What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

RV-12 Oil dripped stained beautiful frnt wheel pan

danielabernath

Well Known Member
I had two A and P men change my oil.
Oil has dripped out (many, many drips of oil on both sides and the trails of the oil as they head to the tarmac) and ruined the beautiful blue and white paint job.
Is there anything or technique to remove the stains?
This is a "before" picture.
If you like, I'll give you what the horror looks like now.
:eek:
n262ws.jpg
 
You might try a product called "Goof Off". My neighbor got avgas stain out of the paint on his new Legend Cub when nothing else would work.

Mitch
 
I've had oil drip on pants. No big deal, a little WD40 will clear it up. I've never heard of oil staining a good paint job.
 
That is a huge amount of oil. Something is definitely wrong...as noted, likely culprit is the crush gasket, but could be anywhere.

Don't start the engine! Decowl, find the source of the leak, call the "A&P mechanics" and have them explain.
 
With that much oil likely they over filled it. Take the cap off the oil sump. Turn the prop by hand several times and see if the oil comes up to the top of the sump. Are you burping it before engine start.
 
Goof Off removes oil stains!

I tried motor car gas (mo gas).
I tried WD40.
Nothing worked
Goof Off is a fine product.
You can see that it came right off like rain from a windshield.(picture)
12079718_10205013275747331_1187130136074590658_n.jpg

One portion appears to be where hot oil struck and burned/baked the paint.(picture)https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=fb71ea4d330792ec2e5dccd1760ea113&oe=56A0F329
I checked the oil and it is at the bottom of the stick. (picture)https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=df1fde219bd5d02a7862d93a2b582acb&oe=5697D505
The oil puddle under the airplane is fresh oil and big LOOK AT TOP LEFT for my oil stained fingers(picture)https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=830d7cc2f93a3d9f05701d77febe56d3&oe=565D9B11
I put Goof Off in the picture because it is the champion.
As I was putting these drip protector on, TWO nearly clear oil drops hit the top of my hand
12036594_10205013272947261_4209538740438466185_n.jpg
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Fixing the wheel pant is one thing, but *you still haven't identified the source of the leak*.

Once again...DECOWL AND INVESTIGATE.

If the mechanics left out a gasket, or failed to tighten the drain plug, or whatever, then you need to have a chat with them. If they were paid for their service, and didn't do it right, I'd be talking about the cost of repainting the wheel pant.

If it was volunteer work, then well, you get what you pay for. Learn to change your own oil.

In any case, the wheel pant is the least of the issues here. You can always sand it down and have it repainted.
 
Thank you gentlemen. You are like having 50 big brothers. The mechanic has not returned my phone calls nor called after I visited his office twice.
Strange, eh?
I shall learn to change my own oil.
I shall pursue this AND the substance put into my fuel system. I was told by them that there is no natural way for 2.5 to 3 inches of substance to be in the fuel on an RV 12 unless someone put it there.
Restraining order shall be sought this week.
 
Fuel system?

I've been following this thread. I don't remember a mention of the fuel system in earlier posts. What is that about?
 
Thank you gentlemen. You are like having 50 big brothers. The mechanic has not returned my phone calls nor called after I visited his office twice.
Strange, eh?
I shall learn to change my own oil.
I shall pursue this AND the substance put into my fuel system. I was told by them that there is no natural way for 2.5 to 3 inches of substance to be in the fuel on an RV 12 unless someone put it there.
Restraining order shall be sought this week.

"Substance" in the fuel system? What the...?

Find yourself someone local who has an RV who can show how to *properly* do an oil change...you're in Portland, there should be quite a few around who can help teach you.

Then get the Rotax Owner's Manual out and start reading...educate yourself on the rest of the thing that keeps you in the air.

Let us know what you find when you decowl. And whatever this fuel thing is all about that you just mentioned...
 
Last edited:
"Substance" in the fuel system? What the...?

Find yourself someone local who has an RV who can show how to *properly* do an oil change...you're in Portland, there should be quite a few around who can help teach you.

Then get the Lycoming Owner's Manual out and start reading...educate yourself on the rest of the thing that keeps you in the air.

Let us know what you find when you decowl. And whatever this fuel thing is all about that you just mentioned...

Looked like a Rotax oil tank to me. The oil change is a bit more complicated due to the dry sump system and the need to purge the system afterwards. There are several good videos and service instructions available on the Rotax owners web site. There is a drain plug on the bottom of the crankcase but that should not be removed under normal circumstances - only the filter is replaced and the crush washer on the drain plug at the bottom of the tank.

Krea Ellis
 
No one should be blissfully ignorant.
I've taken the 2 day "light sport mechanic" course. Nearly worthless.
Seabring in Florida has a 2 day course on Rotex and I'm looking at that one. Yes. I must edumecate my mind fully on these matters. Dan at KFMY
calvin-and-hobbes-its-true-hobbes-ignorance-is-bliss.jpg
 
Fuel thing; 2 l/2 to 3 inches of brown substance in fuel tester. Thought I got it all out. Went up with a CFI and we had to make er landing as with nose up she only got to 4400 or so.
A and P man says there is no natural way to get that into the system.
I'll leave it at that for now but have official things I am doing.
?Gas cap can not let water in-certainly not that amount
?Gas cap is solid O ring fit
?No way rusty looking substance could be produced as no iron in fuel--looks to be plastic gas tank and aluminum tubing.

