VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

-POSTING RULES
-Advertise in here!
- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

Keep VAF Going
Donate methods

Point your
camera app here
to donate fast.

  #11  
Old 09-06-2021, 06:10 PM
Invicto89 Invicto89 is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Orange, VA
Posts: 2
Default

Thanks for all the inputs.

For Jon and Michael, the aircraft was recertified as an April 2020 manufacture date and statement of compliance with Vans E-LSA plans.

Only thing I have done since purchase was to add the second Dynon Skyview HDX EFIS.

http://www.grayburke.com/images/Photoshare/IMG_4284.JPG

http://www.grayburke.com/images/Photoshare/7.jpeg

http://www.grayburke.com/images/Photoshare/9.JPG

I had scheduled the Condition Inspection with CSP at W29 but yesterday found an A&P at my home field that will allow me to participate and learn the process.

I appreciate all the feedback,

Steve
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-06-2021, 07:35 PM
NinerBikes NinerBikes is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Granada Hills
Posts: 1,191
Default

Guess we need to see what's under the cowling... Carburetors or fuel injected. Perhaps also a picture of the fuel tank in back.

And does it really have the 912IS upgraded main landing gear specifications.

It's had quite a few owners in it's history, according to the registry.

It would be interesting to see what the maintenance and airframe logs say and show.
__________________
Donated
RV-12, KWHP based

"Time to Spare, go by Air."

Last edited by NinerBikes : 09-06-2021 at 07:42 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-06-2021, 10:12 PM
jrock836's Avatar
jrock836 jrock836 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: Burleson, Texas
Posts: 329
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NinerBikes View Post
Guess we need to see what's under the cowling... Carburetors or fuel injected. Perhaps also a picture of the fuel tank in back.
.
He says he bought an IS.. It’s an IS interior, the data plate says IS, it’s an IS cowling.. I expect the engine looks like a 912IS.. I expect it has the IS fuel tank, considering the fill location shown in the photo is at the IS location.

Again, nice plane Steve! The interior is beautiful too!

I wonder how much it cost Lockwood to do that conversion? That’s the first conversion from Legecy to IS that I have seen. As the Legacy fleet ages, I bet Van’s eventually offers an official Van’s ULS to IS conversion kit.
__________________
Joe
Van's RV-12 #120566 - ELSA - N49DD
Spinks Airport, KFWS, Fort Worth, TEXAS!


DONATED

Last edited by jrock836 : 09-06-2021 at 10:46 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-06-2021, 11:23 PM
rvbuilder2002's Avatar
rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
Posts: 9,601
Default

The airplane being discussed wasnít really a conversion of a legacy RV 12 in the sense that some may be thinking.
It was done by using the original wings, empennage and tail cone, and other common parts, and replacing the forward fuselage and firewall forward with all new parts that would be specific to a 12iS
__________________
Opinions, information and comments are my own unless stated otherwise. They do not necessarily represent the direction/opinions of my employer.

Scott McDaniels
Hubbard, Oregon
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
FAA/DAR
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-06-2021, 11:59 PM
jrock836's Avatar
jrock836 jrock836 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: Burleson, Texas
Posts: 329
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
The airplane being discussed wasnít really a conversion of a legacy RV 12 in the sense that some may be thinking.
It was done by using the original wings, empennage and tail cone, and other common parts, and replacing the forward fuselage and firewall forward with all new parts that would be specific to a 12iS
Sounds like a lot of $$$$ and labor involved!
__________________
Joe
Van's RV-12 #120566 - ELSA - N49DD
Spinks Airport, KFWS, Fort Worth, TEXAS!


DONATED
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 09-07-2021, 11:01 AM
jrtens's Avatar
jrtens jrtens is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Utah
Posts: 210
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Invicto89 View Post

For Jon and Michael, the aircraft was recertified as an April 2020 manufacture date and statement of compliance with Vans E-LSA plans.
Well that's great! I hope it is a wonderful airplane for you.
__________________
Jon
2019 12iS SLSA
Salt Lake Int'l
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-07-2021, 12:48 PM
NinerBikes NinerBikes is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Granada Hills
Posts: 1,191
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
The airplane being discussed wasn’t really a conversion of a legacy RV 12 in the sense that some may be thinking.
It was done by using the original wings, empennage and tail cone, and other common parts, and replacing the forward fuselage and firewall forward with all new parts that would be specific to a 12iS
So the Serial number stays with the tail cone, if the tail cone is reused.

Why would someone replace all the parts in the forward fuselage and firewall forward? Asking, since there's no point in speculating why so much money was thrown into this plane, that's the really expensive list of parts on the build, engine and avionics and interior.

For jrock... a 912IS can be built E-LSA with either the ULS carb motor or the iS fuel injected motor, which weighs an extra 25 lbs. Van's offers it, or may have used to offer it both ways.
__________________
Donated
RV-12, KWHP based

"Time to Spare, go by Air."

Last edited by NinerBikes : 09-08-2021 at 08:03 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-08-2021, 04:23 PM
jrock836's Avatar
jrock836 jrock836 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: Burleson, Texas
Posts: 329
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NinerBikes View Post
So the Serial number stays with the tail cone, if the tail cone is reused.

