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  #1  
Old 04-01-2011, 06:12 PM
Anitech Anitech is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Valencia, CA
Posts: 23
Default AKZO Users

To all that have used the AKZO primer I am interested in your preparation techniques and also the PPE used during spraying. Any comments or insights would help....Thxs Steve
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  #2  
Old 04-01-2011, 06:33 PM
az_gila's Avatar
az_gila az_gila is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: 57AZ - NW Tucson area
Posts: 10,011
Default

The biggest problem I found was that it sprays so well you can easily put it on too thick...

It only needs to be 1.0 to 1.3 mills thick which is almost transparent.

http://www.kalinskyconsulting.com/rv..._datasheet.pdf
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  #3  
Old 04-01-2011, 07:47 PM
Anitech Anitech is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Valencia, CA
Posts: 23
Default AKZO

Gil,

Did you use anything but normal Vapor Respirator and clothing protection?

Have you ever use PreKote to prep for the primer?
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  #4  
Old 04-01-2011, 07:56 PM
fehdxl fehdxl is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bellevue, NE
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Default

I spray on acid etch from a typical spray bottle, use maroon scotch bright pads to take away the shine, rinse with tap water, spray alodine from a spray bottle, rinse with tap water, let dry, and then primer with Akzo. Just gloves and typical respirator for me. -Jim
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  #5  
Old 04-01-2011, 08:25 PM
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Walt Walt is offline
 
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Location: Dallas/Ft Worth, TX
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On alclad parts I would scotcbrite, clean with MEK and then spray.

On non alclad parts I would etch/alodine/mek/paint.

A good vapor respirator is all I used.
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  #6  
Old 04-01-2011, 08:44 PM
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az_gila az_gila is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anitech View Post
Gil,

Did you use anything but normal Vapor Respirator and clothing protection?

Have you ever use PreKote to prep for the primer?
I used the vapor respirator as you mention, but all painting has been done outdoors.

Prep has been almost the same as Jim (fexdhl) mentioned, but sometimes without the alodine step on less critical parts.

Acid etch and red scotchbrite works well.
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  #7  
Old 04-01-2011, 09:50 PM
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vmirv8bldr vmirv8bldr is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Eastvale, CA
Posts: 378
Default Etch & Scuff

I used Alumaprep 33 (Scrub with soaked maroon scotchbrites)
-Wear good gloves, this is just phosphoric acid

Rinse with water, then Alodine 1201
small pieces - dip in a tub diluted
large pieces - brush on, rinse off (Don't let the alodine dry)

Rinse well, hang to dry overnight

Paint

PPE for paint:
Full body covering
Respirator
Goggles
Gloves

I didn't want any of that junk on me!

Dries VERY fast, btw, especially in direct sun.
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  #8  
Old 04-01-2011, 11:00 PM
Dan Langhout's Avatar
Dan Langhout Dan Langhout is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL USA
Posts: 562
Default My Technique

Initially (early empennage parts), I did the full Alumiprep/Alodine stuff before priming. I recall reading a recommendation purported to be from an AKZO rep that said just to wet abrade with Scotchbrite, then, when dry, wipe down with acetone to remove any remaining residue and then shoot the primer. This is basically the process I have followed on the rest of the plane:

1. Using gloves, I scrub the parts wet with a #7447 (maroon) Scotchbrite pad. Usually, I set up a plastic folding table outside and use a hose to keep the parts wet and rinsed.

2. Still with gloves, I wash the parts with a green Scotchbrite and Dawn dish washing liquid to remove most of the gray residue and any oil/grease from the parts. (The gloves are to protect the parts from me - not the other way around).

3. I let the parts air dry. Then just before priming (always within just a few hours of the wet abrading), I wipe the parts down with acetone (using gloves - obviously). I typically use Scott paper towels/rags in the pull out box. I keep wiping the parts down until the wipes quit coming up with gray residue.

4. Shoot the parts with primer.

I actually shoot the primer indoors. Early in the build, I built a "painting table" that is basically 6' x 3-1/2' wire grid surface over a baffled box with a filter and fan pulling air down through the grid surface. This takes care of controlling most of the over spray. I also have a 24" industrial ventilation fan and exhaust vent built into the wall that takes care of any fumes. As a result, I can actually shoot the primer without any respirator (except when I have to shoot larger parts that don't fit on the painting table).

In my experience, this process yields better results than my previous method. The primer seems to adhere much better than it did to the Alodined surface. After it has fully cured, it is virtually bulletproof. I have yet to find a solvent that will touch it and it is very scratch resistant.

YMMV
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  #9  
Old 04-02-2011, 07:26 AM
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Rick6a Rick6a is offline
 
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Location: Lake St. Louis, MO.
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anitech View Post
To all that have used the AKZO primer I am interested in your preparation techniques and also the PPE used during spraying. Any comments or insights would help....Thxs Steve
In keeping with the manufacturing processes favored by my long time employer McDonnell-Douglas (and used on the venerable Piper Comanche for that matter), I primed all parts individually, prior to assembly. I did not use alodine, acid etch, Alumiprep or any other chemical preparation on alclad parts. To promote adhesion, surface prep was nothing more than lightly scuffing the metal surfaces with a maroon scotchbrite pad followed by a mild soapy water bath and rinse. Before applying Akzo, I typically gave those surfaces a final wipedown using MEK to remove any remaining surface contaminants. That's about it.

When I built the -6A I used a traditional paint gun to shoot Akzo and that worked well enough but cleanup was always a time consuming pain. When I built the -8, I used a small touch-up primer pistol exclusively. Using 35mm film canisters, I proved that simple syphon delivery system could be used quite successfully even on larger parts and cleanup couldn't have been any quicker or easier.




For additional details on the materials and techniques I used, see post #13 submitted on this fairly recent thread:

http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...ad.php?t=66672
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  #10  
Old 04-02-2011, 01:31 PM
Anitech Anitech is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Valencia, CA
Posts: 23
Default AKZO

Thank you all so much!

It sounds like I am on the right track and appreciate all your help.

I look forward to being able to post some results here soon.

Steve
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