EAA vs. AOPA Membership

Bob Collins said:

Which is pretty much why I dropped AOPA membership.

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While it would be terrible for EAA to become another AOPA, it is not terrible for AOPA to be AOPA! Once the building is done, we are aircraft owners and pilots.

I started flying just before 9/11, and there was a period where I wondered if GA had been killed by terrorists. In my opinion, AOPA saved GA back then. Today, I see them fighting the same fight as hard as ever, whether its trying to keep airports open or prevent user fees.

The builder in me supports EAA, but the pilot in me supports AOPA and is very grateful for what they do. I don't ready many of the articles in the AOPA monthly magazine, and I can't afford any of the planes they write about. But as long as I want to continue enjoying the privilege of flying, I consider that AOPA membership to be a cheap investment.

Support them Both

I've been a member of AOPA since 1968 and actively support both EAA and AOPA.

I read both mags cover to cover just because I love all things aviation.

I don't have access to jets anymore, can't afford 600k singles, don't need a turboprop bush plane, but I still like to see what's going on in the aviation world around me.

Granted EAA has drifted, ney run, in a different direction, but maybe they will spark the interest in a person to get them involved.

I support anything that actively promotes general aviation because it's good for all of us.

Not to drift this too far - but it seems to me that AOPA has gone the user fee route - since Phil left you have to pay for the services that once were free - I'm not renewing this year

they are simply another Washington lobbyist. their client is GAMA. EAA lobbies as well but more towards issues I favor so while they don't soak you with fees, and requests they do hit you pretty good at OSH. My biggest complaint with AOPA was their negative stance on the original LSA discussions...obviously driven by GAMA.

It's Simple For Me...

...I support the lobbying efforts of AOPA so I remain a member even though I'm not exactly in their target demographic. On the other hand I feel betrayed by EAA, so I chose to "punish" them in the only way I know how - by dropping my membership. I renewed only so that I could camp at OSH this year, but after seeing evidence that EAA is drifting even further, I'm out again.

While 'punishing' an organization may feel good, I doubt that it will change it in the way you hope. If all the experimenters leave, then what is left will truly be a general aviation organization and will act accordingly. It seems to me that if we want to correct the 'drift' then we have to stay with the organization and work within it more actively.

I am a believer in both organizations and will continue my financial support of both.

Pat

Pat Stewart said:

I am a believer in both organizations and will continue my financial support of both.

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Me too.....

flion said:

While 'punishing' an organization may feel good, I doubt that it will change it in the way you hope...

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While still in the organization I had many heartfelt emails with the EAA leadership trying to effect or understand change - The only result was "they" made it very clear to me that while they appreciated my position, as a homebuilder I was now in the minority. "My" organization has evolved into something that (by design) no longer represents my interests...

I'll agree that loss of my membership is not going to shake the foundation of EAA, but I'd have to be a chump to keep pumping money into an organization that has essentially turned its back on homebuilders.

Toobuilder said:

I'll agree that loss of my membership is not going to shake the foundation of EAA, but I'd have to be a chump to keep pumping money into an organization that has essentially turned its back on homebuilders.

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No EAA = No Oshkosh. And you did go to Oshkosh..........correct?

L.Adamson --- RV6A, but sure likes "warbirds"!!!

You should re-title this thread EAA vs AOPA vs VAF.

I believe VAF has become one of the foremost aviation related forums serving homebuilders. I think it's about time DR charges a $30 annual fee. We already have a couple of "fly-ins" (LOE, Vetterman, others). Once you meet face to face with the "username", it's more like a family.

I still support AOPA and EAA, but don't think VAF isn't equally or significantly more important.

Both organizations well worth the $$$....my support to EAA comes with the additional support to IAC!

I dont think we can afford not to have both protecting our flying rights! let's be careful what we wish for!

EAA

It will be interesting to see if there are any significant changes with Toms departure. Rod Hightower seems to to be spending a lot of time with Paul. Paul has been back in his grass roots mode for a long time now. At the Urbana flyins he got up on his soap box and ranted about his displeasure with EAA.

EAA

One option, IIRC, is to drop Sport Aviation and take another EAA publication instead. Vintage Airplane,, for example, VERY well done, focused and informative.

