Condition Inspection Logbook entries?

I find this almost impossible to believe, but next month I am going to have to do the Valkyrie's first Condition Inspection....has it been a year already?!

Quick question for the folks that know the Regs....I have owned certified aircraft for years, and I know that you always need an inspection entry in both the Engine and Airframe logbooks....if I recall, it's an Annual in the airframe,and a 100 hour in the engine.....but hey, I am not an IA, and I may have that wrong...

I have a suspicion that for the homebuilt, with an "experimental" engine, all that I need is an airframe entry, and that there is no corresponding one required in the engine book. Don't get me wrong, I still log the maintenance and such...just curious what the legal requirement is so I don't make a silly looking entry.

Never seen this question asked here before....

Paul

I thought the 100 hour was only required if the aircraft was rented out.

My RV8 has has just one log with engine and airframe info in it.

Condition Inspection Logbook Enteries

Paul...

I have only done one Condition Inspection so my experience is narrow but I have been doing my own work for 38 years. Item 17 of your "Experimental - Amateur-built Operating Limitations" issued by the DAR for your first flight has the phraseology you are looking for. I also looked at entries by IA's on my certified aircraft (Cessna 170...BTW excellant condition & for Sale) and copied some of the format they used. This is derived from a generic inspection form used by an AI which I use as a baseline worksheet for the actual inspection. It is used for my actual hands on inspection and filed in the aircraft's general file for general reference at later dates (read years here) as I have never thrown one away and I have already referred to them for detailed info. many years later.

I also have a large file of all plans, prints, product manuals, work orders, parts lists and all related paperwork on each airplane which suppots the logbook entries which are very condensed by nature. This has been a life saver when AD's appear and the documentation is the only proof you have as to date or part number when the part itself cannot prove its integrety. For example, a 40 year old AD on piston pins missed by all subsequent AI's, was complied with by a part number listed on a 15 year old work order. True, the experimental category relieves the pressure of AD's somewhat (controversy here) but regardless, your butt is still on the line and compliance is probably the best alternative, especially by a paperwork excercise verses a teardown.

Dick DeCramer
N500DD RV6
Northfield, MN

Follow the Operating Limitations....

The operating limitations should have a statement like this....

(23) Condition inspections must be recorded in the aircraft maintenance records showing the following, or a similarly worded, statement: ?I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on [insert date] in accordance with the scope and detail of appendix D to part 43, and was found to be in a condition for safe operation.? The entry will include the aircraft?s total time-in-service, and the name, signature, certificate number, and type of certificate held by the person performing the inspection.

From the EAA web site (members section)

http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/govt/operations.html?

As stated previously, the "aircraft maintenance records" can be much more than the log book. The statement above is appropriate for the log book, with some other means - I like a thick three ring binder(s) - for copies of the actual check lists, replaced parts data, etc.

gil in Tucson

Condition Inspection Logbook Entries

Sorry missed one point. I do maintain an engine logbook but my engine is certified. I do list an annual condition report just as a certified airplane and sign it as in item 17 of my "operating Limitations". I don't believe I would treat an experimental engine differently but I cannot quote any rule on that.

Dick DeCramer
N500DD RV6
Northfield, MN

az_gila said:

?I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on [insert date] in accordance with the scope and detail of appendix D to part 43, and was found to be in a condition for safe operation.? The entry will include the aircraft?s total time-in-service, and the name, signature, certificate number, and type of certificate held by the person performing the inspection.[/I]

Click to expand...

I use the above statement in my airframe log book and also document all work performed; rotate tires, repack bearings, etc.

In my engine logbook, I document that the oil and filter were changed during the performance of the annual condition inspection and I record the compression numbers. I also document any other maintenance or repairs done at the time.

In my prop logbook, I document lubricating the propeller hub in accordance with the manufacturers owners manual during the performanace of the annual condition inspection.

