Capflyer

Well Known Member
Just seeing this:

RENO, Nev. (AP) - A small plane carrying aviation adventurer Steve Fossett has been missing since Monday night, federal officials said Tuesday.

Fossett took off in the single engine Bellanca at 8:45 a.m. Monday at a private airstrip on a ranch south of Smith Valley in western Nevada and didn't return as scheduled. A friend reported him missing, said Ian Gregor, a Federal Aviation Administration spokesman in Maryland.

"The Civil Air Patrol is looking for him. One problem is he doesn't appear to have filed a flight plan," Gregor told The Associated Press.

The search was being coordinated by the Air Force's Rescue Coordination Center in Langley, Va., Gregor said.

"They are working on some leads, but they don't know where he is right now," Gregor said.

In 2002, Fossett became the first person to fly around the world alone in a balloon. In two weeks, his balloon flew 19,428.6 miles around the Southern Hemisphere. The record came after five previous attempts?some of them spectacular and frightening failures.

Three years later, in March 2005, he became the first person to fly a plane solo around the world without refueling.

He and a co-pilot also claim to have set a world glider altitude record of 50,671 feet during a flight in August over the Andes Mountains.

Fossett, 63, of Beaver Creek, Colo., was inducted into the National Aviation Hall of Fame in July. He told a crowd gathered at the Dayton Convention Center in Ohio that he will continue flying.

"I'm hoping you didn't give me this award because you think my career is complete, because I'm not done," Fossett said.

Fossett said he plans to go to Argentina in November in an effort to break a glider record.
 
Hilton Ranch...

The Hilton Ranch that he left from is not on any of the aviation charts, but it?s position is well known.

Google earth to:-

38 d 36 m 40 s N
119 d 00 m 00 s W

...to check out the nice corporate jet size airstrip - you don?t think Baron H. actually drives there, do you... :)

Zoom out to see how empty that part of NV is, and full of rocks. If his ELT didn?t work correctly, they could be looking for weeks.

The articles don?t say if he was heading somewhere, or just going up for a local aerobatic trip... not very good details at this time.

...hoping for the best... he has done a lot for both gliding and general aviation.

gil A

One more reason to buy that 406/GPS PLB....
 
One of the stories I saw said he was scouting for a location for a land speed record attempt.
 
What was he doing?

Wounder why he was looking for a place to run a land speed attempt. Ain't the Bonneville Salt Flats the premier place to go fast on wheels, especially for setting records?

Wounder if he had a 406 Mhz ELT?

I would not be surprised if fellow millionaire (billionaire?) Richard Branson of Virgin gets involved in the search (he was on the news). They're buddies and been involved in record setting together for a long time, mostly in ballooning.

Their last collaboration was the plane used for the solo, un-refuled, around the world record flight, the Virgin Atlantic Global Flyer.

virgin_atlantic_global_flyer.jpg
 
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gmcjetpilot said:
Wounder why he was looking for a place to run a land speed attempt. Ain't the Bonneville Salt Flats the premier place to go fast on wheels, especially for setting records?

Because the Bonneville Salt Flats have become too "small" for the ultimate speeds. The current record holder used a desert dry lake near Gerlach, Nevada to go supersonic on the ground. Here is an article:

http://www.cnn.com/TECH/9710/15/brits.land.speed/

John Clark
RV8 N18U "Sunshine"
KSBA
 
Right on

John has it correct, I was at Bonneville this year, the track was so wet they didnt even have the long track layed out, and even if they did, the "long" track is too short for the jet powered vehicles.
 
Large dry lakes

Mike S said:
John has it correct, I was at Bonneville this year, the track was so wet they didnt even have the long track layed out, and even if they did, the "long" track is too short for the jet powered vehicles.
Yes... but the Gerlach dry lake is over 20 miles long.

How many miles are need for a supersonic drag strip? 10? 20?

There just aren't that many dry lakes that large in that corner of NV. They can all be seen with Google earth....