Must be in the minority. I support both organizations although my support for AOPA has waned recently due to AOPA looking at their members as a source of revenue first, then as members. Everything costs, if you want AOPA Pilot digital you pay an extra 10 bucks--it's free at EAA. Phil leaves and the first thing the new guy does is raise dues. Other services which were once free, now cost and you get deluged with marketing stuff all the time.
Over the years I've only built half of one airplane so I'm not feeling that EAA has abandoned me but has simply expanded to all of GA.
What's the real gripe with EAA??

Well neither is of any value to me

The guy that said VAF should start a new organization may have something. I pay the dues every year to EAA and AOPA and neither one is worth the price of the stamps to mail the letters. The only reason I stay in the EAA is habit and the need to be a member to fly in the AirVenture Cup race. After the fiasco this year out of Dayton maybe that isn't worth going to ... well hold off on that, one bad event out of the 14 or so AVCs isn't too bad. But really those dumb magazines come each month and it is agonizing to flip through the pages - there's nothing there for me. These are probably fine for many many pilots but seriously, there is a need that isn't being actively addressed by either group - something new is needed and right now the Sport Air Racing League (SARL) does it for me.

Bob Axsom

L.Adamson said:

No EAA = No Oshkosh. And you did go to Oshkosh..........correct?

L.Adamson --- RV6A, but sure likes "warbirds"!!!

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Yes, the first time since 1985...


Besides, the organization is evolving into other areas... There will be an OSH for a long time to come, but it has long ago ceased to be the annual convention for the Experimental Aircraft Association.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

Didn't EAA and AOPA merge together?

I belong to both and will probably continue to do so. Neither magazine is that great; I long for the days of Sport Aviation under Jack Cox. However, both organizations are important lobbying voices, even if imperfect. We live in turbulent times and the silent risk getting trampled.

Ted RV8 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong.

Didn't EAA and AOPA merge together?

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It may appear to be the case at times since it seems both organizations tend to present the same type of information but these are indeed separate organizations.

EAA in AOPA out. I was a AOPA member over 21 years, but once AOPA raised dues during a poor economy I bailed. AOPA got along just fine all these years, they could have waited a little longer till things got better for the average member. It's not that I can't afford it but I know many that cannot.

RV8iator said:

.....I support anything that actively promotes general aviation because it's good for all of us.

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Pat Stewart said:

I am a believer in both organizations and will continue my financial support of both. Pat

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Alan Carroll said:

I belong to both...... We live in turbulent times and the silent risk getting trampled.

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I agree with all the sentiments quoted and I too have been a dues paying member of both organizations for many, many years. Times are changing. The FAA seems to be retreating into its past adversarial policy as regards pilot infractions. That is a challenge best dealt with from within our community. Also, we must accept the cold hard reality that the public at large will never give any thought to nor take the time to understand general aviation concerns. "Pity the poor pilot/owner"......yeah right. Most folks struggle just to get through the day and collectively, the public will not hesitate to throw us all under the bus given a perfect mix of tragedy, unfortunate timing, and rabble rousing demagoguery.

At times I certainly do take issue with the direction of the EAA and AOPA. Still, these organizations are the only meaningful voices we possess and more than ever general aviation needs all the political savvy it is capable of mustering. The EAA and AOPA are positioned to work to preserve our interests. If these two organized groups of kindred spirits can't or won't speak for us, who will?

What I've noticed is a duplicate in services by the various groups. I don't belong to AOPA because like what others have said about their angle of aviation doesn't really interest me. I like all aviation and support their ability to continue doing so. I once subscribed to Flying Magazine back in the 80's but it didn't take me long to realize it was just a cover for a few privileged people to go out and fly exotic aircraft and write how much fun it was and rub my nose in it. When EAA picked up J. MacMillan recently, I had flashbacks to Flying magazine. The more I read Sport Aviation nowadays, the more I need to refer back to the cover to make sure it doesn't say Flying across the top. I concur with Paul, we need to get back to "experimental". It would be nice if every group EAA, AOPA, NBAA, etc. could agree to create one aviation lobbyist/legal group that everyone would belong to and support, and then spend more time and money concentrating their efforts on their respective interests. Then, I'd think we would all be better off and have a stronger representation in Washington rather than several weaker groups trying to compete in the big boys club.

