D

diamond

Well Known Member
Assume for a minute that you had the desire to fly to Alaska. How practical would it be to fly yourself and a passenger to Alaska in your RV-12? Of course there are better RVs for long c/c, but if you had the desire to fly there occasionally, what do you see as the primary obstacles, if any?
 
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RV12 to Alaska

I have flown to Alaska using the Alaska highway route four times the last two times using my 1956 Cessna 182. It was a little faster than my RV12 and had similar range. The difference was that with two on board we could still carry 250# of camping equipment. bicycles, etc. with no problem. I don't see that it would be a problem if you kept the baggage to a minimum and as usual, kept a eye on the weather. Will I be doing it in the RV12? Probably not...I am not even sure if it is legal to fly an LSA with a sport pilot license into Canada.
 
diamond said:
Tony, are you implying that you would not be comfortable flying your 12 there? If so, is the baggage limitation the only reason?
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The implication is that for flying two people and gear to Alaska, an LSA doesn't make sense, the baggage being too limited.
I might be comfortable going solo in my 12. For peace of mind I would want to carry survival gear, some tools and spare parts like tube and tire, and maybe extra fuel...but I have not studied the trip requirements at all so this is just a guess as to what might be prudent.
Here is a link to an LSA (Kitfox) adventure from Denver to Alaska and back in 2010. http://www.itsys3.com/kitfox/alaska.shtml
The Kitfox uses the same 912ULS but is a high wing which most would say is more suited to the bush.
Tony
 
Hi Mark,

I don?t know much about the 12, for instance range?? If it has the range to get from one airport to the next then I would think it would be fine, My Friend Lee took himself and his wife up there 20+ years ago in what is now my RV-4, they flew the ?trench? and went as far as Bettles Lodge above the Arctic Circle. They speak fondly of the trip and had no problems. Weather is the main obstacle I would think, they met a guy up there with a Cub that ended up getting stuck for two weeks because he was not fast enough to get ahead of some encroaching weather.
 
Well this is a moot point if you have only a Sport Pilot certificate as Tony T pointed out. This is from the EAA Sport Pilot site:

Neither the sport pilot certificate nor the ELSA airworthiness certificate are internationally recognized. In order to fly to Canada as you suggest, you would have to have specific written permission from Transport Canada for both yourself as the pilot and your aircraft in order to operate in Canadian airspace.
 
Peterk said:
And it says that where? That doesn't make sense.
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It says that in the first paragraph of the letter quite clearly, see below:

"Pursuant to section 507.05 of the Canadian Aviation Regulations, this document constitutes a validation of the Federal Aviation Administration Special Airworthiness Certificate - Experimental, for the purpose of operating a United States - registered amateur-built aircraft in Canadian airspace, subject to the following conditions:"

Best regards,
Vern
 
ELSA/EAB

Both are classified in your registration as "experimental". The category for EAB says "am built"; the category for ELSA says "kit built." The Canadian letter does say AW Cert "experimental" - registered "am built." Not sure the Canadians are quite that a___, but they might be. Then again, they are probably as confused about ELSA as most. Obviously they are making a positive move to allow experimental aircraft in their airspace...why would they intentionally exclude the RV12...don't think so.

The medical...still gotta have that one.

And yes, I would do it if they had AVgas or Mogas. I have been around the U.S. in mine on both and it works fine...just change the oil at 25 hours.

On 2nd thought...the mosquitos up there are too big!
 
Peterk said:
Both are classified in your registration as "experimental". The category for EAB says "am built"; the category for ELSA says "kit built." The Canadian letter does say AW Cert "experimental" - registered "am built." Not sure the Canadians are quite that a___, but they might be. Then again, they are probably as confused about ELSA as most. Obviously they are making a positive move to allow experimental aircraft in their airspace...why would they intentionally exclude the RV12...don't think so.

The medical...still gotta have that one.

And yes, I would do it if they had AVgas or Mogas. I have been around the U.S. in mine on both and it works fine...just change the oil at 25 hours.

On 2nd thought...the mosquitos up there are too big!
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I think you would find that in Canada it is much like here, if you do not have any issues like an accident then you may well fly through with no problem, but if you had any problem, just like here their "Fed's" would start by checking your and your aircraft papers and they would soon find that you had an issue of non-compliance with their rules, just like they would here. ELSA is new and our Fed's still do not understand it so we can not expect our northern friends to do any better. As far as I know the RV-12 is the only aircraft that is a kit built ELSA, it is certainly the only one being done in any numbers, we are in the same pot with SLSA's that have converted to ELSA and the over weight ultralights just to add more confusion to the class.

