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RV-8 Mike

I'm New Here
Hi all, just joined the group, and hoping that I can return the favor someday by answering someone's question about their build. New RV-8 builder, living in Amesbury, MA with wife and kids...I have the empennage kit in my basement, and am currently building the HS.

Sorry for being somewhat long-winded right off, but I want to make sure I get this correct.

I'm working on riveting the front and rear spar on the HS for my RV-8 project. I'm using a pneumatic squeezer on the rivets. The rivets called out for the front spar to HS-810-1, and HS-814-1 are AN470AD4-6, and seem too long after they're squeezed. I squeeze them until the diameter gauge just fits over the shop head, but the squeezed length/height on the shop head is still too long. I'm looking for a squeezed height/length of 1/2 of 0.125", or 0.625 on the shop head, and I'm getting 0.090" with the proper shop head diameter. Same issue with the rear spar rivets that hold the hinge brackets in place(HS-413PP, and HS-412PP). Shorter rivets don't seem to have enough length to do the job in these locations.

The rivets look good otherwise, just too long/tall on the shop head side. Should I maintain the shop head diameter or length after squeezing.

Thanks for the help,
Mike
 
Fill it up

IIRC, the shop head should fill the gauge, not just slipping the gauge over. Someone will certainly correct me if I'm wrong.

Likely they are just right, maybe sqeeze them a little more, you will get your .625 or really close and it'll fill the gauge.
 
What gauges are you using? Do you have a copy of _Standard Aircraft Handbook_ ? It lists the min and max for 1/8 rivets as:

Upset diameter: 7/32" max, 11/64" min.
Upset heigth : 5/64" max, 3/64 min.

Personaly, I would shoot for between 1.3 to 1.5D and if the height was a little tall, not worry about it.
 
The shop head fills the diameter gauge that I have. It's a bent aluminum gauge with a hole in one end and an open ended slot at the other to check the head height.

I don't have the handbook, but will have it soon. Thanks for the info on the 1/8" rivets. I'm going to check my work, and squeeze them into the range you've provided.

Mike
 
I noticed a similar thing with my vertical stabilizer. Before setting the rivet, the exposed rivet shank would be a little bit more than 1.5D, but the next smaller rivet size down (that was supplied with the kit) would be too short. Notice that for the AD3 rivets there are half-sizes, but not for the AD4's. Better slightly too long than slightly too short I'd think. Or if it really bothers you, you can get a rivet cutter for about $33.

Take the above with a grain of salt, as I'm a n00b as well. ;-)
 
If the shophead sets squarely, there is no such thing as shophead that is "too long" or "too tall." As long as the shop heads are at least the milspec diamater and at least the milspec height, anything beyond that is just fine.

In general, though, save yourself many headaches in the rest of your build... buy a $10-15 rivet cutter. In the vast majority of cases, the only rivets I've ever had that set poorly were because I used too long of a rivet.

One thing I'd add for those just starting... don't assume Van's callouts are correct. Always judge for yourself. At the same time, take heed of Van's comments in the plans that they sometimes choose the smaller rather than the longer rivet because smaller is easier to set well, and results in a more than adequate fastener. (Again, though, and better yet, just buy a rivet cutter. I waited until I got to my fuselage and then wondered why it had taken me so long!)

Hope this helps. Good luck.
 
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Rivet Guages

Mike,
Your rivets should be fine if you have a snug fit in the guage and the shop head height is okay.

Having said that, the rivet guages sold by Avery, Cleaveland, and others are somewhat misleading since they are set for a 'perfect' rivet vs. an acceptable rivet as defined by military specs.

See http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?p=165571&highlight=rivet+guage#post165571 for a discussion on this same topic.

Gil Alexander has a link in this thread to the MILSPEC for rivets.

I found most of the rivet callouts for the emp. kit to be fine...I changed to a different size in only a couple of instances on the skin where I wanted a slightly longer rivet.

Good luck with your project!

Mike
 
smiller said:
Better slightly too long than slightly too short I'd think.
Click to expand...
This would seem to make sense, but might not always be the case. Consider that the longer the rivet, the better the chance of having it hobnail over on you if your technique with the bucking bar isn't great. Now you have to drill out that rivet, which can sometimes make matters even worse, again if your technique isn't great.

When the perfect rivet size is between two sizes, I always go to the shorter rivet. Some have mentioned rivet cutters, but I never used one in building my 6, so I don't think they're really necessary.
 
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