T

Tom Gan

Member
I am a new Rv-9A builder and have been monitoring the VAF site for about 2 years and this is my first post. I am starting my tail kit in the next three weeks and I need to make some decisions quickly about my workshop location. I?ve scanned the forums and I don?t think that this question has been asked. If the group could please give me guidance and opinions on my specific question that would be great:

Background

Building a RV9-A; Going to Stein Air to build my complete empennage kit in August; Planning to go quick build wings and fuselage; Looking to stay with one workshop location if possible unless there are distinct advantages with combining both options; haven't purchased tools yet.

Workshop Options

1) Finished, heated basement.
Two potential workspaces non adjoining; 22? x 10? with an internal hallway restriction width of 3?2?; one 28? x 12? without hallway restrictions; Walk out basement has steep hill to get to driveway so one time in/out a must; Ceiling height is 8?; good lighting, good electric; Basement entry has a French door 34? with ability to temporarily remove the one stationary door to max opening of w68? x h78?

2) 3 Car garage
1 bay full-time; 2 bays part-time (cars in/out when building); Each bay 9? x 20
No heat/ac, some lighting, good electric; Will have to move out an existing popup camper and store remotely (~75/mth)

Questions

1) Any other major considerations?
2) Where would you build you workshop and why?
3) Restrictions / drawbacks with the basement option? How far can I build before moving?
4) Restrictions / drawbacks with the garage option? How far can I build before moving?
 
workshop options

I would say to go for the garage. when the time comes for you to start using chemicals. fiberglass, sealing fuel tanks, acetone, mek, and so on. imo no matter what precautions you take the smell is going to drift into the house. which I'm sure your wife will not like at all. for people not used to dealing with these things they can be quite overpowering. also noise could be an issue a die grinder running at 10 pm might be better taken out in the garage.
good luck
-K-
 
Either location will be fine IMO. All things being equal, I vote for the basement (the 28 x 12 space) based upon the info you listed, because I like my comfort and HVAC certainly helps in that regard. With the dimensions listed you can go until you need to attach the wings. I'm building in my basement workshop and noise and smells have been pretty much a non-issue, but everyone's situation is unique in that regard. It does help to go with an oiled, belt driven air compressor -- quieter than an oil-less, direct drive by far. Also, I think you'll find riveting the noisest operation you'll perform. If you have tools already you can easily test this to see if noise will be an issue. If it is, then your decision is made for you. If mama ain't happy, no one is. ;)
 
Either

...but look at the amount workspace you will have (garage/basement) once you add in the work bench(es), air copressor, etc. I have 4 benches and I still would like to have more room to work. the many storage boxes for holding the many small parts, nuts and bolts, rivets and clecos take up a good bit of room. I have two tool boxes that I use to hold all of the hand tools because they won't all fit in one box and a peg board for the larger pneumatic stuff (along with other hand tools). I added a 12 foot shelf above two of the work benches to place some of the parts AND I still have parts in the boxes that Van's shipped the sub kits in. Then you have to think about where the finished parts are gonna be stored when they're waiting for the rest of the plane to be built.

I have my tail section in a spare (very full) bedroom and the wings are taking up a lot of space in the shed in my back yard. The fuselage is taking up the one bay of a two bay garage. I have it on a rolling cradle so I can move it around. This allows me to slide it over to the side of the garage and still park mt motorcycle beside it.

Yes, I'm still building this plane in a single bay of a garage.
 
Don't forget that building a metal a/c is very noisy at times, in addition to the chemical issue someone else mentioned. If you have a spouse and/or other family members, they may make your decision for you. :)

Charlie
 
I vote basement!

My wife is much more likely to spend time in the basement with me than the garage. I got her involved in the build and she is a great helper. I have a similar arrangement to what you mentioned and my -6A is stationed in front of the sliding door. I will have to remove the fixed side and tow the plane up the hill too but it is sure much nicer working with HVAC, running water, stereo, TV and a happy wife. One thing to consider is you may need to add some track lighting or additional down lights to really be able to work comfortably. Good luck and welcome to the club.

Paul
 
Basement then Garage then Airport Hangar

I live in Vermont so the basement was much warmer in winter and cooler in summer. I even jigged and sub assembled my RV6 fuselage frame in the basement before moving it to the garage for final assembly. It was too big to move out of the basement in one piece and my wife drew the line at my suggestion of cutting a hole in the basement wall or the living room floor :) I did managed to fenagel the completed wings up the stairs of the basement and out the french doors on to the deck much to everyones surprise.

Btw the garage is a double and the wife's side remained sacrosanct for parking her mom mobile during the several years it took to finish the fuselage skinning and fit out - a small price to pay and an excellent investment for continued marital support. I'd highly recommend it :)

I sweated in the summer in the garage - good for canopy work though - and pulled the temperature bearably above freezing in the winter with a propane fired Reddy Heater. I also did priming in the garage since it was easier to vent by opening both doors - and I did move the mom mobile before starting.