Karl

As probably already mentioned, no 100 hr necessary unless flying for hire. And then you'll need the CFI and an EAA/FAA 7162 exemption for that.

Also, just adding a little commentary here... I subscribe to writing "just the basics" in my logs. I used to think it was good to write lots of detail about my really cool device or modification I just installed. Kind of proud to document my work. Well, in the last 3-4 years, I've changed course and only write the basics.

When I installed my Dynon EFIS, I write in my airframe log "installed Dynon D-10 EFIS as per manufacturer's instructions". More is just hanging me out should the books come under the scrutinty of some regulatory authority or ambulance-chasing lawyer.

2 cents

Bryan has a good point and I agree generally. One exception would be something like an engine overhaul where you should list all work including part numbers. This could save a teardown in case of an later AD that requires a certain part number.

Good Info

All these posts are very helpful information to have. I have a few questions concerning engine replacement to add here. What do you do if you end up with a total engine replacement? What entry is placed in the logs? Do you have to notify the FAA in some way to inform them of the fact that you have replaced the old engine with a completely new engine?

Steve,
It depends on when your operating limitations were issued. You are locked in to those. The current op limits allow you to change engine (as long as you don't change to or from reciprocating to turbo-prop) with a simple logbook entry. You must notify the local FSDO to get concurrence for your flight test area. Your operating limitations should give you details on what is necessary.

New engine operating limitations

Mel said:

Steve,
It depends on when your operating limitations were issued. You are locked in to those. The current op limits allow you to change engine (as long as you don't change to or from reciprocating to turbo-prop) with a simple logbook entry. You must notify the local FSDO to get concurrence for your flight test area. Your operating limitations should give you details on what is necessary.

Click to expand...

Mel,
I guess I am not sure what you mean by "operating limitations". Are you referring to Phase I, Phase II limitations? I guess what I am getting at is, do you have to go through Phase I flyoff again with the new engine? It sounds like your post is telling me there is a new Phase I period of flyoff for the new engine that the FSDO will require. Is this the case?

I am inquiring on this as I replaced an old engine with a new engine (same make, model, type, HP, etc. as the old engine) in my current experimental airplane I am flying now. So, if the engine is an identical replacement with a new from the factory engine is there a new Phase I flyoff I will have to perform?

If you replaced with identical engine; ie same model, same hp, etc. then you just need a logbook entry. If anything else changes, you must follow your op limits. When were your operating limitations issued? Your operating limitations must be in the aircraft at all times. Look at your 8130-7 (airworthiness certificate). It states that "Operating Limitations Dated xx/xx/xxxx are a part of this certificate". Airworthiness Certificate is not valid without the operating limitations.

Mel said:

If you replaced with identical engine; ie same model, same hp, etc. then you just need a logbook entry. If anything else changes, you must follow your op limits. When were your operating limitations issued? Your operating limitations must be in the aircraft at all times. Look at your 8130-7 (airworthiness certificate). It states that "Operating Limitations Dated xx/xx/xxxx are a part of this certificate". Airworthiness Certificate is not valid without the operating limitations.

Click to expand...

The Airworthiness Certificate was issued in Sept '04. I will examine it this evening when I get out to the airport. I did replace the engine with an identical one. It is really a long block replacement as I kept the carbs, exhaust, starter, etc. and just replaced the engine itself. I have made the log book entry already but did not know if I needed to notify the FAA or flyoff any Phase I time again. Thanks for the information.

Ironflight said:

I have a suspicion that for the homebuilt, with an "experimental" engine, all that I need is an airframe entry, and that there is no corresponding one required in the engine book. Don't get me wrong, I still log the maintenance and such...just curious what the legal requirement is so I don't make a silly looking entry.

Click to expand...

Let's say, in a few years, you were to sell me your engine. I would want the engine logbook(s) but not your AC logs. So it seems common sensical to record in both/separate logbooks. I'm clueless on the legalities, but then again common sense and "justice" don't always live in harmony.