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  #21  
Old 01-31-2020, 07:11 PM
74-07 74-07 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 684
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Danny,
Pretty darn close:

Throttles ? Idle

Rudder and Ailerons ? Neutral

Stick ? Abruptly full aft and hold

Rudder ? Abruptly apply full rudder opposite spin direction (opposite turn needle) and hold

Stick ? Abruptly full forward one turn after applying rudder

Controls ? Neutral after spinning stops and recover from dive
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  #22  
Old 01-31-2020, 07:20 PM
luddite42 luddite42 is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 74-07 View Post
Over 1000 hours instructing in T-37s. Not really interested in debating what I did for years. Just thought it may be interesting to some people. Ask anyone that went thru UPT to recite the T-37 single spin recovery bold face items. Guarantee they will know it. Sorry for bringing it up and interrupting an obvious expert.

Note to all RVers. Do not use anything I've said concerning an Air Force airplane I flew over 40 years ago to try to recover your out of control RV. There, that should fix it.

Geez
Gotcha - Not trying to step into your T-37 world which I have zero experience with, but you didn't make it clear that your additional comments were limited this context only. I was just trying to make sure your comments weren't construed as applicable to RVs or the piston acro world in general, which is apples to oranges and really could get folks in trouble who don't have the experience to sort out internet comments on this subject of spin training and safety.
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  #23  
Old 02-01-2020, 06:08 AM
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DanH DanH is online now
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luddite42 View Post
Are you suggesting he should not move the stick forward to around neutral as part of spin recovery? Holding the stick full aft and waiting for the spin to stop with rudder only before unloading the stick to break the stall is NOT something anyone should learn as an acceptable or preferred spin recovery method.
...unless the subject is a classic J-3 or L-4. Solo, aft CG, the most effective recovery is indeed full back stick until rotation stops. Allow the stick to float forward (it takes some muscle to keep it full aft) and you'll add a few rotations to the recovery.

It's in the original WWII Army manual for the L-4, and I tried it both ways. Trivia really, not necessarily true for an RV, and apparently the opposite of the T-37. Point is that in addition to universal technique, it's worth asking if the subject aircraft varies from the norm. The OP is doing the right thing by asking around about the RV-14.
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Last edited by DanH : 02-01-2020 at 06:14 AM.
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  #24  
Old 02-01-2020, 08:46 AM
luddite42 luddite42 is offline
 
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Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanH View Post
...unless the subject is a classic J-3 or L-4. Solo, aft CG, the most effective recovery is indeed full back stick until rotation stops. Allow the stick to float forward (it takes some muscle to keep it full aft) and you'll add a few rotations to the recovery.
Interesting - I had a J-3 at one point and spun it a bunch. It always popped out of a spin nearly instantly just by neutralizing the stick and rudder. Keeping the stick full aft definitely did not recover spins more efficiently at normal solo W&B, but I never tried loading up the baggage compartment to see how full aft CG affected the spin recovery. I have no reason to dispute what you say.

But yeah, PARE is the best universal starting point for any airplane that is safely spinnable and you can tune it from there depending on aircraft-specific characteristics.
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  #25  
Old 02-01-2020, 02:02 PM
DMFenster DMFenster is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Woodbridge, VA
Posts: 129
Default 37 BOLDFACE

It's been 30 years but I still remember the BOLDFACE

THROTTLES IDLE.
RUDDER AND AILERONS NEUTRAL.
STICK ABRUPTLY FULL AFT AND HOLD.
RUDDER ABRUPTLY APPLY FULL RUDDER OPPOSITE SPIN DIRECTION = OPPOSITE TURN NEEDLE - AND HOLD.
STICK ABRUPTLY FULL FORWARD ONE TURN AFTER APPLYING RUDDER.
CONTROLS NEUTRAL AFTER SPINNING STOPS - RECOVER FROM DIVE.
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  #26  
Old 02-01-2020, 02:23 PM
74-07 74-07 is offline
 
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Location: Greenville, SC
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Very good Lt.
You get to fly today and no snack bar duty!
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  #27  
Old 02-01-2020, 04:11 PM
TASEsq TASEsq is offline
 
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Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gen1313 View Post
Trent, I was with Peter Townsend from Aussie Aerobatics in Bankstown. He has been excellent.
He?s a top bloke. Bring a plastic snake on your next flight and float it up in front of him at some point - his reaction should be awesome! (Wear ear plugs) 🤣
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  #28  
Old 02-01-2020, 04:30 PM
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donaziza donaziza is offline
 
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Location: Atlanta
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Its been a million years, but talk about weird spin recovery. Navy T-28--(big engine--same as a DC 3 if I recall) I seem to remember stick full forward, then a "L" shape---right or left, depending on which way one was spinning. (RV's are a lot safer)

Last edited by donaziza : 02-01-2020 at 05:31 PM.
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  #29  
Old 02-01-2020, 06:34 PM
sandifer sandifer is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 667
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Here's what T-37 spin recovery technique looks like in normal acro planes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBQWZCKYWO4
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  #30  
Old 02-02-2020, 05:56 AM
74-07 74-07 is offline
 
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Exactly what a T-37 will do if you hold the stick forward too long. Saw it several times with students.

As I said before, my comments in no way recommend this recovery in RVs. It's not what I've done in any of the three RVs I've owned to date. I just interjected what I thought was an interesting contrast to the planes we now fly.

So, one more time then I'm out.

To all RVers: do not attempt to conduct or repeat any flight technique, recovery method, or semi-interesting discussion item seen from this writer. This includes (but is not limited to) in your home, your car, at your desk, in any other recreational or professional activities or at your local VFW or Moose Lodge.
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