If these two organized groups of kindred spirits can't or won't speak for us, who will?

Well said, Rick.

With what I'm hearing from some folks, an old addage comes to mind : "throwing the baby out with the bath water".
Failing to support an organization which favorably represents you on the majority of issues because of a dissagreement on a minor point is a win for your opposition. There are many people who would like nothing better than to ground all of us. Don't let them "divide and conquer".

Need for a new organization?

Clearly the EAA should change its name to match its new-chosen mission.

But what we are all really saying is that it is time to form a new national organization that does represent the interests of home-building. The VAF, along with similar forums and news groups for Lancair, Glassair, Rans, and others, along with strong participation by the kit builders themselves could form a federation of sorts to have an umbrella organization that looks after the special interests of Experimental-Amateur Built.

Not long ago, there was a substantial review of the FAA policies revolving around Amateur-built aircraft, and who represented our interests? The kit builders! They clearly have a strong interest in us. I don't recall, so I can't say what role, if any, the EAA played in those discussions. Did they step up for us? Given their new focus, they could have just abandoned us. So, I guess before I would 'punish' them with ending my membership, I would want to know at least that.

I disagree completely with the recommendations and attitude of AOPA toward handling the media and resent their us against them attitude. I've discussed this many times over the years here so I won't bother you repeating it. I'd sent a number of letters to then-prez Boyer and never got the courtesy of a reply. I figure if I was important to the organization, someone in at least its membership department could've scribbled me a note. But I guess they didn't have time. I tried to tell them there were better, more effective ways to improve the relationship, but I'm just a guy in the business in the Midwest and they're bigshots in Washington and hobnob with the rich and powerful.

Let's face it, also, we're one of those "special interests" everyone always talks about. Frankly, I'm conflicted when my "special interest" in favoring, say, a re-election of a politician, which AOPA's PAC supports, conflicts with my non-special interest as an American.

Plus, given the business I'm in, it's not a real good idea to be a member of any advocacy organization.

Besides, I think it's clear that EAA and AOPA are pretty much tilling the same ground and now that the Pobereznys are out of the picture, I'm sure EAA will reposition itself as an advocacy organization for aviators and the Ford Motor Company. (g) In that vein, by the way, if you want to see a media guy who "gets it," look no further than Dick Knapinski and his staff at EAA.

That's just me. It doesn't mean it has to be you. I respect your decision w.r.t. what you do/don't want to support. If you want to single me out for a decision I've made, that's what freedom is all about. Go for it.

I did hold out the last time my renewal was up and eventually they offered it for something like $25. The only reason I re-upped was to get Flight Training magazine, which I think is a fine publication.

But overall, I'm a workin' stiff. I don't have a lot of dough to toss around. AOPA didn't make the cut. Lots of things don't anymore.

Bob Collins said:

...That's just me. It doesn't mean it has to be you. I respect your decision w.r.t. what you do/don't want to support...

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Right. Why we support or not is a matter of personal expectations. I belong to AOPA because I view them as an advocacy group for all of GA. Sure, there is not a lot of focus on E-AB stuff specifically, but we all get to ride the coattails to a large extent. To that end, I?m happy to keep them paid and in Washington making noise. I?m looking for something completely different from EAA however. Rather than advocacy, I?m looking for in depth technical exchanges concerning design and fabrication of private, experimental aircraft. To this end, EAA has failed miserably. They have turned into an ?appeal to everyone? entertainment medium. Much like the evening news, it?s all about broad appeal, not content.

My dad started the EAA chapter in my hometown years before I was born, and I grew up with Chapter meetings in our garage and Sport Aviation issues all over the house. I feel I have a fair perspective on how much EAA has changed and can determine with certainty if it meets my needs or not.

?and as far as I?m concerned, the baby got out of the bathwater at EAA a long time ago.

Toobuilder said:

To this end, EAA has failed miserably. They have turned into an “appeal to everyone” entertainment medium. Much like the evening news, it’s all about broad appeal, not content.