Why would someone replace all the parts in the forward fuselage and firewall forward? Asking, since there's no point in speculating why so much money was thrown into this plane, that's the really expensive list of parts on the build, engine and avionics and interior.

For jrock... a 912IS can be built E-LSA with either the ULS carb motor or the iS fuel injected motor, which weighs an extra 25 lbs. Van's offers it, or may have used to offer it both ways.
I'm aware of that.. Not really sure of the point you're trying to make...

Converting a 912uls to 912is RV12 might make sense for some individials or businesses. I expect Lockwood figured out how to make it worth their time and effort. No way of knowing how much they paid for the airplane or how much it cost them to convert it and any tax advantages they may have found. I expect Lockwood gets dealer pricing on Rotax also.. I don't know why you think Avionics would have to be replaced. Wiring yes, but a Skyview HDX, radios, ELT, transponder, auto pilot, etc. will work with both engines.. There's only a $5K difference retail price between 912is / 912uls engine..

As the Legacy fleet continues to age and engines TBO, I expect people are going to start doing the math and start looking at the difference between the value of an old RV12 with a worn out beyond TBO engine vs. what it would cost to upgrade it to a 912is vs spending years and the cost of building a new RV12is.. You also have the sentimental factor.. Some people might not want to sell their baby and would rather spend the money to convert to 912is, even if it didn't make good financial sense.. Lots of different possibilities and scenarios..
__________________
Joe
Van's RV-12 #120566 - ELSA - N49DD
Spinks Airport, KFWS, Fort Worth, TEXAS!


DONATED

Last edited by jrock836 : 09-08-2021 at 05:31 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09-08-2021, 08:26 PM
NinerBikes NinerBikes is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Granada Hills
Posts: 1,191
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrock836 View Post
I'm aware of that.. Not really sure of the point you're trying to make...

Converting a 912uls to 912is RV12 might make sense for some individials or businesses. I expect Lockwood figured out how to make it worth their time and effort. No way of knowing how much they paid for the airplane or how much it cost them to convert it and any tax advantages they may have found. I expect Lockwood gets dealer pricing on Rotax also.. I don't know why you think Avionics would have to be replaced. Wiring yes, but a Skyview HDX, radios, ELT, transponder, auto pilot, etc. will work with both engines.. There's only a $5K difference retail price between 912is / 912uls engine..

As the Legacy fleet continues to age and engines TBO, I expect people are going to start doing the math and start looking at the difference between the value of an old RV12 with a worn out beyond TBO engine vs. what it would cost to upgrade it to a 912is vs spending years and the cost of building a new RV12is.. You also have the sentimental factor.. Some people might not want to sell their baby and would rather spend the money to convert to 912is, even if it didn't make good financial sense.. Lots of different possibilities and scenarios..

I haven't seen any RV-12 Legacy E-LSA builds with timed out motors around or up for sale. The motors can continue to be run "on condition" well past 2000 hrs, if serviced properly and not abused.

These motors are not old school, air cooled, sloppy tolerance, taper bored Lycs or Contis. They keep their tolerances much longer for many more hours run. That and RV-12's don't get used too often doing XC trips, racking up the hours like the bigger RV models.

What I have seen with timed out motors are the S-LSA Legacy RV-12 builds used by flight schools.

Just my opinion, this particular plane is a "unicorn", with an original 2012 build. Back then Skyview D1000's were possible in dash, some were still D-180s, but the HDX wasn't even available back then. Van's had to create a connection box and wiring harnesses for the earliest RV-12s that were wired for Gen1 Dynon equipment so that Gen2 Skyview Classics and Skyview Touches could be plug and play. HDX is Gen 3 and compatible with Gen 2 wiring harnesses, I believe, just plug and play. Not so with Gen 1.
__________________
Donated
RV-12, KWHP based

"Time to Spare, go by Air."

Last edited by NinerBikes : 09-08-2021 at 08:37 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 09-08-2021, 10:08 PM
hjd3021 hjd3021 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Auburn, WA
Posts: 46
Default

Iím essentially doing exactly what Scott said. My original 12 s/n 120672 was completed up through the fuselage build (wings and tailcone completed too) at the time the 12iS was announced. Decided I wanted the Rotax fuel injected engine and the great improvements Vans made so I ordered the new iS fuselage kit at Oshkosh. I have now completed the iS fuselage and waiting for delta finish kit parts (yes I had the original 12 finish kit also before changing). Building as ESLA. Been an interesting journey so far but happy with my decision. Anybody need a 12 toward fuselage?
__________________
John H
Auburn, WA
RV-12 #120672
N672JH Reserved
Empennage/Tailcone Kit Finished
Wing Kit Finished
RV-12 Fuselage Kit 95% complete
New RV-12iS Fuselage Kit - in progress
http://www.mykitlog.com/hjd3021/
hjd3021@comcast.net
http://hjd3021.smugmug.com/Airplanes...7474307_JMNgxT
2021 VAF Supporter - worth every penny!
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:13 PM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.