What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Craig Catto Props

LifeofReiley

LifeofReiley

Well Known Member
This guy is on Top. All question asked were answered. Knowledge of RV's and performance numbers understood. After months of research and comparison you can't beat his prop for price, appearance and performance. Ordered mine today... It's good to deal with great professional business people.

Oh... and yes, Thanks Mel for all of your Great Advice! You are a True Asset to the VAF forums hands down!!!!! :)
 
Last edited:
Good choice... but hope you don't have to wait as long as some of the others on the board. What's he quoting on lead time these days? I think I ordered mine in October and received it in mid-March after a lot of emails in the later months.

Best,
 
Yep, bear that in mind when ordering from Craig. His props are top notch but he is a one man operation and actually has a life so give yourself plenty of time. You won't find a nicer guy to deal with (he's nice in person anyway) and he really knows his stuff.
 
Loooonnng Delivery!

He quoted me 12 weeks on a two blade and 8 months on a three blade. That was about two weeks ago! Can't beat the performance for the money though.
 
Darrell,

Good choice on a prop. Dittos to all the things others have said about Craig.

Of all the vendors that I dealt with during the build process Craig was the only one who was right on projected performance of his product. He projected many items for my prop/engine combo, ie: how much static rpm I would see, how much rpm on take off, how much rpm at cruise, top speed (which I beat)---you get the picture. He has a lot of RV data and must have an incredible data base from which to make projections. The only thing you should be aware of is that he does take a long time to deliver and his delivery times are somewhat "optimistic". He is a one man operation with a family and therefore many other commitments.

That being said, it is worth the wait----light, smooooooth, fast, simple, and absolutely beautiful!!!!

Cheers,

db
 
On Spot!

Thanks! Many of you have shared information about your Aircraft and Catto props with me and it's much appreciated. I have access to other props to fly if need be. It would just require a little more paperwork and test flight time to make the swap. And, I'm up to the challenge as I'm building the plane to FLY. :D

Craig stated the norm for 3 blade delivery time. :eek:
 
Catto Props

LifeofReiley said:
This guy is on Top. All question asked were answered. Knowledge of RV's and performance numbers understood. After months of research and comparison you can't beat his prop for price, appearance and performance. Ordered mine today... It's good to deal with great professional business people.

Oh... and yes, Thanks Mel for all of your Great Advice! You are a True Asset to the VAF forums hands down!!!!! :)
Click to expand...


I talked to Creig last week regarding delivery of my three bladed prop. It will probably be about six months. I had Mike Loehle of Aero Coatings send him some of his flexible paint for the prop. Should work fine. Creig currently has a back log of over 100 RV props. This man is going to be busy for a long time.
Ron Russ RV9A
Holly Springs, GA
 
W&B

Hi Darrell,

I would really like to go the way of Catto. But in talking/listening with/around other builders, there were discussion(s) that a metal prop was favored up front on -7's for better W&B. Don't remember if the conversation were restricted to just -7's or if they included -7A's. Have you heard this?

I've been studying Dan-the-Man's W&B DB (http://www.rvproject.com/wab/) to "see" what is being discussed. But I'm not quite seeing the "point" in the data.

Thanks,
/\/elson
 
David,

Van designed the 7 and 7a to accomodate up to the angle valve (200hp) Lyc and the Hartzell CS prop. If you install the lighter parrallel Lyc and a Catto (my Catto weighs in at a whopping 17 lbs vs the 60+ for the CS) the empty wt cg moves aft. You would therefore have to take this into consideration when loading your plane---which you should do anyway!! However, there are ways around this--check with Sabre Manufacturing. They make up to a 22 lb steel crush plate (vs aluminum) which would be of benefit to an aft cg aircraft with a Catto.

My RV 9a was designed with the smaller engines in mind and therefore has a more forward cg--on the average. You can verify this by checking out Dan's w&b data comparing several 7a and 9a's with similar prop/engine combos.

Hope this helps---any way you go with the RV you will be amazed at the performance.