The RV-12 would fly to Alaska just fine, doing it legally is not a simple task.

Best regards,
Vern
 
Does anyone ever just say "screw Canadian regulations" and fly to Alaska over international waters? My calculations show 700 nm from Bremerton WA to Ketchikan Alaska. I assume international waters are 10 miles offshore. You'd have to fly solo with an extra tank in a -12, but maybe within range of other RVs w/o extended tanks.
 
Diamond, I'm not planning on going just find this thread interesting. 10 miles out over the Pacific, and losing an engine doesn't sound like fun to me. Of course in such a case you would hope and pray to make Canadian landfall to survive so why not just write and ask permission to fly over it? If their response is no then fly an airplane that's acceptable to them. If your desire is just to fly the 12 there's a lot of the U.S. to do that in. Just my thoughts.
Dick Seiders
 
I've never flown my own plane to Alaska, but I would fly my RV12 if I wanted to do the trip. I don't think you need a lot of performance to get there, just a reliable aircraft and good judgement. I wouldn't go the water route though, too much distance between friendly dirt for me. I understand you can land anywhere on the Alcan Highway, as long as you don't block car traffic when you park, so you can get close to automobile filling stations. I would modify the aircraft by removing the right-side stick and seat and build in some racks to hold gear. (That's a mod I want to make anyway, there is no place to put a decent load except in the seats)
 
vernhendershott said:
Hi John,

That only works for EAB RV-12's it is not good for ELSA RV-12's.
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The letter in the earlier link is only for Experiment Amateur-Built aircraft. But, there is another standardized validation letter that authorizes operation of LSA aircraft in Canada.

Note: this letter only covers the aircraft. The pilot must hold a pilot certificate that meets internationally recognized standards - e.g. a Private Pilot license or higher. I am not aware of anything that authorizes Sport Pilots to fly in Canada. But, given that the US Sport Pilot certificate seems to be similar to Canada's Recreational Pilot Permit, I would hope that eventually there may be some way to authorize Sport Pilots to fly in Canada. In the meantime, it might be worth contacting one of the Transport Canada regional offices. They might be able to issue a letter authorizing a Sport Pilot to fly in Canada.
 
Also read in another thread that a radio station license would be required as was the case years ago for all of us in the US. True/False??
 
radio station license

AOPA checked with FCC for me and they said you do need a station license and the FCC cost was, as I roughly recall, about $110 - this was a week or so ago. A lot of money for a small piece of paper for which the FCC has only to type in your name, address, and postage.
 
Are 12" numbers required?

2. The nationality and registration marks assigned to the aircraft by the Federal Aviation Administration shall be displayed on the aircraft in accordance with the requirements of the United States;
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Does that mean that 3" numbers are OK and that 12" numbers are not required to fly into Canada?
According to a pilot I know, the biggest hassle occurs when reentering the USA, not when entering Canada.
Joe
 
Mich48041 said:
Does that mean that 3" numbers are OK and that 12" numbers are not required to fly into Canada?
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Canadian Aviation Regulation 202.01 says:

CAR 202.01 said:
202.01 (1) Subject to subsection (2), no person shall operate an aircraft in Canada unless its marks are visible and are displayed

(a) in the case of a Canadian aircraft, in accordance with the requirements of the Aircraft Marking and Registration Standards; and

(b) in the case of an aircraft registered in a foreign state, in accordance with the laws of that foreign state.
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So, if as long as your markings meet the US FAR requirements, you can leave them as-is for a flight in Canada.

JohnF said:
AOPA checked with FCC for me and they said you do need a station license and the FCC cost was, as I roughly recall, about $110 - this was a week or so ago. A lot of money for a small piece of paper for which the FCC has only to type in your name, address, and postage.
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While a Radio Station License may be technically required, no one is ever going to ask to see it. If I were you, I'd not bother getting it.
 
My apologies....

... for posting an incorrect link in my earlier entry. Thank you to Kevin, who has prevented me from carrying the wrong letter in my airplane! The correct link is here, then go get the letter in Word format.

Sorry for the goof. My FSDO friend had told me to go look for the "letter", and that's the first one I found.
 
Jamesey,

If three different Flight Design CT aircraft have been flown around the world, why is England too far??:)
 
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