I wonder if he had a specific one in mind? Had to be within 2 hours of Citabria flight time from Hilton's ranch....

....still hoping for the best.... gil A
 
PLB

Its stating the obvious but once again proves ELT's just arn't reliable (of course we don't know if he had a 406 unit as George mentioned).

For right now it seems the engine going away should prompt the activation of the PLB as the first step.. In fact my Wife is briefed to do just that...and hold the thing up to the sky to try to get a GPS lock into the unit.

For solo XC flights I loop the cord of the plb thru the seat belt and leave on the PX seat.The idea is that the PLB may get thrown around but it will still probably work and hopefully if I have a few minutes of glide it may have transmitted my postion.

Like everyone I'm sure I really hope teve is found soon.

Frank
 
I also have a 406 MHz PLB

If needed within minutes SAR folks will know that I (by name) am in distress and exactly where I am. No need to search hundreds of square miles.
 
gmcjetpilot said:
Wounder why he was looking for a place to run a land speed attempt. Ain't the Bonneville Salt Flats the premier place to go fast on wheels, especially for setting records?
Actually, the Black Rock Desert north of Reno is the place to do that. That's the same place where Burning Man occurs, and the site of the 1997 Mach 1 land speed record. The lake bed is over 50 miles long.
 
406 ELT thoughts

I wonder out of interest if the 406 ELT's still use a G switch?

It seems to me that one of the larger failure modes is the G switch not working or the coax getting ripped off during the crash.

Seems to me that even if you do have a 406Hhz ELt the best thing is to manually activate it the moment you decide you have an emergency otherwise you run a similar risk of the thing not working after the crash.

Frank
 
Regarding why you'd go search in an airplane versus using Google Earth...you need to set down and look at surface textures and firmness if you're using a lakebed as a runway (or a race track, although I'm not an expert on land speed....). Some things still can't be done completely on the 'net!

I really hope he's out there sitting under the wing of that Citabria, maybe stuck in a muddy spot on a not-so-dry lake, and cursing the fact that he left his Sat Phone at the ranch (according to one news report I saw).

Fingers are always crossed for any missing aviator!

Paul
 
Googling...

Ironflight said:
Regarding why you'd go search in an airplane versus using Google Earth...you need to set down and look at surface textures and firmness if you're using a lakebed as a runway (or a race track, although I'm not an expert on land speed....). Some things still can't be done completely on the 'net!

I really hope he's out there sitting under the wing of that Citabria, maybe stuck in a muddy spot on a not-so-dry lake, and cursing the fact that he left his Sat Phone at the ranch (according to one news report I saw).

Fingers are always crossed for any missing aviator!

Paul
Paul... my comment was that there are only a few dry lake large enough for 700 mph runs. They can be seen with Google Earth.

It would seem that looking along a path to these few within a 2 hour Citabria radius would be productive. Size would rule out most dry lakes....

However, Sir Richard Branson disagrees with you... :D

http://today.reuters.com/news/artic...183054Z_01_N04419276_RTRUKOC_0_US-FOSSETT.xml

gil in Tucson
 
az_gila said:
Paul... my comment was that there are only a few dry lake large enough for 700 mph runs. They can be seen with Google Earth.

It would seem that looking along a path to these few within a 2 hour Citabria radius would be productive. Size would rule out most dry lakes....

However, Sir Richard Branson disagrees with you... :D

http://today.reuters.com/news/artic...183054Z_01_N04419276_RTRUKOC_0_US-FOSSETT.xml

gil in Tucson


Of course you're right Gil...I guess I didn't put in enough words! AFTER you've found all the possibilities with GoogleEarth, you might then want to go out and kick the dirt a bit is what I was thinking.....
 
Just read on CNN that he had a watch that would transmit a signal if he was lost, bad news if the signal was not activated as it could mean he is hurt and unable to activate the watch so someone could find him. I just hope there is some kind of miracle and he walks away from this in the end, i would like to see the good ending of this story not the usuall after missing for days.
 
