Instrumentation....

Anybody know the minimum requirements for instrumentation for my 4...and what is the cheapest route to go to make this happen...thx

See thread

There is a good thread about Cheapest IFR platform If you mean VFR, you have to be more specific. Use the search function; I can't figure out how to give you the link.
h

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/search.php?

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=4256&highlight=cheapest

If all you want is VFR, you'd be surprised how little you can get away with. Minimum VFR equipment is listed in the FARs.

The Citabrias I used to fly had turn@bank, RPM, Alt., Airspeed, Magnetic Compass. They also had an old Apollo GPS/Com (that you can't get anymore...Garmin has an updated one...forget what it's called) and a transponder. If all you're doing is VFR, you'd be surprised how usuable this combination is. More than sufficient for getting from point A to point B even with a few braincells misifiring.

jcoloccia said:

If all you want is VFR, you'd be surprised how little you can get away with. Minimum VFR equipment is listed in the FARs.

The Citabrias I used to fly had turn@bank, RPM, Alt., Airspeed, Magnetic Compass. They also had an old Apollo GPS/Com (that you can't get anymore...Garmin has an updated one...forget what it's called) and a transponder. If all you're doing is VFR, you'd be surprised how usuable this combination is. More than sufficient for getting from point A to point B even with a few braincells misifiring.

Click to expand...

The radio and T&B are optional and not required. Fuel gauges are required.

f1rocket said:

The radio and T&B are optional and not required. Fuel gauges are required.

Click to expand...

And you also need oil temps

Actually, there's a reason you want the T&B. It lets you do BFR's in your own plane if your CFI insists on hood time.

I know it's strictly more than the minimum but the bare minimum doesn't get you very far. The transponder/GPS/Com combination will get you into any airport in the country (except for a couple, and a G1000 won't get you into those)

FAR 91.205 specifies minimum instrument requriments. The minimum required for day VFR is the absolute minimum you can get by with.

1) Airepeed indicator.
2) Altimiter.
3) Magnetic compass.
4) Tachometer.
5) Oil pressure gauge.
6) Oil temperature gauge.
7) Fuel quantity gauge for each tank.

Dave Cole
RV-7 wings

instrumentation...

are there any companies out there that sell these instruments by set etc?????

truss said:

are there any companies out there that sell these instruments by set etc?????

Click to expand...

http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/D100Announcement.html

Check this out. The FlightDek-D180 at $3200 (you have to add probes) is a real bargain. Full glass panel and engine monitoring for < $4000. No gyros to wear out for acro. No vacuum. If all you're doing is VFR, I don't think you need much else in your panel.

Originally posted by truss
are there any companies out there that sell these instruments by set etc?????

Click to expand...

Van's sells all of these items with markings apropriate to your airplane. And for a >whole lot< less than a $4000 glass panel.

Dave Cole
RV-7 wings

Dave Cole said:

Van's sells all of these items with markings apropriate to your airplane. And for a >whole lot< less than a $4000 glass panel.

Dave Cole
RV-7 wings

Click to expand...

Not Really....Here's a really quick run of the number for comparision on all Van's gauges verses the Dynon combo unit.

Altimeter: $ 205
ASI: $158
VSI: $125
T&B: $310
Electric Attitude Indicator: $1150
Electric Directional Gyro: $1150

Engine Gagues -

Tach & Sender: $100
MP:$72
Oil Temp: $40
Oil Press: $70
Fuel Gauges: $68
Fuel Pressure: $70
Volt Meter: $34
Amp Meter: $50
CHT: $44 (Only covers 1 cylinder)
EGT: $44 (Only covers 1 cylinder)
EGT/CHT Switch (to show 4 cylinders): $400
Probes for all 4 Cylinders EGT/CHT: $360

Total of all the above: $4450

If you take it as an "Apples to Apples" comparision - as you should do when doing a fair review you'll see the prices aren't that far apart, in fact if you were to spend another $200.00 on the Dynon, you'll have then Fuel Flow as well.

If you don't keep the comparisions even, then it's unwise to compare unlike items. Yes, you can do it a whole lot cheaper with Van's stuff, but not if you buy the same stuff to make it equivalent to the Dynon Combo Box (aka Flight Dek)....

It's always hard to do an even comparitive review of analog verses digital stuff, because the functionality varies so wildly...but...everyone should try to keep things close to equal when doing comparisions or telling people which way to go.

....and no....I don't own one of the fancy color engine monitors in my RV6 (not a lot out there when I built it)....lot's of round gauges...but the next plane will have an Engine monitor for sure.