Cheers,

db
 
Data

Hi David,

Your question can be answers with a few variables cleared. My engine will sit
2 1/2"'s further forward than most RV7 / RV7A's built. This also means the cowling, prop, spinner, 12 holer etc... will also be forward. The weight difference in the props (Sensenich vs Catto 3 blade) is around 19 lbs. Depending on the type/brand starter & alternator you install you can actually be heavier on the nose with the Catto if you wish. The 12 holer will also add 5 oz's over the standard spacer. Hope this helps...
 
W&B may not be an issue if you plan for it

I would really like to go the way of Catto. But in talking/listening with/around other builders, there were discussion(s) that a metal prop was favored up front on -7's for better W&B.
Click to expand...

I am using a three blade catto on a RV-7 with the small rudder. I did use a 10lb crush plate from Sabre to help bring the weight forward, which one could argue negates the weight advantage. Anyway, you still have the option of swinging a CS prop down the road if you go this route. I am really happy how my W&B turned out (My info is on Dan?s web site if you are interested) but it did take some planning.

This is a little off topic but you may find it interesting. I did my spin testing with an acro instructor. My instructor said ?This recovers almost as fast as my Pitts? (S2-B I believe) after 2 turn spins :D This was a very nice surprise since I have the small rudder and a fairly average CG.

Good luck with your descision.
 
Quick note on the CG issue. I purchased a 22 lb prop spacer from Sabre Mfg and that helped a lot. They also have a heavier crush plate if you're interested.
 
"Value added" weight in the nose?

I am a long way from FWF, but am wondering if the rearward CG tendencies of the 7 with a lighter engine / Catto combo up front could be countered, at least somewhat, by more "value added" weight instead of a steel crush plate or other ballast. For example, could you go with a dual alternator setup, which not only adds forward weight, but also can be important redundency if you have an all electric panel? What other options (other than engine/prop) could be worked in forward of the firewall to add useable weight? Room for a second battery?

Of course, the $'s associated with "useable" weight may be much more significant than ballast weight.
 
Good Question!

java said:
I am a long way from FWF, but am wondering if the rearward CG tendencies of the 7 with a lighter engine / Catto combo up front could be countered, at least somewhat, by more "value added" weight instead of a steel crush plate or other ballast. For example, could you go with a dual alternator setup, which not only adds forward weight, but also can be important redundency if you have an all electric panel? What other options (other than engine/prop) could be worked in forward of the firewall to add useable weight? Room for a second battery?

Of course, the $'s associated with "useable" weight may be much more significant than ballast weight.
Click to expand...

Now you're thinking! I'm sure a backup alternator. battery, balancer, cold air induction, plenums etc... could be classified as valued added weight. The list could go on for sure.
 
Believe me guys... I did the math on extra battery, alternator, etc. The prop spacer or crush plate gives you the most bang for the buck in terms of W&B because it's basically as forward as you could put the weight. If I recall, adding a 2nd battery only moved my CG forward about 0.5" (something in that range). From that day on I physically marked on the plane the CG range so when I was building I could see what I was working with.
 
And more questions...

This is all great info guys! Thanks!

Darrell - Is this a custom mount? Sounds like you're having some fun.... ;)

Dave B. - Ahh..that makes sense given that the -7's were also designed for the heavier 360's w/ CS. I'm planning on an IO-360-M1B w/ a FP so I know I'm gonna need some extra weight up front.

Hugh - It took me a little while to figure out what a crush plate was - I take it it's the metal plate on the front of the prop. Does the Catto require periodical re-torqueing since its core is still maple? Or does all the glass keep moisture out of the core? One thing I have not been able to figure out is why would having a crush plate give me the option of turning a CS prop down the road should I decide to?

Scott - Your reference to a 22 lb prob spacer - is this still 2-1/4" or different?

Thanks Guys!
/\/elson
RV-7A - Fuselage
Austin, TX
 
Hugh - It took me a little while to figure out what a crush plate was - I take it it's the metal plate on the front of the prop.
Click to expand...
You got it.

