R

RScott

Well Known Member
Looking into strobes but I need a course in strobology. I know almost nothing about strobes, but have been learning in bits & pieces. I haven’t found a comprehensive description of what you really need to know to put a system together.

The price of strobes is crazy--$825 from Van’s, but as usual, they aren’t the most expensive source. I’ve been looking at options such as a kit from Strobes ‘N More, but I just generate questions when doing so:

1. How many joules energy output is really needed? The System 6 puts out 21 joules at each light if operated simultaneously or 42 if alternated according to Whelen info for the power supply. Van’s sells this power supply for $390 and the list from Whelen is $537. I figure a lot of this price is in certification. The Strobes ‘N More Nova power supply puts out 34 joules and sells for $90 and they have some Whelen units for $130-160, but don’t list the energy output. They do list the power output as 60-90 watts. What’s really needed?? Can we somehow convert power output to energy output?
2. Do the strobe heads have to be matched somehow with the power from the power supply or can I just use any strobes I come across?
3. Van’s says RV-7/7A, RV-8/8A, RV-9/9A and RV-10 builders must use system 6. Why? Is it that the shape of the wingtips makes coverage inadequate without a strobe in the tail?
4. Van’s sells position light kits without strobes. I thought anti-collision lights were required for night flight. Am I wrong about this?
5. What do I really need to know to put a system together?
6. Wingtips vs. fuselage? Pros & cons of each? Which is less likely to create radio interference?
7. I like the idea of LED's instead, but it looks like further development is needed. Would LED's need a power supply?

Thanks for your help.
 
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I have the strobes n more system that has recently been touted.
I was flying the other evening alongside a friend with the Whelen's and asked #3 guy to compare our 2 systems from a distance. He said my strobes were about 60% as bright as the Whelen's. I suspected as much, because I noticed my planes twin with the Strobes n More seemed dimmer when I was trying to acquire him in the haze.

Next time I'll use the Whelens again.
 
Strobes

Personally...I don't think they work very well in terms of aiding recognition

I fitted them mainly cus everyone else does..But do they really do much?..I'm not so sure.

Frank
 
2 issues with Nova strobes sold by Strobes N' More

jthocker said:
I have the strobes n more system that has recently been touted.
I was flying the other evening alongside a friend with the Whelen's and asked #3 guy to compare our 2 systems from a distance. He said my strobes were about 60% as bright as the Whelen's. I suspected as much, because I noticed my planes twin with the Strobes n More seemed dimmer when I was trying to acquire him in the haze.

Next time I'll use the Whelens again.
Click to expand...

Jon,
Do you have Whelen strobe heads? If not, do you have the Whelen strobe lens placed over your Strobes N' More strobe bulbs (aka heads)? The Strobes N' More units do not come with any lens. The Whelen lens diverts most of the light into the horizontal plane, as specified by the FARs. Without a lens, more light is lost to the vertical plane.
Which Nova power supply do you have? (model number) Their less expensive ones only put out half the power of the more expensive units (which equal the Whelens).

Charlie Kuss
 
We recently had a question posted on this subject re. use of marine position lights. FWIW, this is an area that you need to think very carefully about if you actually intend to use your aircraft at night. Your position lights and strobes are as much or more for everyone else's benefit as they are yours. If you are not absolutely certain that your light system meets required standards for intensity, visibility, and coverage, please don't fly at night. Would you drive a car at night with somethings other than SAE/DOT standard head and tail lights?
Terry, CFI
RV9A N323TP
 
Try these Skybright storbes & lights, $329:


I cut the rear position light off and they fit in my wing tip just perfect. For the rudder bottom I used the light/strobe combo from Van's.

 
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I can't recall which power supply I have, but it's the one that was in a link I found on this sight over a year ago. No lens over the heads, so that explains alot right there. I had to buy a whelen tail strobe so alot of the savings was eaten up by having to spend over 150 bucks for that. Then the molex pins wee not compatible between the systems.
A scrounger could probably make an acceptable system from Strobes n More/Nova. Personally though, I will go Whelen if I ever build another plane.;)
 
Strobe heads need to have a Magnifying lens

jthocker said:
I can't recall which power supply I have, but it's the one that was in a link I found on this sight over a year ago. No lens over the heads, so that explains a lot right there. I had to buy a Whelen tail strobe so a lot of the savings was eaten up by having to spend over 150 bucks for that. Then the Molex pins wee not compatible between the systems.
A scrounger could probably make an acceptable system from Strobes n More/Nova. Personally though, I will go Whelen if I ever build another plane.;)
Click to expand...

Jon,
You can improve what you have by installing the Whelen lens (available through Vans or ACS) Part # LN A612 at Vans. You will also need the lens retaining plates (available from ACS) Part # A628.
So that others will know, please read the specs very carefully on any power supply. Often the current available is cut in half. For example, many Nova power supplies say that they will run 4 strobe heads (bulbs). When running 4 heads, power to each head is half of maximum rating. If you need two strobes, look for a 60 watt, 4 head model (like the SuperPac 904). I needed 3 strobes so I chose their top of the line 6 head model, the Nova SuperPac 906. This unit actually only produces top power when running up to 3 strobe heads, even though it's claimed to be a 6 strobe head power supply. Running additional heads simply causes the power supply to "share" power between to strobe heads.
Another issue with the Nova (and automotive Whelen) power supplies is that they are not weather proof, as are the aviation Whelen units. They need to be placed in a dry location or the buyer needs to seal the power supply case. (I did both). I hope this helps someone make an informed decision.
I can't argue with Jon's decision to go with a certified Whelen aviation strobe system. It's just to rich for my blood. I'm just a poor boy. :(
Charlie Kuss
 
I just checked, and I have the Pro series 606 Str. n Mr 60 watt pwr supply.
So maybe all I need is the Lens and retainer.
Looks like a comparable system might then be had for half the whelen price!


http://www.strobesnmore.com/strobes-n-39-more-pro-system-4.html

http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin...432-420&browse=lighting&product=a555/500light

http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin...-432-420&browse=lighting&product=strobe_parts

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/whelenstrobeparts1.php
 
Needed lens and retainer found on next page of link

jthocker said:
I just checked, and I have the Pro series 606 Str. n Mr 60 watt pwr supply.
So maybe all I need is the Lens and retainer.
Looks like a comparable system might then be had for half the Whelen price!