2nd thing, since this is in the RV4 area, one should point out that you simply cannot fit the whole assortment of Van's gauges into the RV4 panel even if you wanted to. We're rebuilding a wrecked RV4 for an insurance repair right now, and we'll be installing a new GRT EFIS/Engine Monitor combo in the panel. The Dynon Combo was a close choice, but the customer wanted the NAV Functionality that the GRT offered so that's what were doing and the FlightDek isn't shipping yet so it didn't match the time schedule.

No flames intended, just trying to keep everything equal!

Cheers,
Stein.

Instrumentation

Hi Truss
I was thinking along the same lines as you and this is how my panel turned out

Dayton Murdock said:

Hi Truss
I was thinking along the same lines as you and this is how my panel turned out

Click to expand...

very nice panel....where and how much for the panel you have...very nice work...todd

Cost

Hi todd
Here is the break down

Insturments 197.00

Tach, V/S, A/S 423.53

Altimeter 200.00

Fuel Gage 355.03

Compass 176.00

Apollo 360 GPS 620.00

KY97A Com Radio 894.00

KT76ATransponder 710.00

A.H. Gyro 808.00

Total Expenses: 4,383.56

I hope all of this helps

Here's a picture of my panel as it looked a few months ago. I've since put in a row of switches, ELT indicator, and a nice little swivel arm thingy on the far right to hold a Garmin 196.



The costs so far are:

ASI $128
ALT $205
VSI $199
G-meter $160
Compass $55
Icom Radio $724
Used Collins Xponder $500
Intercom $198
EIS $877
ADI $1080

TOTAL $4126
(less switches, wires, etc.)

Steve Zicree
RV4

Throttle quadrant

Dayton,

Not directly related to the thread subject, but where did you get the throttle quadrant? It doesn't look quite like the one that Van's sells. It also looks like it has a button on the throttle.

Thanks.
Ken

szicree said:

Here's a picture of my panel as it looked a few months ago. I've since put in a row of switches, ELT indicator, and a nice little swivel arm thingy on the far right to hold a Garmin 196.

The costs so far are:

ASI $128
ALT $205
VSI $199
G-meter $160
Compass $55
Icom Radio $724
Used Collins Xponder $500
Intercom $198
EIS $877
ADI $1080

TOTAL $4126
(less switches, wires, etc.)

Steve Zicree
RV4

Click to expand...

very nice panel also...thx for the reply and info....todd

No CHT or EGT

I'm thinking about going with minimum VFR instrumentation as has been talked about in this thread.

Is it reasonable to have the minimum engine instrumentation (oil temp and pressure) in an RV? Or is CHT or EGT advisable in such tightly cowled airplanes?

Is anyone flying without CHT or EGT?

Hi Michael....

....Very few 150's or Skyhawks that I learned in back in '67 had EGT's or CHT's. Many VFR RV's don't either.

Oil temp/pressure and a tach are all you really need. An altimeter, compass and airspeed are all the basic flight instruments you need. No radio, no transponder is how my 'work' airplane is equipped. With a little planning, you can fly coast-to-coast with this equipment and I've seen it done quite a few times....in J-3's and the like.

FWIW, a GPS with wx sure makes it much easier and safer with weather showing but your original question was the minimum equipment. If your pilotage skills are good, go for the minimum but lay out your panel for future upgrades that you or a future owner may want.

I've ferried probably 50 Cessna Agwagons/agtrucks with this minimum from Wichita to Georgia, all of them NORDO.

Best,

Dave Cole said:

FAR 91.205 specifies minimum instrument requriments. The minimum required for day VFR is the absolute minimum you can get by with.

1) Airepeed indicator.
2) Altimiter.
3) Magnetic compass.
4) Tachometer.
5) Oil pressure gauge.
6) Oil temperature gauge.
7) Fuel quantity gauge for each tank.

Dave Cole
RV-7 wings

Click to expand...

Just for grins, it is interesting to note that FAR 91.205 does not apply to experimental aircraft for day VFR. Our flight limitations only call out FAR 91.205 for night VFR and IFR. It is legal to fly an experimental aircraft in day VFR with no flight instruments.

Legal, yes, but not practical or prudent for an RV.

Here is a good option for you.

$2,500 Complete RV-4 Instrument panel (GPS not included)

Used
EGT/CHT gauge
Transponder (Bendix KT76A)
Transiver (Apollo 704 II Morrow)
Intercom
Alt Encoder

New
Ammeter
Oil temp
Oil Press
Fuel Press
L/R Fuel level
Mechanical Tach
RV-4 Air Speed
Altimeter
VSI
G Meter
Vertical Card (heading Indicator)
Garmin X96 docking station (angled up towards the pilot)
New hardware
New instrument rings

Comes with the wire harness that connects the intercom, xponder and radio.

Vans instruments

Be advised you get what you pay for. I've had two of Van's engine instruments fail and a 3rd going. Pencil out the Dynon systems.