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  #11  
Old 02-05-2021, 11:15 AM
Ralph Inkster Ralph Inkster is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 1,250
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Have you guys got the SDS Dash (data downloader) from Ross? Invaluable for tuning for the right AFR ranges.
What ever O2 sensor unit you have installed, be sure it's data is uploading to the SDS module. It doesn't directly affect the mapping parameters, but is downloadable to the SDS Dash on your laptop. You want to see the AFR trend reactions to the various sensor inputs as they happen.

Tuning by EGT/CHT is like going target shooting with the wrong pair of glasses on.

Toobuilder - the SDS Dash graphical presentation would highlight the map parameter that's causing that ragged transition real quick.
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built a few RVs, rebuilt a few more, hot rodded more, & maintained/updated a big bunch more

Last edited by Ralph Inkster : 02-05-2021 at 11:37 AM.
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  #12  
Old 02-05-2021, 01:40 PM
jclemens jclemens is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: FL
Posts: 21
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I have the SDS logger, but I stopped using it. I fed the 0-5v from the ballenger unit to my G3x that logs every parameter at all times. It is much easier to manipulate that the SDS Logger. Click the link and see: https://apps.savvyaviation.com/fligh...5-fbc984599b88
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  #13  
Old 02-06-2021, 06:15 AM
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Toobuilder Toobuilder is offline
 
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Location: Mojave
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Ralph - I'd very much like the 02 to work but to date the best I can get is a reading at idle - as soon as I advance the throttle to TO power the display either shows a fault, or zeros. I have the bung at 11:00 oclock, its well upstream of the end of the pipe, and several inches downstream of the 3-1 merge. I have tried 2 different Bosch sensors and 2 different controllers (both 14 point 7).

Dave Anders suggests that he had the same issues at first and it was traced to a leaky slip joint upstream of the bung.

I do have the data logger but I have yet to plug it in, figuring that the O2 is not tracking there either. Can it show a fault on the SDS display but still log properly in the ECU?
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WARNING! Incorrect design and/or fabrication of aircraft and/or components may result in injury or death. Information presented in this post is based on my own experience - Reader has sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for use.

Michael Robinson
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Harmon Rocket II -SDS EFI
RV-8 - SDS CPI
1940 Taylorcraft BL-65
1984 L39C
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  #14  
Old 02-06-2021, 11:46 AM
Ralph Inkster Ralph Inkster is offline
 
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Location: Calgary, Alberta
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Michael- try in the setup prompts to change the O2 type, maybe another choice may play nicer with your O2 sensor pkg. Another possibility might be in the advance settings where you can set the 0 - 5 volt scale and afr range. Ross talked about this in the SDS 2020 thread (can't find it right now).

I originally had an AEM O2 sensor pkg and found it would show a display error on the SDS controller sporadically. I think I was getting AFR spikes beyond the 9:1 to 19:1 scale (probably caused by my Acc-pump Lo & Hi settings) that would result in display errors. I can go to my #1 display screen on the SDS and than touch the +10 button to reset or clear the error messages.
Even with the error messages, I could still export the O2 data to my laptop running the SDS Dash datalogger. I am now using the Bellenger O2 pkg and rely on it's AFR display for visual monitoring, but still wire it's output to the SDS so I can us it's data for the SDS Dash datalogger.

Jclemens- I prefer the AFR information going to the SDS & SDS Dash data logger because it pairs up the specific sensor inputs that calculate the fuel map all together, you get a perfect time line match with the O2 sensor and see what fuel map setting (AT, TPS, RPM, MAP, TEMP) is causing a jump in the AFR at that specific moment.
Your map seems to place much more emphasis on MAP values & changes compared to my setup. My fuel map places more emphasis on RPM/FUEL as a base and have MAP (& the other sensors) react in a less dramatic way, less AFR swing.
I looked over your datalog file and really couldn't pull any useful conclusions as there were climbs, descents, rpm & assumed power changes during the flight.
My procedure for a fuel mapping test flight would be to climb out to a specific altitude and set a specific rpm/power setting, say 2200, hold it there for a couple minutes, change rpm to 2300, again hold for a couple minutes & work up the rpm scale, all flying consistently so flight parameters don't change. Note I have fixed pitch so test process is simpler than would be useful with a C/A prop setup. Than I'd repeat whole process at a couple thousand ft higher. I would also set up climbs a varying speeds (different engine loading) & hold constant climb to get data from those flight conditions. The data log file will show each test segment and how the sensors are affecting the fuel map at that point and it's resulting AFR.
You could set rpm and move up the scale of throttle/map, holding for a few minutes each. Than up the rpm by 100 and repeat the throttle/map scale, repeat these sequences up as high as you want. This would give you a clear picture how your fuel map settings are working as they affect the AFR at each point.
Sorry for being long winded on this, just trying to possibly save you some of the folly I went thru.
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Last edited by Ralph Inkster : 02-06-2021 at 02:57 PM.
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  #15  
Old 02-07-2021, 07:11 AM
jclemens jclemens is offline
 
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I had poor results with the 14point7 controller, the Ballenger unit has been flawless so far. My AFR data is going to the SDS as well as the G3X. I can data log it with SDS Dash and have done so, but the information in the G3x data log contains all the info I need and more. The only things I can't see in it are AT, TPS, and Ignition. None of those are things that I am looking to change. I use the same procedure when the test flight card has "collect AFR data" on it, the flight you looked at was stability tests (still in phase one). Here is a flight that has an RPM/AFR data collection portion:

https://apps.savvyaviation.com/fligh...9-7823375a295f

My SDS map has only been modified from the one that Ross provided initially in the RPM fuel section, the start values, and the timing. The MAP values are unchanged. Right now I am very happy with the values we are currently using, the engine runs flawlessly, has great power, and temps are under control. I did read Ross's post about being able to adjust the AFR offset in the advanced setting and meant to look into that. That's the other reason I am not using SDS Dash to log, the AFR on the SDS is off from the display on the ballenger unit and my G3x matches it perfectly. Since the Ballenger unit has a calibration function and they claim to be the benchmark for accuracy I want to use this number for tuning.
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  #16  
Old 02-07-2021, 09:45 AM
Ralph Inkster Ralph Inkster is offline
 
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Location: Calgary, Alberta
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Well, sounds like you have a process & plan. Good luck with it.
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  #17  
Old 03-31-2021, 11:35 PM
longez360 longez360 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 24
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I run a http://www.techedge.com.au/ AFR system with data logging on my Lyc 360 powered Long EZ. Extremely happy with it. Have found that it is better to break the rule of distance from the exhaust port if it ensures min distance from the pipe exit.
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