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I think there are many "wings" of EAA. The most public is decidedly not homebuilder-focused. But, on the other hand, the homebuilder videos that they've been producing for the last few years are really great and quite helpful. Sure, it's hard to find them at EAA.org, but that's where Google helps.

I haven't been in an EAA chapter for quite a few years; ever since the last one I was in started getting more involved in politics that I was interested in. But the greatest source of help continues to be other builders on my field or in the RV builders group -- in my case Twin Cities RV Builders -- and the online sites such as VAF or Rivetbangers or the Yahoogroup etc.

Like I said on another thread, when I go to Oshkosh, EAA seems very homebuilder friendly because I hang out all week with homebuilders and only go to homebuilding forums and mostly only look at homebuilt planes. When I have to view EAA from afar -- as I did this year -- I get quite a different perception, to the point where the only thing that made me not miss going to Oshkosh this year, was watching the online coverage of Oshkosh. Which is kind of sad, I guess.

Interesting discussion, which reminds us that each person sees the world through their own lens. I too can gripe a bit but both organizations earn their annual fee from me for these (seen thru my lens) reasons:

AOPA:
-- the Air Safety Institute's on-line tutorials have been a big help to me in doing my own refresher training as I return to Aviation; I've heard them receive praise from pilots I respect, and they keep my own syllabus on file for me
-- I've benefited by a few helpful clarifications from the Technical Counselors 'cause I don't think I should stick Mel with ALL my Q's
-- while most of the stuff misses the mark for me personally, I've found some of the AOPA on-line video segments keep me informed in ways PILOT and more focused info sources (like VAF) do not. (And the extended interview with Harrison Ford released a few days ago was just plain interesting...)
-- I might get a competitive insurance quote from them when that time comes (and a discount is available for the ASI tutorial completions one completes)
-- their on-line TurboMedical program has already saved me time as I grow further into Geezerhood while maintaining my medical, and 'my Form 8500-8' is also kept on-file for immediate retrieval or updating
-- ditto for me on the quality of the Flight Training mag...and while I'm at it, let me include the weekly AOPA email, which always seems to have at least one bit of training and/or aviation info I've followed up on further
-- and while I grate a bit at being continuously solicited by their marketing flacks and vendor partners, I also realize that one of AOPA's core competencies - for at least the last 20 years and during all of Phil's tenure - has been the broad marketing & services operation that provides bundles of additional revenue. This gives me the above benefits (and others I haven't mentioned) for just the one - IMO - reasonable annual fee.

I'm very new in renewing my relationship with EAA (12 year hiatus) and so lack a more recent perspective...but already:
-- I've watched many of the EAA video tutorials, often being referred to them by folks here, as I nudge up close to beginning a build project. Except for commercial providers who sell such content, I'm not sure who would do that
-- the EAA, however much it seems to now deviate from what some want, has given me a local EAA Chapter, which has been a very helpful segway for Patricia and I as we start to join the aviation side of this new-to-us part of Florida. My first (hopefully, far from last) 9A ride came one day after attending that first meeting last month, midwifed via a kind fellow we just happened to sit next to.
-- until recently, Jacksonville had an ordinance that prohibited home building of aircraft, or at least it did until a core group from the local EAA chapter waded thru each city department and ultimately City Council, informing and educating (vs. ranting and breath-holding such as we've all seen in the political news recently) and the ordinance was rewritten to address the City's concerns while permitting home building. Doesn't being a member of EAA, in some small way, help perpetuate that kind of aviation-related civic stewardship?
-- if that sounds like an almost freak event, my past home airport (SPG in St. Pete, FL) was almost turned into Condo Land about 5 years ago except that the local EAA chapter, which was at the heart of forming an active airport advisory council, led a city-wide November ballot initiative to save the airport. For those who think lawn signs and chatting with neighbors - as political tools - went out with the buggy whip, the airport's permanent presence, right in the heart of downtown, was overwhelmingly supported (75% or so) by the almost entirely non-aviation involved voters.

I had intended on only mentioning a couple of things these organizations do for me...but as you can see, the list grew quickly. I can point fingers at both organizations, but they both are earning my membership.