Thats all the mystery clues you get for now. I posted about this earlier and will keep you up to date, gentlemen.
 
Must get more info on the powerplant. Lockwood at Sebring Florida offers courses. I've already done the light sport repairman-inspector course.
Here is what Lockwood says:
"Rotax 4-stroke engine training is now done in three levels.

The first is Service Training. It covers the engine systems, operational issues, routine service, and inspections - including the condition inspection (100 hour or annual).

Hands on Training It is intended for the Light Sport operator/owner and as an introductory course for homebuilders and licensed maintainers.
The second course is Maintenance. It continues deeper into engine systems and installation issues, troubleshooting and major component disassembly. It is intended for homebuilders and licensed maintainers."
 
Fuel thing; 2 l/2 to 3 inches of brown substance in fuel tester. Thought I got it all out. Went up with a CFI and we had to make er landing as with nose up she only got to 4400 or so.
A and P man says there is no natural way to get that into the system.
I'll leave it at that for now but have official things I am doing.
?Gas cap can not let water in-certainly not that amount
?Gas cap is solid O ring fit
?No way rusty looking substance could be produced as no iron in fuel--looks to be plastic gas tank and aluminum tubing.

Thats all the mystery clues you get for now. I posted about this earlier and will keep you up to date, gentlemen.

If you are using auto gas I sure hope you are filtering the gas before putting in your RV-12. I made an unplanned landing in a pasture with one of my planes due to mud/silt/crud in autogas. I've ALWAYS used a Mr. Funnel from then on when putting autogas in my planes.
 
Last edited:
If you are using auto gas I sure hope you are filtering the gas before putting in your RV-12. I made an unplanned landing in a pasture with one of my planes due to mud/silt/crud in autogas. I've ALWAYS used a Mr. Funnel from then on when putting autogas in my planes.

Thank you. I will do that. Page Field swears that no water in their tanks. They have the paperwork to prove it!

You mean the A&P who did your oil change? That ended up all over the floor and your wheel pant?

Wow. I see your point. Thanks for hitting me in the head with the 2x4.
 
The facts:
a and p men say oil in the cylinder (although I have pic of no oil-see previous post).
He burps and then shows me oil. Magic?
One complains that airplane has cameras on it now. Cameras were installed AFTER they said they finished the job-so you figure that out.
They say that "maybe" they over filled the oil.
They point out and show that the nipple on gasolator is dripping. I see the drip; yes it is dripping fuel.
They say it just wears out. Must have just worn out at this time, they say. I say "res ipsa loquitur*- "The thing speaks for itself"-in your custody, worked fine before, not broke. You had it and were working it and now it is broke.
Mysteries:
How can motor car gas fuel put brown onto pant?
How can motor car gas fuel be so hot that it burns and bubbles up the surface of the white paint?
(picture previous post).
No answer from them.
Say 'maybe' some oil got in with the gasoline.
The result: no charge. They will repaint the pant and replace nipple of gasolator. (but not their fault, they say but MIGHT have bumped it but they wear out, ya know)
They will fly the plane with me. Hows that for a guarantee?
*res ipsa loquitur

(rayz ip-sah loh-quit-her) n. Latin for "the thing speaks for itself," a doctrine of law that one is presumed to be negligent if he/she/it had exclusive control of whatever caused the injury even though there is no specific evidence of an act of negligence, and without negligence the accident would not have happened. b) While under anesthetic, Isabel Patient's nerve in her arm is damaged although it was not part of the surgical procedure, and she is unaware of which of a dozen medical people in the room caused the damage. Under res ipsa loquitur all those connected with the operation are liable for negligence.
 
The facts:
a and p men say oil in the cylinder (although I have pic of no oil-see previous post).
He burps and then shows me oil. Magic?
One complains that airplane has cameras on it now. Cameras were installed AFTER they said they finished the job-so you figure that out.
They say that "maybe" they over filled the oil.
They point out and show that the nipple on gasolator is dripping. I see the drip; yes it is dripping fuel.
They say it just wears out. Must have just worn out at this time, they say. I say "res ipsa loquitur*- "The thing speaks for itself"-in your custody, worked fine before, not broke. You had it and were working it and now it is broke.
Mysteries:
How can motor car gas fuel put brown onto pant?
How can motor car gas fuel be so hot that it burns and bubbles up the surface of the white paint?
(picture previous post).
No answer from them.
Say 'maybe' some oil got in with the gasoline.

I call BS on that. "Maybe" some oil got in with the gasoline? HOW?

Did you find any oil leaks on your engine when you decowled it?
 
Saw no oil leaks on engine when de-cowled. I saw brown under hole where I put the gasoline checker tube.
https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=f2a71ac74a431a2e7c972e8b9bb96914&oe=56A4DC1F
They said if it lost oil then it would have been a very big mess. I pointed out the fresh oil on the tarmac but they said it would have been a much bigger mess.
How can gasoline be brown? Mystery eh?
So, they are going to fix and then do a test ride in the air.
 
