole yolk from Cleaveland Tools when I ordered their pneumatic squeezer. That will be my first go to tool. After that, I will check my options/tips/tricks and see what ones work for the situation, and still fall into proper build spec with Van's
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  #9  
Old 11-27-2017, 08:54 PM
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vernon smith vernon smith is offline
 
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Cleveland search box does not seem to recognize "no hole yoke"?
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  #10  
Old 11-27-2017, 09:23 PM
KatanaPilot KatanaPilot is offline
 
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http://www.cleavelandtool.com/4-Thin.../#.WhzWNus76K0
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