Wing mate and finishing was done at the airport but being half an hour away it was no where near as convenient for that quick 20 minutes of productive effort when the mood would take me in my secret basement laboratory - as the family still refer to it.

Just one builder's experience but it's probably similar to many others. "As needs must" I believe is the saying.

Jim Sharkey
RV6 - Phase 1 Flying
 
As the replies suggest both have their pros and cons. The obvious answer is use both of them.

There are a lot of things you can do in the basement that aren't that noisy (drilling is relatively quiet, deburring holes is very quiet, cussing at mistakes is largely user controllable).

Even riveting, while noisy is a small part of the activity and, if you can get your wife involved as helper mitigates the issue. Carefully planned sessions can mitigate it as well.

I built my RV wings in the basement and enjoyed the AC. I assembled things in garage then hanger. All painting/priming was done in basement/outdoors.

I'd not look at this as an either/or proposition.
 
both/alternates

Good point. That reminded me that I did most of my rib fluting while sick in bed for a few days.
 
Current thoughts from everyones comments

Here is what I'm thinking currently based on everyone comments;

Environmental control - Ability to work ~3 seasons to do priming / canopy fiberglass.

Basement - fullly meets needs
Garage - mostly meets needs, would need supplemental heat.

Space conversion cost / time - Conversion costs to / from workshop

Basement - somewhat meets; cost to remove french door twice; carpets pulled up, pool table relocated / sold.
Garage - Minimal conversion costs; popup camper ongoing relocation cost

Space availiabilty - best overall size / location

Baement - somewhat meets; due to hallway restriction of 3' can't get fusulage there, wings only. One effective workspace. Other one for storage.

Garage - mostly meets; minor inconvenience of pulling cars in/out. largest workspace 27' x 20'.

Fume containment - prevent fumes from entering the house
Basement - can't meet this; although not sure how big a deal this will be.
Garage - fully meets

At this point I'm thinking the following:

Garage - overall best location for building. Get a space heater or work around seasons for canopy / priming work. Put tools / equipment work tables on locking rollers for easy moving around. Easiest way to get from house to airport for final assembly.

Basement - use as storage solution for wings and staging area for parts. potential workshop for wings.

Final criteria is talking to the boss to see how this flies. :)

Thanks so much for everyone's perspective. Any final thoughts please post. And looking forward to contributing to the forum as I gain knowlege and experience with this journey. One more life accomplishment in progress from my bucket list.
 
Basement, For Sure

Tom, You'll get little done in the garage in Doylestown in February or any of the winter months. I'm in Delaware and have been building in my finished walk-out basement for three years. No issues other than the fact that the pool table, ping-pong table, etc. are long gone. I do not have young kids (anymore), so no problemo. My wife actually enjoys having the project where it is, and helps out from time-to-time. The fiberglass stuff is done outside in the warm months and priming (rattlecan) is also mostly shot outside. Before I began, I ran a 20amp line to the basement just for the compressor, made the benches, etc. I am planning to do all I can before moving to a hangar for final assembly. Good luck!

Merrill
 
- forgot to say - our basement is an unfinished concrete cellar so I was free to do with as I wished.
 
Split the Difference

rbibb said:
......The obvious answer is use both of them......
Click to expand...
Not everybody has a spacious or ideal floor plan. Without a walk-out, building the fuselage in my basement was out of the question yet its generally more comfortable work environment allowed me to do just about everything else down there. I don't see this as an either/or proposition. Do whatever works best given your circumstances.

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If you have enough room, leave the pool table in the basement and cover it with some plywood, you'll use up all the table space real fast.
 
Use both. Your comfort level will determine where you work. Nice weather will even put you outside on the back porch.

I would suggest you put the aircompressor in the garage and run a line to the basement.

Since you are just getting started, I suspect the basement will be your first working area for the next year or more. Fuselage will pretty much garantee the garage once you start riveting it together.

Also, if there is a waiting list for a hanger at the airport, put your name on the list. You'll need it later.
 
I built the wings and fuel tanks for my Rv-9A in the basement and also moved the project to the garage for some work. The basement was the best because of the temperature control and no cars going in and out. I used the back part of the basement that was on the far end of the house from the living room and kitchen. No one ever complained about the smell from Proseal and MEK. I did not use the basement for any painting. All that was done in a different location. I have gas heat and a hot water heater in the basement. Paint thinners and pilot lights don't go great together. I do have windows in that portion of the basement that helped with ventilation as well. Over the course of several years of building you will probably move the work space more than once so I would start wherever the conditions are the most pleasent at the time you start work on your project.
 
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