Prayers for

Our Prayers with Steve and all searching. Hope he is found soon.

For those that have googled, did anyone notice the two balloons, one in flight and one on the road about a mile North of Hilton's Flying M Ranch runway on current Google Earth images for the area?

Hope the technology and all the effort produces positive results, soon.

John
Flying M Ranch (the Alabama one)
 
lorne green said:
Breitling's "Emergency"

121.5 Mz, Faux winding stem has a pull out "wire" acting as an antenae.
It's out of production.

About 5 years ago I was at a jewelry store and the very snobby woman behind the counter told me that I couldn't see it, stating that one had to produce a pilot's "license" just to have it pulled from the case. She said that this was an FAA law, however I'm sure this was an I don't want to waste my time with you "law".

I don't carry my certificate with me, and I soooo badly wanted to go back there with certificate in hand, wave it in that woman's face, and put my grubby hands all over that watch!

-John
Planning to build an RV....someday :rolleyes:
 
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ELT-like watch

Sounds interesting but a GPS-enabled PLB is going to do a lot more to get you recovered than any 121.5 MHz ELT.
 
jtrusso said:
About 5 years ago I was at a jewelry store and the very snobby woman behind the counter told me that I couldn't see it, stating that one had to produce a pilot's "license" just to have it pulled from the case. She said that this was an FAA law, however I'm sure this was an I don't want to waste my time with you "law".

I don't carry my certificate with me, and I soooo badly wanted to go back there with certificate in hand, wave it in that woman's face, and put my grubby hands all over that watch!

-John
Planning to build an RV....someday :rolleyes:


and of course a jewellry store is up to date with aviation regulations.
 
CIVIL AIR PATROL HAS C-130's??

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/06/fossett.missing/index.html

Quote from above article: A Nevada Civil Air Patrol C-130 found no sign of Fossett after combing the sprawling 600-square-mile search zone with a thermal imaging camera during a nighttime flight.

Obiviously a reporter in error. Too bad they don't expend this kind of energy and resources on ordinary folk like the RV-6 that went missing in the Guadalope mtns.
 
So what are we all thinking as possibilities here? Are they looking in the right places? Obviously it is hard to find an aircraft wreckage in some circumstances.

It seems like he just vanished... who knows... hoping for the best, though - obviously.
 
tobinbasford said:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/06/fossett.missing/index.html

Quote from above article: A Nevada Civil Air Patrol C-130 found no sign of Fossett after combing the sprawling 600-square-mile search zone with a thermal imaging camera during a nighttime flight.

Obiviously a reporter in error. Too bad they don't expend this kind of energy and resources on ordinary folk like the RV-6 that went missing in the Guadalope mtns.

I was thinkin' the same thing... so how rich do you have to be?
 
777Dave said:
I was thinkin' the same thing... so how rich do you have to be?


You have to be part of "the other America".

Remember when they called out half the U.S. Navy and the NOAA on JFK jr.
 
Maybe someone from the CAP can address this - I heard discussion along the same vein on NPR the other day.
The CAP rep on there said that the resources used are the same regardless of who is missing - it is just that when Joe Blow goes missing, it is not all over the news minute by minute and so we are not aware of the search that is in progress. It seemed to me from the thread at the time that the search efforts for the RVer lost in TX were pretty intense and time consuming...

T.
 
TShort said:
Maybe someone from the CAP can address this - I heard discussion along the same vein on NPR the other day.
The CAP rep on there said that the resources used are the same regardless of who is missing - it is just that when Joe Blow goes missing, it is not all over the news minute by minute and so we are not aware of the search that is in progress. It seemed to me from the thread at the time that the search efforts for the RVer lost in TX were pretty intense and time consuming...

T.

OK, first of all I am NOT the spokesperson for CAP, just a member.