Does the Catto require periodical re-torqueing since its core is still maple?
Click to expand...
Yes it does. I am told that is less susceptible to the torque going out of spec. This is my first non metal prop so I am just repeating what I have heard.

One thing I have not been able to figure out is why would having a crush plate give me the option of turning a CS prop down the road should I decide to?
Click to expand...

One poster suggested a longer engine mount to offset the reduced prop weight, which is actually a very cool idea. The downside is that it makes your FP choice more permanent in that the added weight of a CS prop, should you ever decide to change, may make your ship too nose heavy.

The heavy crush plate brings the CG forward without any airframe modification, like you said it just bolts on to the front of the prop. The downside of this method (as others have pointed out) is that it is just dead weight. Good luck.
 
Questions

David_Nelson said:
This is all great info guys! Thanks!

Darrell - Is this a custom mount? Sounds like you're having some fun.... ;)

Dave B. - Ahh..that makes sense given that the -7's were also designed for the heavier 360's w/ CS. I'm planning on an IO-360-M1B w/ a FP so I know I'm gonna need some extra weight up front.

Hugh - It took me a little while to figure out what a crush plate was - I take it it's the metal plate on the front of the prop. Does the Catto require periodical re-torqueing since its core is still maple? Or does all the glass keep moisture out of the core? One thing I have not been able to figure out is why would having a crush plate give me the option of turning a CS prop down the road should I decide to?

Scott - Your reference to a 22 lb prob spacer - is this still 2-1/4" or different?

Thanks Guys!
/\/elson
RV-7A - Fuselage
Austin, TX
Click to expand...

Hi Dave,

Long time no see!

This is not a custom mount, it's Van's design for my configuration. Way cool! The engine sitting out a little more forward is exactly what I want. I just ordered my 12 holer from Sabre along with an 1 3/8" crush plate. CG issues are resolved. With the extra 2 1/2" forward and the crush plate I'll even be better off than bolting one of those Sensenich props up front. :D
 
LifeofReiley said:
Hi Dave,

Long time no see!

This is not a custom mount, it's Van's design for my configuration. Way cool! The engine sitting out a little more forward is exactly what I want. I just ordered my 12 holer from Sabre along with an 1 3/8" crush plate. CG issues are resolved. With the extra 2 1/2" forward and the crush plate I'll even be better off than bolting one of those Sensenich props up front. :D
Click to expand...


Darrell,
Did you have to specifically ask for this?? I just ordered my finishing kit (RV8A) about a month ago and told them I would be installing an O360-A1A. I also told them to leave out the spinner. I plan on a Catto 3 blade prop and I'm starting to worry about an aft CG. So a longer engine mount might be just what I need as well.
 
Mount

apatti said:
Darrell,
Did you have to specifically ask for this?? I just ordered my finishing kit (RV8A) about a month ago and told them I would be installing an O360-A1A. I also told them to leave out the spinner. I plan on a Catto 3 blade prop and I'm starting to worry about an aft CG. So a longer engine mount might be just what I need as well.
Click to expand...

The mount is for my HP-320 custom built engine. The difference is 320 vs 360. The RV7 engine mount forward is different for this set up by Van's design.
 
Can work

apatti said:
Darrell,
Did you have to specifically ask for this?? I just ordered my finishing kit (RV8A) about a month ago and told them I would be installing an O360-A1A. I also told them to leave out the spinner. I plan on a Catto 3 blade prop and I'm starting to worry about an aft CG. So a longer engine mount might be just what I need as well.
Click to expand...

By the way... it can still work for you. You would buy the mount and cowl for this set-up, but would need to retro the snorkel for a 360.
 
Dayton Murdock said:
Hi Guys
It has been 18 hrs since I re-torqued my catto prop. How many hrs. before re-torqueing?
Click to expand...
I've been running mine just over 3 years now and I check the torque at each oil change. I have not found it to vary.
 
