BruceMe

BruceMe

Well Known Member
Hey folks... I need advice,

I have a first run O-320-B2C on my RV-4 with 2050 TTSN & 500 STOH. Compressions are all 74/76, no oil consumption, no metal, good temps. I am selling the aircraft and the high hours are scaring potential buyers.

I have a few options:

- Factory overhaul: Complete waste of money as almost all the parts are very new
- An Overhaul shop (Penn Yann,etc) fixed bid: Almost as wasteful as factory, save a little
- Overhaul shop hourly: Because most parts are near yellow tag, I stand a good chance of saving a lot... but because it's nolonger a fixed bid, I could get bent over.
- Field overhaul ala Bubba the local A&P and engine monkey: Unknown... probably a bad idea, will scare off buyers.
- DIY: I probably _CAN_ do it, will save HUGE $ $ $, but I need to find a bubba and I will likely scare off even more buyers.

Does anyone have a better idea? I'm leaning towards Option 3 above; sending it to an overhaul shop that has great reviews and does honest work. Cause this will require a lot of trust... We're talking engines, I've never seen a jug off a Lycoming that didn't cost $4000 to put back on (pretty please).

-Bruce
 
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Personally I think it would be a real shame to overhaul an engine in this condition. A high time engine fails gradually. A freshly overhauled engine can fail without warning. A properly cared-for engine can run beautifully well past the 2500 hr mark.
When I bought my engine it had over 2500 hrs. I ran it another 300 hrs without problem. When I tore it down for overhaul (for HP increase), everything met "new" tolerances.
 
Mel said:
Personally I think it would be a real shame to overhaul an engine in this condition. A high time engine fails gradually. A freshly overhauled engine can fail without warning. A properly cared-for engine can run beautifully well past the 2500 hr mark.
When I bought my engine it had over 2500 hrs. I ran it another 300 hrs without problem. When I tore it down for overhaul (for HP increase), everything met "new" tolerances.
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! ! ! 150% agreement ! ! ! Preach to my buyers. This is a beautiful engine just the way it is.
 
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It's almost certain you will never get back the overhaul cost when you sell the plane. It would be better to reduce the selling price a little if necessary to catch the attention of an informed buyer.

Sounds like you have a healthy engine with many good hours remaining, an informed buyer will appreciate what you have.

Hang in there and good luck with the sale!
 
I'm in definite agreement with Mel and Sam

A friend has a Skyhawk parked next to my hangar with a 160 Lyc on it and he just went 3,000 SMOH and it had good compressions and very little oil use and probably could have gone a few hundred more hours.

I suggested that since he got 50% more time than the recommended 2,000 hours, to play it safe and go through it. Lyc's can be that good:)

Best,
 
As Sam said, you won't get that money back.. so it makes no sense to do it.. you'd be better off reducing the price some. Buyers don't value local A&P overhauls.. they want factory or a name-shop job (but don't wanna pay for it :) )

Either way, there's little difference between #2 and 3... and 3 won't be more than 2 (if it is, you're getting screwed). That fixed bid isn't so fixed if you have a bad crank or case :) Make sure you clearly understand the assumptions before a nasty surprise happens.

It's tough to sell a plane with a runout engine... yet it's nearly impossible to get those 15 grand back if you were to OH it and then turn around and sell immediately.


Good luck!
 
Yup, to all the fine advice given...

My Bucker's 0320 is pushing 2300 hours. Flew it yesterday. Prrr's like a kitten. I only fly it about 30-50 hours a year. I intend to get another ten years out of this engine.
Wait for the right buyer.
 
Question

What would an insurance company do if you ran an engine beyond TBO and the engine fails in flight one day and you ball up your plane landing in a field? Can they use this as a reason to not pay your claim?
 
It's not cast in stone....

....only what the manufacturer suggests that you could reasonably expect the engine to go those hours. There's no mandatory overhaul when the engine is used in an experimental.....nor as a private individual.

Best,
 
topgun260 said:
What would an insurance company do if you ran an engine beyond TBO and the engine fails in flight one day and you ball up your plane landing in a field? Can they use this as a reason to not pay your claim?
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Really good question, curious too.

To the OP, I would def just drop the price rather than overhaul. Leaves the buyer the option to do what they please, and you're not going through the pain of doing it yourself on a plane you're just getting rid of anyway. The right, informed buyer will come along and snatch it up.
 
Where is the for sale ad?

Just curious about the plane for sale. Didn't see an ad listed and was wondering what is the asking price, options/equipment, pictures etc. . Maybe someone cruising here or someplace like barnstormers is looking for just this airplane.
 
topgun260 said:
What would an insurance company do if you ran an engine beyond TBO and the engine fails in flight one day and you ball up your plane landing in a field? Can they use this as a reason to not pay your claim?
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Insurance companies don't care about TBO. TBO is a suggested time between overhauls. It is not required by any part 91 operations. As long as the engine passes compression and oil usage, you can run it forever.
 
Send me the info on your plane. Trying to convince a buddy to by an RV. Got him looking at -4s.
 
badmrb said:
Just curious about the plane for sale. Didn't see an ad listed and was wondering what is the asking price, options/equipment, pictures etc. . Maybe someone cruising here or someplace like barnstormers is looking for just this airplane.
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I had an ad in BS two weeks ago, I let it expire because I wasn't getting the response I wanted and the plane isn't ready. But...

RV-4 FASTBACK • $38,000 • FOR SALE CHEAP • Great value in great flying. Built in 2008. IO-320 160hp 2050 TTSN, 500 STOH, great compressions 74-76, low oil consumption, Sterba prop, 50TT airframe, built 920lbs light and fastback, unpainted as Van intended. Dynon DA10, EIS-4000 engine monitor, MicroAir transponder/transceiver, mounted Garmin 196 included. Fresh annual included, Kansas City, $38,000 obo.

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For more pictures click here
 
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Personally i'd be less scared by the engine condition than by the fact that it's not finished. The engine condition sounds fine to me. But based on the research I was doing last November before I bought my -6, that looks like a fair price, at least if the airframe looks as good in person as it does in photos. I've always liked the look of the fastback -4's.

The problem is that most people looking to buy a finished airplane are looking for a *finished* airplane. Paint, interior, etc. all need to be there, and on this one it's not. A buyer will need to drop another $10K at least to finish it off, and it'll take some time. So someone looking at that is thinking ~$50K net, plus 6 months of work. Compare to what's available for that price, finished, and you'll see why they aren't interested.

Just my opinion... It does look like a nice -4 project to me.
 
BruceMe said:
I had an ad in BS two weeks ago, I let it expire because I wasn't getting the response I wanted and the plane isn't ready. But...
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I think that is your problem, not the engine.

Don't attempt to sell a plane as ready to fly until it is........ready to be flown home (and displayed with pride!) by the new owner. :)
 
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