Jack

EAA vs AOPA

I started going to Oshkosh in 1973 and joined EAA in 1976. As long as I can remember, there have been complaints by one group that they (Warbirds,Homebuilts, Ultralights ((now LSA)) spam cans, etc.) have been slighted in favor of one of the other groups. To me, AirVenture is the place to be during the last week of July or first week of August. If I'm not there, my wife will have to endure my whining during that time. I wax philosophically about the "good old days" of EAA when the events of the Theater in the Woods were held where the current EAA Wearhouse now sits. My girlfriend (now my wife) and I would be walking around the airshow and have Paul Poberezny drive by in "Red 1" and tease us for holding hands walking along the flightline. When Tom took over, he brought in greater commercial intersts and took EAA into a new era. This is when we started seeing the great expansion of AirVenture. Certainly it lost some of intimacy but it also brought more people into the fold. The NTSB, FAA and many Senators and congressmen know about and attend Oshkosh. At AirVenture, Harrison Ford, Ken Griffey, Jr., George Lucas, numerous astronauts and other celebrities attended to give a national recognition to aviaton and these organizatons. Never forget that the groundwork laid by EAA has fostered the likes of Burt Rutan and Van. There has been a tremendous growth in aviation as products intended for experimental aircraft have morphed into certified aircraft use.

When I go to Oshkosh, I look at what I want to look at and don't look at stuff that I don't want to look at. When I get my new issue of Sport Aviation I read what interests me and ignore the rest. Ditto with AOPA's Pilot. Ditto VAF.net.

I think we will all agree that the greatest threat to aviation is the aging pilot population and the lack of numbers of young people to carry on the tradition. That being said, we need as many voices as we can muster to defend our right to fly. If, hypothetically, EAA has 100,000 members and AOPA has 100,000 members, the politicians see 200,000 voters while we all know that there is significant crossover membership between the two organizations. Ditto with NBAA and GAMA.

The value of these two organizations isn't just that EAA puts on a great event but that they are fighting for my ability to fly. They are constantly watching out for threats to our chosen avocation. I would have never known about the Lightspeed issue unless these two organizations weren't looking out for our best interests. If I don't want to avail myself of some of the benefits that EAA or AOPA offers, I'm not compelled to use them but realize that each of these services provides an income stream to further their respective missions which coincidently is my mission.

If you can find an organization that advocates only your interests and none of the issues in which you have no interest, enjoy it as long as possible because you will be the only member.

Just my $.02

jrs14855 said:

...Rod Hightower seems to to be spending a lot of time with Paul. Paul has been back in his grass roots mode for a long time now. At the Urbana flyins he got up on his soap box and ranted about his displeasure with EAA.

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At Frasca I witnessed Paul chewing Rod out for "taxiing with his flaps down". It was hilarious. Like a father scolding a child. Rod was humbled. Rod really is a nice guy. I think he "has ears to hear". Don't be afraid to speak up and let him know how you feel.

Ya that's a funny one. I had an instructor chew me out on my last Biannual because I didn't retract my flaps. My response was simple, in an RV you don't want to actuate that flap motor more than you have to, after all you need the flaps down to get out easier. All I got was an OH makes sense.

EAA - AOPA...different missions

I do not believe EAA has abandoned home builders or the experimental amateur built effort. Experimental aviation is the nuts and bolts of the convention (along with war birds) and will remain so or the event will go away. Why would vendors spend big bucks to show their wares if the event were not mostly about and for home builders? Why would any pilot attend the gathering if it were not so? Sure times are changing but the interest in what we do is there, is rock solid, and I think EAA leadership knows it.

EAA has no other way to go unless they see a bright future marketing Ford and John Deere products and other consumer items. If and when that happens, most of us will pass on the event. I don't know who will go but it won't be grass roots aviators. Yea, it is a nuisance at the show, you can look at Ford cars at home, but if it brings bucks to the convention have at it.

OSH is EAA and EAA is OSH. I don't see that changing. If it does, our leadership has failed us. I don't see that happening.

How many of you attend the annual AOPA convention? I never have and never will. Its a a different ball game. If EAA is migrating in that direction, and again, I don't believe they are, most of us will skip the event.

