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  #11  
Old 08-21-2021, 04:59 PM
rvbuilder2002's Avatar
rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NinerBikes View Post
Also a good idea to keep this in mind to maintain separation on downwind, base and final. Has happened to me 2x, I go further downwind now before turning base if they are in front of me at busier airports, if you fly in such areas.
????

There is no reason (other than pilot skills I guess) that an RV-12 shouldnít be able to follow pretty much any aircraft in a landing pattern, let alone a C-172, and not be able to maintain good spacingÖÖ.
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Hubbard, Oregon
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
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  #12  
Old 08-21-2021, 05:32 PM
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f1rocket f1rocket is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Martinsville, IN
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Why the -12? Quite simply the most enjoyable airplane I owned and the easiest to build. Flew it coast to coast multiple times. You can see in my signature the aircraft Iíve built and flown. Loved them all but loved the -12 more.
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Greenwood, IN

www.pflanzer-aviation.com
Paid through 2043!
Lund fishing Boat, 2017, GONE FISHING
RV-12 - Completed 2014, Sold
427 Shelby Cobra - Completed 2012, Sold
F1 EVO - partially completed, Sold
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RV-7A - Partially completed, Sold
RV-6 - Completed 2000, Sold
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  #13  
Old 08-21-2021, 05:49 PM
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cgeyman cgeyman is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Missoula MT
Posts: 121
Default RV-12 vs other models

Having 200 hrs in the RV-12 and 800 hrs in the RV-9a, I would agree with all of the above.

I loved the RV-12 but would definitely go for the fuel injected model. Having leaking carb floats on the Bing carburetors can be a total hassle; had to reject a take off at high density altitude in Denver and no fun running on basically half an engine. You will have to weigh the floats regularly (see Vic Syracuse's last weekly video tips on this) to ensure there is not a "sinker" float. I loved it from sea level to 10,000 feet, but flying over the Rockies needed more HP, and climb to 17,000 feet at times. Otherwise, I was forced to flying La Veta Pass, and watching the weather and winds aloft closely at 14,000 feet.

I changed up the RV9, and now don't have these limitations. On the other hand, if I lived in California or Seattle, and liked to fly low and local, and get great views out the window, you can't beat the rv12. It is a delight to fly. I also had no trouble selling mine when I decided to change. There are lots of pilots changing to LSA rules due to medical issues.
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  #14  
Old 08-21-2021, 07:18 PM
NinerBikes NinerBikes is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Granada Hills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
????

There is no reason (other than pilot skills I guess) that an RV-12 shouldnít be able to follow pretty much any aircraft in a landing pattern, let alone a C-172, and not be able to maintain good spacingÖÖ.
We all start off somewhere, Scott. Just my experience, or lack there of. I've been stuck in pattern work behind a Pipistrel Virus numerous times (not the Virus SW),. Try it some time, in any RV, if you get the opportunity.
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  #15  
Old 08-21-2021, 07:36 PM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NinerBikes View Post
We all start off somewhere, Scott. Just my experience, or lack there of. I've been stuck in pattern work behind a Pipistrel Virus numerous times (not the Virus SW),. Try it some time, in any RV, if you get the opportunity.
I understand there are different experience levels of pilots, and each needs to know there own limits and fly accordingly.
But your post came across in the context of "If flying behind a C-172 in your RV-12, you should plan on widening your pattern" That was written with you quoting a comment regarding the RV-12 out climbing and out running a C-172. Which it definitely will do, but that doesn't mean an RV-12 can't fly slower than one.

Just wanted to clarify to the masses that being pilot of an RV-12 doesn't mean you can't easily match the pattern speed of most any aircraft you might encounter (including a Pipistrel Virus)
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Opinions, information and comments are my own unless stated otherwise. They do not necessarily represent the direction/opinions of my employer.

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  #16  
Old 08-22-2021, 01:27 AM
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Piper J3 Piper J3 is offline
 
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Location: Hinckley, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cgeyman View Post
I loved the RV-12 but would definitely go for the fuel injected model. Having leaking carb floats on the Bing carburetors can be a total hassle; had to reject a take off at high density altitude in Denver and no fun running on basically half an engine. You will have to weigh the floats regularly (see Vic Syracuse's last weekly video tips on this) to ensure there is not a "sinker" float.
Yes, Bing carb floats have caused numerous overflow problems and severe engine roughness Ė I have experienced both. To make matters worse, Bing keeps coming up with latest manufacturing revision at $300 a pop and the problem persists.