Good Info

Dave,

I ordered my spacer and crush plate from Saber. Sam is a wonder guy to deal with! We did the calculations for my set-up and he special orderd the material for my crush plate. It should be delivered in the next week or so.
 
Sabre is great, I was wondering if anyone has a source for a weight (Steel or lead) that can counterbalence Catto? Putting on a Whiteman W8 Tailwind, and it's getting an Aft CG problem.
 
Try a Landoll ring. He has just a plain jane ring, which I have, or a harmonic dampener. With the smoothness of the Catto, I did not opt for the harmonic dampener.

The Landoll ring that I have puts more weight out front as well as gives more enertia to the otherwise very light prop for better idle.

Regards,
 
Last edited:
apatti said:
Darrell,
Did you have to specifically ask for this?? I just ordered my finishing kit (RV8A) about a month ago and told them I would be installing an O360-A1A. I also told them to leave out the spinner. I plan on a Catto 3 blade prop and I'm starting to worry about an aft CG. So a longer engine mount might be just what I need as well.
Click to expand...

I just bought a rebuilt Lycoming O-360-A1A and Catto 3-blade for my NON-PRIMERED RV-7A. Like many other Catto users I was concerned about an aft CG condition. My solution was to install 1 1/2" diameter 9/16" spacers between the firewall and engine mount. Van's recommended against it and I don't recommend it for any other plane but that is how I tackled the problem on my plane. The 9/16" was more of a SWAG than anything else. Will let everyone know what the Weight and Balance numbers are later this Fall.

Steve Eberhart
RV-7A, Working on Finish Kit stuff
 
Is it not possible to get a longer engine mount? I thought vans had a short, medium and long mount? Maybe I'm remembering things wrong.
 
You may well be right. I called Van's technical support line to discuss the options for being able to use the full C/G range on a very light weight RV-7A. I asked about moving the engine forward and was not told anything about there being different length mounts available. In the Accessories Catalog there are longer throttle and mixture cables listed for the O-320 than for the O-360. I am guessing that is because the mount is longer. Van's recommendation was build it light and to the plans. I should have specifically asked about longer mounts.

Steve Eberhart
RV-7A, Collecting all of the necessary items that make up the finish kit
 
Mounts and Cowls

newtech said:
You may well be right. I called Van's technical support line to discuss the options for being able to use the full C/G range on a very light weight RV-7A. I asked about moving the engine forward and was not told anything about there being different length mounts available. In the Accessories Catalog there are longer throttle and mixture cables listed for the O-320 than for the O-360. I am guessing that is because the mount is longer. Van's recommendation was build it light and to the plans. I should have specifically asked about longer mounts.

Steve Eberhart
RV-7A, Collecting all of the necessary items that make up the finish kit
Click to expand...

The mount for the 0-320 in 2 1/2" 's longer than the 0-360 mount and so is the cowl for the RV7 series. I do not know if the same is offered for any others such as the RV8. I do know you will sign a "special order" form to get the longer mount and cowl as Van's does not stock these items. Call and talk with one of the engineers on your type aircraft.
 
Extension & Crush Plate

I received my 12 holer prop extension and custom build crush plate for my
RV-7A yesterday from Saber MFG. This guy Sam is a true craftsman! Absolutely beautiful... :D

After talking with Sam, we went on the heavy side for the crush plate. The main reason was... in a day I can send the crush plate back to him for adjustment. On the light end, I would be buying another crush plate. We will play with the W&B this way until it's tweaked. And we may just be on the money... :cool:
 
Last edited:
LifeofReiley said:
I received my 12 holer prop extension and custom build crush plate for my
RV-7A yesterday from Saber MFG. This guy Sam is a true craftsman! Absolutely beautiful... :D

:
Click to expand...

Fully agree about Mr Tillman......

My extension is a true work of art. I hate to hide it!
Wife doesn't like it on the coffee table. :)

He's been outstanding to do business with too....even when I had a problem with parts that needed to be exchanged (no fault of his).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top