Rod Hightower has made a effort to attend local chapter meetings in many parts of the country. He flew into the Troy Air Park in his old biplane to attend one of our Chapter meetings last fall and I did not for a minute get the impression EAA was anything but fun grass roots flying. It was a great day and I thought a great start for the new boss of the organization. Yes, there are issues going on including a joining with AOPA in an effort to lobby for matters concerning both organizations. I don't know how far that partnership has gone but feel certain it will never be a marriage. Paul Poberezny would like to turn the clock backward, but that won't happen. He is of an era of plans built, scratch built airplane building. Those days are mostly gone. The game today is kits because the product is excellent and that is where the money is. Selling plans is a lot of head aches, law suits and not much money.

Maybe I am missing something, but I thought the OSH 2011 was a lot of fun and hope to be here to do it again next year. And I won't be attending the AOPA convention because I am not a member.

One aviation magazine a month is enough.

allbee said:

Ya that's a funny one. I had an instructor chew me out on my last Biannual because I didn't retract my flaps. My response was simple, in an RV you don't want to actuate that flap motor more than you have to, after all you need the flaps down to get out easier. All I got was an OH makes sense.

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I retract the flaps after landing because I want to know if the flap motor has failed before the next take off. Unless circumstances dictate otherwise, all take offs are clean, that way I know I can make it home even if the darn motor has failed for no good reason.

Mine as failed twice, live and learn.

As I said in my earlier post I will continue to support both organizations. Its not for the magazines, its not for the silver wings sticker. I support both organizations for their power in Washington. Without this lobby the politicians would have already killed our hobby.

Pat

David-aviator said:

I retract the flaps after landing because I want to know if the flap motor has failed before the next take off. Unless circumstances dictate otherwise, all take offs are clean, that way I know I can make it home even if the darn motor has failed for no good reason.

Mine as failed twice, live and learn.

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ya but like any electrical device can quit at any time, that does nothing except use the motor more than needed. You still need to lower it back down so people can get back out. Or am I missing something here. Also when you start the plane, up it goes again. Na, just do as little as possible with it. generally if I want to do a touch and go, very rare, I don't use the flaps at all there. again as little on the motor as possible.

I guess another thing you can do if you feel you have to check the motor after landing is to just pop it up and back down real quick to make sure it works.

Ah for the good old days...

This thread stirred up a lot of interest and it seems that there is some genuine concern about EAA abandoning its ?Builder Heritage.? Years ago a friend of mine remarked that you can mark the day when an organization loses its soul as the day they start selling credit cards and life insurance. Living near Lakeland, FL and Sun n? Fun I lamented the conversion from an event for builder-pilots to an event designed for other purposes. Maybe it would be nice to once again have an annual meet where builders and builder aficionados gathered. Just builders and builder supporters. No war birds nor war bird wannabe?s. No airshow except for the homebuilt fly-bys. Just a short event to appreciate each other?s efforts and accomplishments. We could note the date and measure how long it took before we offered ?builder credit cards and insurance.?

APACHE 56 said:

This thread stirred up a lot of interest and it seems that there is some genuine concern about EAA abandoning its ?Builder Heritage.? Years ago a friend of mine remarked that you can mark the day when an organization loses its soul as the day they start selling credit cards and life insurance. Living near Lakeland, FL and Sun n? Fun I lamented the conversion from an event for builder-pilots to an event designed for other purposes. Maybe it would be nice to once again have an annual meet where builders and builder aficionados gathered. Just builders and builder supporters. No war birds nor war bird wannabe?s. No airshow except for the homebuilt fly-bys. Just a short event to appreciate each other?s efforts and accomplishments. We could note the date and measure how long it took before we offered ?builder credit cards and insurance.?

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October, Weatherford Oklahoma, a group of us will be flying out of central Florida, join up or we will see you there.

Don, read the post after yours. It is called LOE (I think). Used to be Land of Enchantment fly-in.

David-aviator said:

One aviation magazine a month is enough.

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Not to undermine your point, but one aviation magazine barely lasts me an evening, much less a month...