I believe the solution is finally at hand. Marvel-Schebler made a version of their solid epoxy floats for the Bing 64. The M-S design had the floats a bit too heavy, but now a final design has the floats at correct weight and buoyancy. The solid epoxy wonít absorb fuel. Lycoming and Continental both specify the solid float for use in all Marvel Schebler aviation carburetors.
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Jim Stricker - EAA #499867
PPL/ASEL 1970 - Sport Pilot since 2007
80 hrs Flying Aeronca Chief 11AC N86203
1130 hrs Flying 46 Piper J-3 Cub N6841H
Bought Flying RV-12 #120058 Oct 2015 with 48TT - Hobbs now 717

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MJ Stricker (Father - CFI) - USAAF 1st Lt. Captain B-17H
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  #17  
Old 08-22-2021, 04:16 AM
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mike newall mike newall is offline
 
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Location: Yorkshire, England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
Just wanted to clarify to the masses that being pilot of an RV-12 doesn't mean you can't easily match the pattern speed of most any aircraft you might encounter (including a Pipistrel Virus)
Having done 3 first flight and fly off's in 12ULS's now, I would agree that the aeroplane will fit in to any pattern speed and accommodate slower, or faster traffic.

However...... Until you have played with the aeroplane a bit and got used to the differences in speed management between Rotax/Sensenich v Lycoming/McCauley or similar, you may find things interesting.

Part of the efficiency of the 12 is the way the prop can be set for your purpose - i.e. the ground adjustable can change the characteristics quite a bit. We settled on #2 which gave us a nice blend between takeoff performance and cruise speed. It does leave the combination a little coarse compared to other aeroplanes and a little planning is required to slow down. Once you are slow, it will loiter around all day, quite happily.

If you are alone in the pattern, you can enter at cruise speed and slowly reduce to idle 2/3rds downwind. The rest of the circuit is whisper quiet, no shock cooling issues and a tad of power over the threshold to stabilise things - A most excellent aeroplane indeed
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  #18  
Old 08-22-2021, 05:28 AM
Dave12 Dave12 is offline
 
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Location: Elkton, Md.
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I have built 2-12ís, the first one took 18 months, 5 months of which were waiting for parts. The second one took 6 months. You just canít beat a 12 for many reasons, no one dislikes them once they fly one. I have a 9 now that a buddy built and although itís a beautiful example of an RV, the 12 is much more comfortable and far easier to enter and exit. I do like the performance of the 9, mine turns impressive numbers. I can also throttle it back to 12 speeds and burn the same or less fuel. It leaps off the ground and lands on a dime. But, so does a 12. I donít know if the 12 has any real competition. Not in my eyes, anyway.

The 12 is extremely easy to build, it is more of an assembly than a build. That being said, I have seen several 12ís that are fairly screwed up. In that regard, they are no different than any other airplane. If the builder takes no pride in his work, has no eye for detail, thatís what the result will be. I also like bucked rivets better, but the LPís work fine.

You mentioned the S21, I ordered a complete 21 several years ago and by the time I took delivery on it, Iíd had my fill of Rans. That crate got to my place on a Monday and it was out of here the following weekend. I was used to dealing with Vanís and their very straight forward, honest, under promise and over deliver attitudes. I found it impossible to deal with a company that did not adhere to those same principles.

Apologies for the ramble, but you canít beat a 12.
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  #19  
Old 08-22-2021, 12:23 PM
PilotBrent PilotBrent is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Hackettstown, NJ
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Threads like this make me a little uncomfortable. ALL aircraft have strengths and weaknesses - choose the one that most matches your mission and you should be very satisfied. I have favorites, but hesitate to knock even the reliable C172. (I'd argue the pilots' skills are even more diverse than the aircraft)

As for the 12, well in the last month I've flown over 700 miles each way to KOSH, no problem. Sure its not a six seat Saratoga with a 540, but its definitely capable of executing long cross country journeys.

Yesterday I flew 150 miles back and forth from NJ to Dulles for a fly in at the Udvar Hazy Smithsonian Museum (another 12, a 7 and 10 also made the trip). Easily navigated across some of the most challenging Class B airspace in the country, taxied back and forth amongst the big boys, all in my RV12. Last weekend I flew a sight seeing tour over Central Park New York City at 2,000 feet in an aircraft I assembled in my garage.

All to say that there are more things we can do with our aircraft, than we cannot. Life is a series of small compromises.

God Bless Vans, God Bless America!
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  #20  
Old 08-22-2021, 03:43 PM
Azjulian Azjulian is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
Posts: 204
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My RV12 took me a year to finish and I also have a full time job.

I have friends building other Vans kits and all of their kits are excellent.

The reason I decided to build the 12 was that Vans put everything together for you so you could order the configuration you want and just build.

Thatís the huge difference between the 12 and any of the other kits, you can just chose yo build as the S-LSA is, you get a 5 hour fly off and you need to do zero investigation, just chose the engine the panel and build.

The other kits require you to plan for avionics and lay out a panel (all can be acquired if you donít mind paying) but that all going to add significantly to your build time.

And the pull rivets mean everything comes out looking awesome, you arenít trying to avoid rivet banging blemishes etc

It really is a top notch kit.
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