Kids and Aerobatics

[catmandu]

Originally Posted by Whitman

Sorry to thread hijack but what have you and others found to be ?best practices? for carrying kids? I took my 6 month old up this weekend and her mother held her like she would in a commercial plane but it occurred to me that I didn?t research the topic firsthand. Any tips or suggestions? I have thick skin.

No judgement here. Understand the risk, and accept it, or not. There is relatively little difference in deceleration considerations between an RV and an airliner when you have a lap child. There are other potential differences (ease of egress, for example). For a car-seat eligible child in a four seat airplane, I would put them in the back with an adult to care for them.

[F1R]

Originally Posted by Whitman

Sorry to thread hijack but what have you and others found to be “best practices” for carrying kids? I took my 6 month old up this weekend and her mother held her like she would in a commercial plane but it occurred to me that I didn’t research the topic firsthand. Any tips or suggestions? I have thick skin.

Ear muffs and / or a very quiet cockpit. Apart from nose protection, infants have very tiny ear canals and may suffer great pain from altitude induced pressure changes if blocked. That's why infants cry so distressed on airliners.

[sailvi767]

As mentioned flying can be very painful for infants. They have no understanding of the concept of clearing their ears and tiny canals. This often leads to ear blocks.
G

[mulde35d]

Alright folks, I am not talking about doing full aerobatic routines to 6g?s with a small child on board. But I am also sure I am not the first one who wants to do a loop or roll with a child (just check YouTube). What I am advocating for is methods to do some basic low risk maneuvers while meeting the federal aviation regulation and actually adding some level of safety beyond wearing a chute and not knowing how to use it effectively. Based on the low number of actual ideas other than ?don?t?, I have to assume everyone who has done a roll with a kid simply did so in violation of the FAR?s and therefore is not responding.

I appreciate the example of the injuries from the skydivers as it drives home the point that exiting an aircraft under parachute is absolutely difficult and dangerous, but I bet if the jumpers were leaving a crippled aircraft and only suffered broken bones then they would be pretty happy to be alive when they landed. Nobody would advocate to try this type of jump intentionally, but to say a loop is too dangerous to do with a child on board is in my opinion the same as stating kids should never fly in experimental aircraft because it is ?too dangerous?.

Of note, part 91 of the FARs has some requirements for car seats. I am traveling and don?t have the number, but it is in there.

[airguy]

Originally Posted by mulde35d

Based on the low number of actual ideas other than ?don?t?, I have to assume everyone who has done a roll with a kid simply did so in violation of the FAR?s and therefore is not responding.

Now you've got the core of it. Doing it is one thing - advertising it is another.

[N941WR]

Originally Posted by airguy

Now you've got the core of it. Doing it is one thing - advertising it is another.

Ding, ding, ding...

I believe we have a winner!

[N941WR]

As for giving kids a ride, my son's first ride was at 12 weeks old, strapped to my wife's chest. He wore sunglasses and earmuffs designed for kids. I believe they were made by Peltor.

Later on, I added tiedown rings in the baggage compartment and snapped his baby bucket back there. Surounded by soft sided luggage, when we were traveling.

As he grew, he transitioned to a booster seat held in place by an airline seatbelt. That worked great until he out grew it and started kicking the back of my seat.

Now, he and I fly places on weekends and leave Mom at home.

The issue is dealing with insurance, not the FAA. If we had an accident, the insurance company would have only covered two of us and they might have found a reason not to cover that much.

You roll the dice and take your chances.

[N941WR]

Regarding BRS systems and acro, they don't seem to be designed to be deployed when the aircraft is in unusual attitudes and/or at high speeds.

If you are doing acro and get out of control with the nose down and pop the chute, there is a good chance it will rip off. Also, it you have a structural failure and the plane is spinning at an high rate, there is a good chance it will get tangled up in the fuselage. (I know there is s video of a Rans that pulled its chute after a wing failure but it is both lighter and slower than an RV.)

For the Cirrus SR22 G6 the maximum parachute deployment speed is only 140 knots.

[gmcjetpilot]

Read all the replies. It is your plane and offspring. However I'd wait until they are 6 and just go flying for fun... no aerobatics... and gently work up to it. That is my take.

Have people done loops and rolls with passengers and no chute? Ahaaaa look at internet. I am sure you will find incriminating evidence. As a CFI I could do spins with students, sans chute for a rating. The only rating that requires spins is the CFI rating, 3 left, 3 right. However we had a C152 acrobat and chutes... so those were put on. Some pvt pilot students wanted to do spins. Of course while all decked out we did some basic aerobatic maneuvers...

[F1R]

https://youtu.be/pSWDW18ygaw

https://youtu.be/QQyL5L5OTFA?t=17


Will she grow up to be a pilot or a rock star?