Pat Stewart said:

As I said in my earlier post I will continue to support both organizations. Its not for the magazines, its not for the silver wings sticker. I support both organizations for their power in Washington. Without this lobby the politicians would have already killed our hobby.

Pat

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I don't usually agree with Pat (haha), but in this case I think he is spot on.

I don't think I've read any acknowledgment here about the potential impact of the EAA's Young Eagles program. I noticed that Harrison Ford alone estimated he'd flown 300 kids in one of his many a/c. Who else is actually doing something meaningful about bringing aviation to young kids? And didn't we see an Oshkosh report just last week that $1M+ was raised for the future YE program?

There's always something to poke a stick at. Seems like we should be looking beyond magazine content and credit card solicitations...

Like Pat, I think the fundamental task for both organizations is government advocacy. If they did nothing but deal with government on my behalf it would be worth the dues. The rest is a bonus.

BTW, if you think homebuilders are not represented well within the EAA, get organized. We're the proud independents, meaning we don't tend to speak and act together. The Vintage and Warbird folks (for examples) long ago put together formal organizations within EAA.

My new view: If you're not camping in a tent at Oshkosh, you're in no position to lament the end of the "grassroots" version of AirVenture.

Jack Tyler said:

I don't think I've read any acknowledgment here about the potential impact of the EAA's Young Eagles program. I noticed that Harrison Ford alone estimated he'd flown 300 kids in one of his many a/c. Who else is actually doing something meaningful about bringing aviation to young kids? And didn't we see an Oshkosh report just last week that $1M+ was raised for the future YE program?

There's always something to poke a stick at. Seems like we should be looking beyond magazine content and credit card solicitations...

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I've flown 108. They actually have 14 million in the kitty for the YE program. Not sure what expenses EAA may have internally with YE as the main cost is on the volunteer pilots but at least it shows that people understand the value of this program and contribute.

DanH said:

BTW, if you think homebuilders are not represented well within the EAA, get organized. We're the proud independents, meaning we don't tend to speak and act together. The Vintage and Warbird folks (for examples) long ago put together formal organizations within EAA.

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I like this. Of course, we are already organized under VAF! How about it Doug? We need permanent showers in HBC like the certified in the North 40 have so you dont have to wait in a line to use the two sinks in the showers trailer.

RVs to Oshkosh 2012!

I dropped my EAA membership and tech counselor status in 2006 when they announced sponsorship of Jim Campbell's "Sportplane Resource Guide" (4 August 2006 EAA e-Hotline) I vowed I would rejoin when the leadership changed and they stopped sponsorship. I can't easily find anything about EAA leadership on non-member accessible EAA HQ sites and they do not respond to my e-mails asking about the status of the Sportplane Resource Guide. If anyone can point to official statements regarding either condition I'd be grateful.

edit: I can easily find Craig Fuller's bio and official status with one click from AOPA's front page.

Nauga,
AOPA-only since 2006

Bob Collins said:

My new view: If you're not camping in a tent at Oshkosh, you're in no position to lament the end of the "grassroots" version of AirVenture.

Click to expand...

I do the HBC thing every year and we homebuilders are the red heeded stepchildren of the EAA.

They're the only game in town...

I am a member of both, and will continue to be.

I get agitated with AOPA and all their promotions. In fact, just last month I called them and told them that I was angry at all the stuff they mailed me, that it was wasting my dues. They said they would take me off their promotions mailing list and only send me one renewal notice a year.

EAA is a much broader organization than it was before, and caters to a lot more interests. I'm OK with that.

But why I stay with both is they are both protecting my privilege to fly, and fly almost any kind of plane I want. To the best of my knowledge, we have the most flight freedom, at the lowest costs, with the least amount of government intervention, around. Both those organizations work to maintain that status, keep airports open, fight user fees, fight higher sales and use taxes, etc.

There is no one else to do that for us, as well as they do it for us, and I believe that it is important for me to continue my support of both.

YMMV..

EAA ????

I found it hard to send my money to an organization who on the back of voluteers pays there executives what EAA does. Additional perks of flying expensive warbirds that members can't bothers me. Wonder what the boys and girls at AOPA get paid and their perks.