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/whelenstrobeparts1.php
Click to expand...

Jon,
Glad to hear that you can improve your system without buying the whole thing.
Two items to mention. The lens and retainer I mentioned in my previous post can be found here.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/whelenstrobeparts2.php

Jon's link above is one page before. When I purchased my lens several years ago, Vans price was nearly $10 cheaper than it is now, so I bought the lens from them. The price difference for the lens is only 50 cents between ACS and Vans now. Vans doesn't carry the retainer, so it's really cheaper just to get both parts from ACS, to save on shipping. You might want to call Vans in regards to the A628 retainer. They may now carry it, or would consider carrying it, if they perceive a demand for it. ACS part number for the lens is A612.

The second item is that Jon's Nova power supply will produce full power for a two strobe head system, but will be reduced to half power on two of the three strobes if used on a 3 strobe head system. This is because two of the strobe heads will be forced to "share" one discharge capacitor. If you plan on three strobes, get a 90 watt (or higher) 6 strobe system.

A nice feature of the Nova systems (I think the Whelen automotive systems also have this) is the ability to select different flash patterns and to reduce to intensity of the strobe flash. Reducing the intensity can come in handy while flying in or near clouds or at night. Reflected strobe flash is a bad thing.
Charlie Kuss
PS If anyone finds lower prices at another vendor, please post it to this thread.
 
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Whelen coverage chart

I believe Whelen publishes a chart that shows required visibility coverage swathes for strobes and nav lights, i.e. above/below/behind/ahead. With a RV-9, you may be able to get by with wingtip mounted combo nav/strobe lites (i.e. Whelen) if you have the tip extension. Alternatively, you may need both wingtip and tail strobe/nav combos.

As to power supplies/strobe units, the Strobes N More unit works great. I seem to recall it pulls 8A, and control circuit an additional amp or two (was on 1st RV6). Sure those specs on their site.

The other very important item is good quality shielded cables to the strobes with very good grounding of shield. Else radio RFI could result.
 
With some more research, I found that according to 'Lectric Bob, the FAA requires 20 Joules at each bulb.

If I get all my questions answered, I'll post a comprehensive discussion of what I learn.

I hope someone will address my original questions, one by one.
 
chaskuss said:
Jon,
Do you have Whelen strobe heads? If not, do you have the Whelen strobe lens placed over your Strobes N' More strobe bulbs (aka heads)? The Strobes N' More units do not come with any lens. The Whelen lens diverts most of the light into the horizontal plane, as specified by the FARs. Without a lens, more light is lost to the vertical plane.
Which Nova power supply do you have? (model number) Their less expensive ones only put out half the power of the more expensive units (which equal the Whelens).

Charlie Kuss
Click to expand...

My experience with the Whelen lens underneath the plexi on the wingtip of my RV-9A is that it lead to excessive heat buildup and cracking of the strobe tubes (both in the same place).

I have removed the quartz lens and rtv'd the strobe base in place. So far, so good.


Vern
 
Anyone researched the new Whelen Vertex Lights?

Has anyone researched the new Whelen Vertex Lights? I talked with a salesperson today for Fleet Safety about strobes, and I told him that I was going to use it on my RV7A that I am building. He recomended the new Vertex Lights. I was just wondering if anyone has any input on them. From what I understand they are fairly new on the market.

chaskuss said:
Jon,
Glad to hear that you can improve your system without buying the whole thing.
Two items to mention. The lens and retainer I mentioned in my previous post can be found here.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/whelenstrobeparts2.php

Jon's link above is one page before. When I purchased my lens several years ago, Vans price was nearly $10 cheaper than it is now, so I bought the lens from them. The price difference for the lens is only 50 cents between ACS and Vans now. Vans doesn't carry the retainer, so it's really cheaper just to get both parts from ACS, to save on shipping. You might want to call Vans in regards to the A628 retainer. They may now carry it, or would consider carrying it, if they perceive a demand for it. ACS part number for the lens is A612.

The second item is that Jon's Nova power supply will produce full power for a two strobe head system, but will be reduced to half power on two of the three strobes if used on a 3 strobe head system. This is because two of the strobe heads will be forced to "share" one discharge capacitor. If you plan on three strobes, get a 90 watt (or higher) 6 strobe system.

A nice feature of the Nova systems (I think the Whelen automotive systems also have this) is the ability to select different flash patterns and to reduce to intensity of the strobe flash. Reducing the intensity can come in handy while flying in or near clouds or at night. Reflected strobe flash is a bad thing.
Charlie Kuss
PS If anyone finds lower prices at another vendor, please post it to this thread.
Click to expand...
 
Has anyone researched the new Whelen Vertex Lights? I talked with a salesperson today for Fleet Safety about strobes, and I told him that I was going to use it on my RV7A that I am building. He recomended the new Vertex Lights. I was just wondering if anyone has any input on them. From what I understand they are fairly new on the market.
 
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