Two weeks ago, we had a lost airplane with two onboard when it departed from an island in Lake Huron for the lower peninsula. We had the entire MI wing out looking for them, assisted by MI state police. That would have been about 8 airplanes typically. We were prepared to look for a week or more. The limiting factors are that we are volunteers and most of us cannot just take off for a week at a time from our day jobs and also that we only send up trained and qualified people and that limits the number of aircrews we can field. A ground team searching along the shoreline eventually found debris, and I believe the airplane has been recovered from the water.

I believe that if we had good reason to call on them we could have gotten MI National Guard air support, but after all, the most cost efficient thing to do is to use the CAP Cessnas - CAP Cessna costs about $110 an hour, an Army Blackhawk costs about $4500 an hour. In the Michigan situation, it is relatively easy for a ground team to get around on roads by car. I don't believe it is as easy in Nevada with large expanses of open land. By that same token, the C130 probably is a valid choice for the same reason while it probably would have been overkill and not useful for tree covered Michigan.

The point being that CAP will put all available aircrews and aircraft toward finding a lost aircraft. And that will probably mean all the aircraft of the state plus possibly some from adjacent states. Also, keep in mind that CAP is responsible for inland SAR, and anything going on at sea is a Coast Guard operation.

Oh, and keep in mind that for inland SAR it is ultimately an Air Force affair. The Air Force primarily uses CAP to do the searching but is not limited to CAP - the Air Force are the ones to decide if and when other forces need to be added.
 
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Fossett search called off but 6 to 8 other missing planes found

News: The main search has been basically suspended, but will be on standby if any more leads come in. The cost of the search was over 1/2 million. Link

The amazing story or stories to me is during their search for Fossett, 6 to 8 other previously unknown plane wreckage sites turned up. One may solve a missing pilot from 1964. The son of this missing pilot, now an adult, was a very small child in 1964 when his dad went missing in that exact area.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/13/fossett/index.html?eref=rss_topstories


This remains of another WWII aviator was found recently that went missing during a 1942 training flight over the Sierra Mountains. The airman's frozen body (yet identified) was found at 12,000 feet, only 100 feet from a fellow crew member that was found 2 years ago. Low snow pack from two years ago helped in the discovery. LINK, LINK2


Per the recent thread on how its a good idea to have all your gear with you in a survival vest:
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=21593

Just came across this on TV: http://www.scottevest.com/

They hold all kinds of stuff but with out the fisherman vest look. They look good. You can route wires so you can have your ipod ear buds in place and control it thru the vest. They make jackets with removable sleeves as well as pants with lots of hidden pockets with out the "cargo pant" look.
 
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Maybe someone from the CAP can address this - I heard discussion along the same vein on NPR the other day.
The CAP rep on there said that the resources used are the same regardless of who is missing - it is just that when Joe Blow goes missing, it is not all over the news minute by minute and so we are not aware of the search that is in progress. It seemed to me from the thread at the time that the search efforts for the RVer lost in TX were pretty intense and time consuming...

T.

Last Spring we had a pilot that went missing from my flying club. The 5 day search by CAP (myself included) encompassed 4 Wings which included 11 Maryland CAP aircraft, the Middle East Region Airvan, and numerous other aircraft from PA, WV, and VA. From what we were told later it was one of the biggest use of CAP aircraft for a SAR in CAP history. If anything, I'm surprised that NV Wing didn't call in for more resources.

Mike R.
 
.............They hold all kinds of stuff but with out the fisherman vest look. They look good. ....

yep, looks good if you're posing for GQ magazine. But for flying, it looks cut too long in the torso. fill the pockets and it will be riding up when you're sitting in the plane. Fisherman style vest are usually cut short and work good sitting. Also I'm cheap, so the $130 is about $100 more than I paid. YMMV
 
Cheap? Please

yep, looks good if you're posing for GQ magazine. But for flying, it looks cut too long in the torso. fill the pockets and it will be riding up when you're sitting in the plane. Fisherman style vest are usually cut short and work good sitting. Also I'm cheap, so the $130 is about $100 more than I paid. YMMV
ha ha I am cheap to. Good point. But it looks pretty good but price is a little steep. I do like the way iPod wires and controls are concealed.