Saw no oil leaks on engine when de-cowled. I saw brown under hole where I put the gasoline checker tube.
https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=f2a71ac74a431a2e7c972e8b9bb96914&oe=56A4DC1F
They said if it lost oil then it would have been a very big mess. I pointed out the fresh oil on the tarmac but they said it would have been a much bigger mess.
How can gasoline be brown? Mystery eh?
So, they are going to fix and then do a test ride in the air.

Didn't you have a pic of your oil dipstick showing very low oil (I think you pointed out it was at the bottom of the dipstick)?
 
I still believe they over filled it, easy to do on the Rotax if you don't know what your doing. On the gascolater drip, push up on the valve and spin it a few times. Most of the time it's a piece of minute trash on the seal and that will fix it. Sometimes not.

The fuel is a mystery, at some point in the past you managed to find some bad gas. You need to flush the whole fuel system.
 
Saw no oil leaks on engine when de-cowled. I saw brown under hole where I put the gasoline checker tube.
https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=f2a71ac74a431a2e7c972e8b9bb96914&oe=56A4DC1F
They said if it lost oil then it would have been a very big mess. I pointed out the fresh oil on the tarmac but they said it would have been a much bigger mess.
How can gasoline be brown? Mystery eh?
So, they are going to fix and then do a test ride in the air.

Hi all, first I have been a lurker for a while but I decided to reply to this thread. One of my hobbies is restoring old gasoline engines and showing them. I also rebuild all types of carbs for all types of engines. Last in a former life I was an Aviation Machinist Mate in the Navy.

When talking about gasoline one needs to remember that gasoline today consist of hundreds of compounds. Ethanol is only one of them. The newer gas formulations tend to absorb water instead of displace it. that is until the gasoline approaches its maximum saturation, at that point the absorbed water will settle to the bottom of the container or tank and turn a brown color.

the brown layer may or may uniform so several samples may need to be taken , while it will still burn when injected into the cylinder there will be a loss of power, smoke and possibly complete engine shutdown. This is not a huge problem in a car however in an aircraft is a potentially catastrophic issue.

Gasoline has a shelf life of about 90 days in a fuel tank before it begins to degrade. Most fuel systems require venting. Because of venting atmospheric air is introduced into the tanks, in very humid climates this will also be a significant source of moister. Due to temperature changes and the expansion and contraction of the gasoline as the temperature changes a breathing cycle occurs, this allows more moisture to be introduced to the tanks.

In reading this and other post by the OP I saw that his RV-12 has been parked for several months, exposed to the weather in central Florida. In my opinion this is the reason for his fuel problems. I would drain and flush the fuel system with fresh gas. Then clean or replace all filters. There are several high quality fuel stabilizers on the market, all will cause a slight loss of power when used as directed. They will extend storage time to a maximum of a year when used as directed.

Fuel stored in a light proof air tight container is viable for longer periods of time but all stored gasoline will noticeably degrade after a year of storage.

On his oil issue my first thought was a spill when filling that collected in the bottom of the cowling and slowly dripped onto the wheel and tarmac. However I would remove the cowling and look with a strong flashlight for the spill or leak path. Oil will reflect against the other surfaces under light.
 
I still believe they over filled it, easy to do on the Rotax if you don't know what your doing. On the gascolater drip, push up on the valve and spin it a few times. Most of the time it's a piece of minute trash on the seal and that will fix it. Sometimes not.

Alas, I tried your procedure but it still is drip, drip, drip.
I can find no big oil trail, by the way but I wiped down around the hole to the gasolator (that had oil clinging around it) and the inside as well and anywhere else I could reach using GOOF OFF. ( a great product to remove oil from your painted surfaces).:)
 
Ok, so it's time to replace the valve on the bottom of the gascolator (Aircraft Spruce). Again I think the A & P overfilled the oil, if they did not burp the engine prior to draining then that will happen. The location of the oil also suggest it came from the overflow line. Burp the engine, make sure the oil level is ok and monitor.
 
Mineral spirits or Varsol

Mineral spirits or Varsol should take it off. I have also used turtle wax and a cloth. You could try steam pressure washer some A&P shops have.
Best of luck.
Bones
 
Mineral spirits or Varsol should take it off. I have also used turtle wax and a cloth. You could try steam pressure washer some A&P shops have.
Best of luck.
Bones
Goof Off has taken off all the oil dripping.
But the oil was hot in one area and burned the paint. It is brown there and a rough feel as if the heat micro-blistered the paint. So that is permanent.
The mech's say they will buff it out and repaint the white that has the baked and micro-blistered paint.
 
The location of the oil also suggest it came from the overflow line.
That makes sense as I can find no oil trail anywhere.

So, they didn't burp before they drained the oil.
They changed the oil.
Ran the aircraft for 20 minutes and
the hot oil came out of overflow line and hit the pant, burning the paint.

That 'splains everything on that issue.
 
Back
Top